Raising and caring for frogs.

[Chiral]

Okay I've always loved frogs and used to spend countless days as a kid collecting tadpoles and watching them, then returning them to the beautiful once clean creek near my house eons ago, sooooo I have a tank and heat mat for starters and a lid for the tank with flouro's.

Has anyone here had any experience with raising and keeping frogs in a controlled environment.

I'm look for tips and advice on any aspect of keeping them ie;

type of flooring

tempertaures

water and purification

food source

plant life inside the tank

how long do they live for

is it possible to get 2 to breed

cleaning the inside etc...keeping them happy and not subject them to any chems or toxic air etc.

thanks froggers as I'm looking for a couple of frogs now to start my little mini eco-system.

thanks Monk for inspiring me to start this lil project...

[Chiral]

MUTHERFUCKING GODDAMIT NANNY STATE BITCHES>>>>in Australia it is actually very difficult to obtain an amphibian license, and people who keep frogs without such a license can get fined heavily for it.

[Distracted]

I've tried breeding frogs from tadpoles I got as a kid..

Couldn't get the frogs to eat in the end though and they died

[TheFriendlyPlanter]

I made a frog-pond out of an old bath tub. I filled one end with large rocks and the other with rushes and surrounded the whole thing with thick plants. Frogs just showed up in a matter of days and I often hear them croaking away at night which is nice. Dragonflies love it too.

The focus of a frog-pond is to provide them with actual homes to live permanently (amongst the rocks n reeds)which is often lacking in a regular fish-pond. I basically made mine for free and I'm about to make a couple smaller versions in large pots.

Frogs are great insect control especially on moths n roaches! And building a frog pond for free is really fun and satisfying

[Chiral]

Obtaining an amphibian keepers license

Fuck man it's getting to be a serious drag in the country when it comes to freedom erosion...must all my cherished hobbies involving nature or wildlife be illegal...?

what a next you must have a license to feed birds or ride a pushbike.

so sick of this shit, so now ya gotta pay the greedy state gov't for the privilege of caring for and raising probably once of the most precious/delicate types of animals on earth...they should fucking pay us for actually keeping frogs and encouraging preservation of species...god knows there are no clean creeks or even a single frog or taddy for miles in the ghetto where I live...plenty of rubbish and oil slicks in the local water catchments though.

[mac]

type of flooring (depends on species for frog climbing burrowing etc) washed sand or pebbles

temperatures (again depends on species for frog) the kids have burrowing frogs that sorta hibernate during the colder months

water and purification (its best to have a removable tray so you can change water)

food source (crickets if bought from pet store you get a packet of Gutload (reptile nutrients) to feed insects

plant life inside the tank (whatevers in their natural habitat or plants that like high humidity & are not prone to rot )

how long do they live for (my kids have had their burrowing frogs for over 3 years)

is it possible to get 2 to breed (im sure it is may again may have to look at what species breed easily in captivity)

cleaning the inside etc...keeping them happy and not subject them to any chems or toxic air etc (as long as the water is free from tannins from bark etc we usually clean the tank at any sign of bad smell or discoloration just using rainwater)

only the basics but should give you some idea

Oh & green tree frogs are noisy bastards especially when it rains they will keep you awake at night

Edited May 10, 2010 by mac

[incognito]

and people who keep frogs without such a license can get fined heavily for it.

GOOD.

alot of frogs are endangered and the last thing they need are people who want a 'pet' taking them from NATURE only to kill them within a few weeks. its good theres a few hurdles to jump so that at least the people that do take the trouble to obtain the license will be competent enough to have happy little froggies, and most of all are not keepin rare and endangered ones.

why not, like has been mentioned, create a frog friendly pond in your backyard? would look totally cool amongst the ethno plants! as well as creating an ambient soundtrack at night! would be relatively esy to do compared with maintaining something indoors, which is where froggies really shouldnt be anyhoo!! call me a hippy, but so not a fan of tanks and cages.

good info here from the enemy fucking state government: http://www.environment.gov.au/education/publications/frogpond.html

[fishstix]

As a kid I used to have a drain that didn't flow but collected water and the frogs loved it! I would often collect the tadpoles, keep them in a tank and feed them fish flakes which they seemed to like, but I also collected water from the spot often in case there was anything in their diet I was missing. I also had a rock or the like half in, half out of the water for when they started to grow legs. When they turned into frogs, I would put them back and wait for the next eggs to hatch. It wasn't long before if was hard to sleep on summer nights because the frogs were so loud!

Anyway, although it is very rewarding raising and keeping tadpoles/frogs, the best way I would think is to set up a small pond in your backyard. Get the water settled, put in some very small fish, a few water plants and within a couple of months you will have your own self contained pond. This is what my girlfriends parents have done and it has worked very well. The bottom is covered in black workmans plastic. It also probably wouldn't hurt to have a small filter in there if the pond isn't very big. This way, you could collect the tadpoles, raise them inside and release them when they are bigger. If anyone finds you with them and tries to charge you, you can claim on a frog regeneration program! haha. Oh, and make sure the pond is in part shade, you don't want to water getting over heated.

[Amazonian]

Has anyone here had any experience with raising and keeping frogs in a controlled environment.

 

What species were you hoping to keep? What size is the tank that you have ? Green tree frogs (Litoria caerulea ) are very hardy frogs to maintain in captivity.Once adult ,provided you have kept them under the right conditions,are easy to get to spawn.Frogs are huge in the pet trade now and any pet shop that sells herps' and frogs usually carry the food source required for that animal. Crickets and woodies (cock roaches) are sold for food but get quite expensive. I suggest you breed your own 'roaches as green tree frogs are very greedy .As for heating , a heat mat will work ok however,if there is a large water area in the vivarium ,you will get a lot of condensation and then bacteria. Make sure that the lid of the enclosure has a full mesh lid to reduce the amount of condensation and to allow uv through which you will be providing .Palm peat is a good substrate . Never use potting mix. Monsteria is a good sturdy plant for vivariums. Peace lilies grow well too. The plants depend on the lighting that you provide. A good enclosure has a 25mm hole drilled into the bottom to allow drainage.I don't use any filtration in my enclosures but if you want it for aesthetic purposes then that will be fine. The frogs frequently defecate in the water and you will find that you will need to do water changes frequently. A temperature range for green tree frogs is from around 18 deg' Celsius to like 32 deg' Celsius. I don't find the temperatures crucial but it depends on your night time lows. Frogs can suffer from calcium deficiencies if calcium is not added to their diet occasionally and they are not given uv to convert this calcium. This is just a quick ,rough run down on a few of the aspects of keeping frogs. There are stacks of web sites with ideas etc... on keeping frogs so you wont have any trouble finding information. Just a warning, when the frogs mature, the males can be SO noisy and call all night. At first it is great, what a thrill but after about 4 nights of this, you will have to get some ear plugs. There is a web site www.herpshop.com.au that sell a lot of the paraphernalia relating to keeping herps' and frogs. There is a section there called the HERP TRADER, you might be able to buy some frogs from that site. Green tree frogs do require a wildlife license. If there was any thing in particular that you wanted to know, I might be able to help.

[Magicdirt]

What's next the frog police ?

How much would it cost to bust someone for frogs ?

Imagine going to gaol for having frogs in your backyard.

I had an ant farm as a kid, I wonder if they've banned them too.

It's getting to a stage where we are all being treated like school kiddies in this country.

[Amazonian]

Its when the cops (wildlife department) come to bust you for a few illeagal frogs and find other 'STUFF' . Then you gotta worry.

[Chiral]

I do have an incredibly cool backyard that lends it's self to a myriad of wildlife at times, honestly feels like eden out there sometimes with butterflys, spiders, lizards and heaps of birds and bugs, so I'm almost thinking it's going to be harder but prolly more value to try and create an outdoor setting for them, i have the perfect spot to place a pond near an overhanging brug and it's quite sheltered.

What are frogs natural enemies..?

I don't wanna try and create a nice environment for them and they disappear to due to some predator, also don't want them escaping and fucking off somewhere, although there really wouldn't be anything outside my fence they could handle.

I don't care about frog noise to be honest, in fact I like to hear to crickets and frogs at night, couldn't be any fucking worse than jumbo jets every 5 mins 25 feet above my head 7 days a week, or the feral cats fighting with each other on my roof every night..oh and don't get me started on the possums hissing and spitting at the cats then scratching inside my roof cavity for hours.

Yeah the tank thing is a little unnatural already the more i think, perhaps it could be used to raise other smaller tiny frogs or juveniles etc..

Doesn't having fish in a pond pollute the pond too much for frogs enjoyment and give you something else to clean regularly..?

keep the advice coming I'm loving it, oh haven't decided on particular species I'm still researching their habitat and health maintenace before even consider which ones.

Thing what shits me about the licence to keep is that I'm obviously not going to take from the wild nor release feral frogs into the wild, plus it's another cost that I could damn well do without to be honest..greedy fucks could have made it cheaper at least...so now I have to have a fishing licence and frog licence..boo hiss.

[Chiral]

I made a frog-pond out of an old bath tub. I filled one end with large rocks and the other with rushes and surrounded the whole thing with thick plants. Frogs just showed up in a matter of days and I often hear them croaking away at night which is nice. Dragonflies love it too.

The focus of a frog-pond is to provide them with actual homes to live permanently (amongst the rocks n reeds)which is often lacking in a regular fish-pond. I basically made mine for free and I'm about to make a couple smaller versions in large pots.

Frogs are great insect control especially on moths n roaches! And building a frog pond for free is really fun and satisfying

 

Now that's totally cool and well thought out ..kudos man you got me with the bathtub and reeds thang..simple, almost free, and all it really takes is a little labor and it's good to go.

cheers man...got any pics of your set up..?

[Amazonian]

frogs and tadpoles enemies are introduced fish. Also ,you dont want to have a pond under a tree. When it rains, all the residue drops into the pond .Leaves and bark also pollute the water when they drop in. You can encourage native frogs to visit your pond by making it frog freindly. Have hollow logs and that around the pond to allow the frogs to hide during the day. Discard some fruit scraps near there to encourage insects for the frogs to feed on. There is a motto... "build it , and they will come!"

[Torsten]

I'm with incognito on this one. Most people wouldn't know a rare frog from a common one and could easily contribute to the demise of a fragile species.

The best place to keep frogs is in a protected outdoor pond and I am really glad this thread is heading that way.

We try to attract frogs to the garden and nursery cos for every frog there is a fuckload less insects to worry about. The worst predators are probably cats and some small dogs. Dogs are not patient or agile, so as long as you have a large enough body of water and plenty of nooks and crannies then the dog has no hope. Cats are a bigger problem cos they are patient and much better hunters.

Natural predators like kookaburras and other birds are best limited by providing good hiding places and a very uneven surface. eg a couple of stone/rock pillars or stumps can really screw with the landing approach of predator birds.

Most important of all are plants. Reedy things like acorus, cumbungi, and ribbon weed in the water, and lomandra or normal leafy plants overhanging the edge will prvide good huting ground for the frogs while keepign them well protected. Uneven rockwall edges are great for them to sit with their body in the water while the face is in the air, which seems to be particularly important [or at least their favourite pose] as juveniles.

If you are in cane toad areas then design your pond well off the ground so that the toads can't hop into it. They will eat all your tadpoles. Mind you, we have one pond the toads can get into and it seems the treefrog tadpoles are more voracious than the 'toadpoles' as the little green buggers always get the upper hand eventually.

Floating plants are also great as these obscure the view into the water and make it harder for cats to 'fish'. Frogs will be able to sit in the middle of the pond [ie far from the dangerous edges] and drop into the water at any time.

Don't handle frogs as their skin is very sensitive. The oils from your 'clean' hands can cause a slow and painful death.

We've got frogs everywhere now. Before we got rodent proof screens they used to jump in through the windows at night and make their home in the kitchen and bathroom. We have a rarely used spare toilet and there are a few froggies living under the rim.

[Chiral]

nice...I have the feral cat situation pretty much under control the last 6 months, they know I am their sworn enemy and simply don't even risk coming into my yard anymore, I have an excellent slingshot that gets plenty of pratice, the fuckers are always climbing the trees next door and trying to kill birds, when they are up in the branches I'm able to get good clear shots at them, so even now they are timid about going up the trees if they smell me around....plus finally after 2 years the neighbor has had a group of strong men come and cut down a huge diseased peach tree that hung over into my yard, and they finally eliminated the lanatana..

So i now have all this extra light and air in my yard and even less cats.

So no putting their pond under the leaves of an ethno you say...?

I'm wondering though where I live is pretty much ghetto and I'm not sure I could attract frogs to my yard cause it's just shit and roads and cats everywhere...I'd be blown away if they did come naturally to be honest as that would be wonderful.

Do all frogs in OZ go into dormant mode over winter or not..just some..?

Is this time of year not a good time to actually get them in but better used preparing the area for them for the warmer months..?

cheers guys keep it comin.

[FancyPants]

I get these little dudes in the palm trees behind my back verandah. From what I've read they're Peron's Tree Frog (littoria peronii), it's hard to tell from the few photos I've managed but they have really vivid green spots on them. I love frogs and think they're really beautiful. I third you do the old backyard pond job. Then you can grow some nyphaea caerulaea, too. At an old place we lived at we had a bathtub pond with goldfish and tadpoles in there - the little green tree frogs themselves lived in the plants and back windows. It went really green and murky but they all thrived. The tub was under a downpipe so the water got movement and aeration. Had to put chickenwire over it so the cat didn't eat the fish though.

There was one that was living in my back toilet while nobody had been using it for a while. Unfortunately a flatmate's boyfriend flushed the poor wee thing

These guys make a weird chirping sound which is really cool. Unfortunately I only hear them a lot when there's been heaps of rain.

[Amazonian]

Some species of frogs only breed in Autumn and winter. You still might be suprised at what might end up in your pond. Build it now ,get it established for future visitors. I used to get old bath tubs from the tip or when the council does hard rubbish . ( every one puts their crap that they dont want any more on their nature strip and the counsil takes it to the tip.( great finds on those days)).

[Chiral]

The thin, porous skin of frogs and tadpoles makes them sensitive creatures. Through this skin, they absorb chemicals from the air and water. For this reason, frogs are good indicators of environmental damage.

If you hear lots of frogs in an area, it means that the local environment is likely to be unspoiled. However, in areas where water or air pollution has occurred, the local frog community will be affected and there are likely to be very few frogs

This kinda concerns me if I have to introduce frogs to my yard and the air quality is bad, am I risking their lives over and over as they simply wouldn't survive...or if I can get the very local micro climate close to being clean, by using plants clean water for them would they survive..?

[Chiral]

how cool is that image...

Edited May 10, 2010 by Chiral

[Amazonian]

It sound like you live near a heap of factories with masses of chimneys bellowing smoke 24/7 ? Frogs are pretty tough little buggers. Make your enviroment habitable and they will survive.

[occidentalis]

The best place to keep frogs is in a protected outdoor pond and I am really glad this thread is heading that way.

 

I will just add to this that it is important to distinguish between local native frogs which may be 'kept' outdoors simply by creating an attractive environment for them and allowing them to come and stay if they like, and 'pet' frogs such as Litoria caerulea which may not be native to the area you are in and should only be kept in an indoor enclosure under license.

I love frogs too .

[occidentalis]

[mauve]

I love the singing of frogs, it reminds me of indonesian gamelan music...

A good plant for purifying the water is the vetiver (Chrysopogon zizanioides) it smells good and deters mosquitoes.

I've heard cats hate the smell of oranges, maybe you can drop some orange essential oil in cups around your property or disseminate orange peels to keep them at bay.

I remember how beautiful were the toads in the Amazon forest and how weird it was, when i came back in Europe, to see those same toads bored to death in little terrariums...

[Chiral]

What do I do if I can't find bugs small enough for my tiny frog?

For those unable to get super tiny crickets to feed their tiny tree-frogs, one visitor wrote with this great advice:

"My daughter went camping and brought home a couple tiny tree frogs not more that 1/2 inch long each. We were unable to buy crickets in our area that were small enough for them to feed on.

What we found out (actually my wife thought about it) was that we had plenty of food for them in our own back yard. We found it on our rose bushes ... aphids! The frogs seem to love them, and they've been doing just fine!"

One added note though: it probably wouldn't hurt to dust the aphids with some vitamin powder every now and then!

Now that's cool.

Edited May 10, 2010 by Chiral