Life, science, being "a bit different" and your personal takes?

[Alchemica]

I'm keen to hear how anyone has managed to re-kindle a genuine desire for life, something that so many people seem to think is such a "wonderful blessing", that isn't centered on drugs. I'm pretty sure I got the "mad scientist" gene... never ending curiousity and pleasure from novelty but when everything in my life has always been about "the science", is there a way out and is it something people here have regretted not taking the opportunity to try and take?

Sure, finding a partner would add a reason to want to be alive and animals are great, but I've never really managed to lure much in that way - very much socially mal-evolved. Almost at the point where my ideal partner could be a vial of oxytocin, which surely isn't something my parents are going to be proud of.

If anyone has been in a similar situation, what did you do? Leave the "differentness" to try and manifest in as many positive and productive ways as possible and use it to your creative advantage, or do a dash-and-run into a life that most might see as more "normal"? I sort of see myself heading to become an odd chemistry person (everyone surely remembers that there's always some wacky chemistry guy institutionalised with some academic organisation if you look hard enough) but I'd like to hear some real life experiences while I'm still a bit plastic to new ideas. Ex-mad scientists, I'd love to hear a bit about how you got into a socially and morally acceptable existence and where it took you in your life.

Any input is much appreciated!

[ref1ect1ons]

Although we a different, it is similar in that I am separated by way of similar curse.

It is as if people cannot communicate (ie. I cannot communicate) with their unusual minds/personalities/natures. I understand that being away from life itself, other people, can make life seem dead sometimes. Perhaps a pet or plants will help but you already said this. I personally can easily understand animals. At times meditation and being aware of such feelings can bring some relief but it will never bridge the gap completely.

Relationships don't help, they make me feel more alone and misunderstood most of the time. I cannot connect with a partner who is not open to my subtle communication channels. Perhaps you are right in saying that as we age it will become more impossible, but maybe it will go the other way as I am still quite young and suspect that much of the problem is anchored in young people's beliefs about how others should be.

Mary Jane is by far preferrable to any interaction with another at this point, and being alone, not always high, allows me to focus on things I seem obsessed with discovering. I often live in a parallel world full of my own odd interest and innate motivations. Motivations that are a part of my nature and would not change even if it would lessen the burden of this separation.

I regret also that I haven't given some a chance to see me, or openned up to them.

However do not become normal, do not conform, be yourself and be patient is all I would say. The truth will come into being and I think the truth holds alot more for me and you, an abundance and a connection is what love and the truth are about.

Just some of my thoughts after reading, may not reflect you actual question.

[Alchemica]

Thanks ref1ect1ons, good to hear from you.

[paradox]

hey alchemica i don't have that much input... & i don't really know how to put it but i know in my own experience that too much science can make life very dry... what i'm saying is that with all the wonder of discovery & the intellectual satisfaction of understanding the mechanics of things that science provides... if we see life purely in terms of what can be measured & varified by scientific method then IMO we are limiting ourselves very much & could be sucking the mystery & subtle beauty out of life.

my point is that IMO the world, the universe & ourselves are infinitely more complex & mysterious than we would ever have time to scientifically varify. science has barely begun to scratch the surface of finding answers to the infinitude of unknown in the universe. this is the wonder of what makes science so interesting, the fact that there is still so much to discover & there will be for eternity... but.. if our entire world view is based purely on what has been tested & agreed on as scientific fact then i believe we are missing a large part of the picture. this is so hard to put into words, but to me a true scientist is an inquisitive open minded skeptic who is dedicated to scientific method who at the same time has a healthy acknowledgment of the utterly infinite & profound mystery which surrounds us & of which we are.

IMO a wise person knows how to separate intellectual knowledge & scientific understanding from direct experience through the senses & a sense of the subtle nature of intuition & emotion & this person would know how to separate the two aspects of human knowledge & use them accordingly.

science is an incredible tool & an indispensable part of our whole understanding of ourselves & the world, however if the intellectual understanding which science provides for us is not balanced with direct experience of our unverifiable subtle senses & acknowledgment & respect for the profoundly beautiful & infinite mystery of nature then IMO you are getting a lopsided perspective on things...

...so hard to put into words, i'm not sure if what i'm saying makes any sense, i just think it's easy to suck the mystery out of life when we construct very rigid scientific method based reality structures... of course science always should be our main point of reference in our intellectual understanding but if we fail to take into account the infinity that science will never has time to explain then life becomes shit boring & we get depressed...

i'm not sure if this is at all relevant to you alchemica & i wish i could put it in better terms so it made more sense but thats my 2 cents, take it or leave it

[-YT-]

its all good alchemica bro you know you have a home with us freaks

Always had a fascination with plants bordering on the obssesive to the point where i genuinely get excited not just with ethnos but everything, most ppl i have found find that weird i guess, its one of the things i can truely see wonder and awe in most other "normal" stuff interests me very little as i see no inherent value but thats just me

the most enjoyable times i have/had is when i spend time with the ethno crew talking, laughing and appreciating each other for who and what we are.

Im sure there is a way out if you really want one and are willing to change yourself, not for lack of trying ive tried to make a go at being "normal" working a full time job letting it suck my time and ultimately my smiles away, had a go at falling in love hahaha didnt work out and in the end all i did was hurt a good friend. not that i didnt learn a lot from those experiences.

Suppose im still aiming at that socially and morally acceptable existence altho given time the social mores will no doubt change hands so maybe i should just wait

[Yawning Man]

Alchemica i think i have reached a sort of Nirvana or higher state just in my normal waking life. These past few days have been ecstatic! I can only associate it with gardening which serves as meditation for me. All i do is think.

Think about my connection with this earth, my connection with my plants, it's all really overwhelming to the point i feel like i could cry from happiness. I'm so lucky to realise that there is nothing negative in life. The onlt thing that exists is love. Sounds cliche but fuck it's true.

But yeah, it's hard having these very left of center ideals and wanting to discuss them with your friends, family and work mates etc, but holding back because they will just shrug them off as weird. But thats ok. Alch, if your love of science/chemistry/plants is what challenges you to evolve your ideas and reignite the flame that was always there keep it up man. You'll only serve to make yourself happy. And when you do it rubs off on people and things work themselves out.

Best of luck brother.

cheers

[faustus]

i feel your struggle alchemica!

[Alchemica]

Thanks again for all the input, some good ideas so far to stew over (and over-analyse). YT, hopefully you can get back to some of the plant meets when you next get the chance!

[ThunderIdeal]

i reckon if you want change in your life, it tends to happen over long periods of time.

human contact is good. it's so good to have a few people that enjoy your company, and whose company you enjoy.

it seems stupid but i wonder if it would help to watch 'the big bang theory', i think there are three seasons now and they get better progressively. it's about four socially-inept scientists and their hilarious antics. maybe it will put some things in perspective, at the very least it will show you that other people struggle with the same problems.

i guess, alchemica, that you have experienced things that are well outside of normal. it can be hard to 'find your feet' when you intentionally launch your mind out of a cannon. maybe it is time to slow down with the extreme stuff and do some of the ordinary things that people do. all it really takes is practise, and becoming familiar with the territory. even if you get very little enjoyment out of interacting at first, you are building connections, and the more you connect with somebody the more honest and interesting future interactions will be, because both parties know the other will not punish them for putting something out there.

[Fenris]

It is enough of a struggle just trying to "be" without trying to conform to what others think is more suitable. I gave up trying to fit in or be more normal and embraced my inner geek and inner hippy. Sadly the hippys think I am far to normal and the science geeks think I am far to hippy. I revel in my eccentricities but have realised that they are probably the biggest hurdle to ever finding a partner.

I think this place is awesome and have made some good friends through my interests here.

Be who you are and come what may.

Lets all sing along; Enjoy.

 

And for that bottle of Oxytocin

http://www.love-scent.com/product_info.php/p/liquid-trust-pheromones/products_id/108?osCsid=19525b6efdb244fe3ee305960853c5e3

[MindExpansion]

Sadly the hippys think I am far to normal and the science geeks think I am far to hippy

hah, amen.

Just based on my experience so far, and I add that I am but a young'n, but the problem might come from conflict of the views of those around you, who are probably mostly science minded, vs your own views particularly when it comes to spirituality, substances and the other things that the people you are surrounded by in day to day life may not share your views on.

Totally agree that socialising more should eventually lead you to find the right people who share your views and accept both the scientist in you, and the other aspects of your personality, without being critical of either

As far as trying to be 'normal' goes... it seems like those who fit that bill still face the same feelings of anxiety and insecurity and all that jazz that you or I might now for feeling outside the 'normal', they just have different reasons, i.e always trying to fit in gets tiring and painstaking.

That said since cutting down my intake of the bits and pieces, and being more social I've actually managed to become more comfortable with acting myself regardless of the reactions of those around me because seeing them all struggle to fit in made me realise its not worth the hastle. Also, getting social wasn't easy for me to start either, but got easier the more i did it and the more comfortable i got with who i was and with the fact that there is NO 'normal', there is a majority mould which most people fit in most ways, but even then everyone is an individual, so some might not fit that mould as much as others.

So thats my ranting and in summary: less drugs, more socialising should make you more comfortable with being who you are, even if that isn't the majority 'normal'.

Peace and luck man, ain't easy to find our place ey?

[Micromegas]

Follow the path you have been given and do your best with it. It can be a winding path but it leads forward. Be proud of and humble about who you are. Don't compromise on your values if you know them; never sell yourself short. Cultivate inner strength. Be proud to be particular. Move, think, and listen. Strengthen first the relationships with those who are important to you and work out from there. Realise that most people are not paying attention closely enough to even notice or care about your insecurities and eccentricities; most who do notice will appreciate or discuss them and be considerate. Be aware of what you like and dislike and what is good for your body and mind. Do not allow fear to be the dominant force in your decisions; allow will and desire to be predominant. Be intentful when you journey into other spaces. Relax and smile; take the hard lessons with gratitude, they are for you alone. Love yourself first; all other loves comes after. Learn to like who you are. Study and seek application. Use your imagination and insight from other worlds in this world; gather strength there for your journey here; make the connection solid. Don't listen to those who speak cruelly or without care. Takes lessons from nature. And be patient. Maturity comes slowly and with experience and through difficulty and adventure. Appreciate the ebb and flow of life; it is not always fun and buoyant. To understand oneself takes time; a whole life's worth of time. I know your sincerity; continue to be mindful and you will develop into yourself. Peace, brother.

Edited January 26, 2010 by Micromegas

[Alchemica]

Cheers for all the other replies, appreciate the input!

[Ladymalcontent]

It is enough of a struggle just trying to "be" without trying to conform to what others think is more suitable. I gave up trying to fit in or be more normal and embraced my inner geek and inner hippy. Sadly the hippys think I am far to normal and the science geeks think I am far to hippy. I revel in my eccentricities but have realised that they are probably the biggest hurdle to ever finding a partner.

I think this place is awesome and have made some good friends through my interests here.

Be who you are and come what may.

Lets all sing along; Enjoy.

 

And for that bottle of Oxytocin

http://www.love-scent.com/product_info.php/p/liquid-trust-pheromones/products_id/108?osCsid=19525b6efdb244fe3ee305960853c5e3

 

I hear ya there. Sometimes I feel like a square peg in a round hole

[The Dude]

times like these... i realise through music and art that there were always times like these, we all share this common ground that shifts like tectonic plates beneath us.. that is our commonality, that we are all so different.

"I'm not cut from the same mould! I don't read from the same old story, not cut from the same mould, don't know who you think i should be" - Pennywise

"We were different, just like all the other kids!" - Bad Religion

...and i suppose every other punk rock band before the movement became appropriated by the status quo and became the new normal. Bloody mass movements always corrupt the genuine revolutionary spirit of the underground and marketing sells it to them. Never listen to marketing trends, never try to be normal.

stay unique, be ahead of the curve, you will notice that everybody always copies originality.

Edited February 1, 2010 by The Dude

[drugo]

I've got a lot out of this thread.

I agree with Xodarap, At the end of Charles Darwin's life, the old geizza said that constantly mapping [explaining] the empirical world caused the world to appear uglier. You could imagine a face turning from angel into monster, complements a la triptamine, as like Darwin's process of disenchantment captured in three seconds.

I like to see science as a section, a sub category, of what we might call magic, or collapse both into a broader neologism. It is a the reduction of inquiry into the material universe checking out process and some speculative meaning. But, as there is a lot more going on than matter, there are other 'sciences', like intentive healing, sorcery, prophesy, hanging out with non-material creatures and energies. Western and Eastern mysticism is overflowing with magical disciplines that are like PhD and career in a life's journey. Also, the indigenous worlds are replete with a cornucopia of oral disciplines for moulding light-field pheonix-souls into eternity.

I like your perspectives Reflections. I tend to see truth as ethical, a kind of resonating force which connects people. It tends to be pretty flexible in my relations to it. So therefore, I agree with Thunder and shout start connecting with people. Craft ethical and moral devices for engaging with other people. Other people tend to offer a kind of circuit for energetic growth. You just gotta connect with the right people, the right truth. And for those having heaps of distance from females I suggest getting your groove on and tapping into this shit. In my experience, chicks tend to be a bit more evolved emotionally and psychologically among other things, not always, but the direct feminine is definitely worth resonating with i reckon.

Hey Dude,your blurb on Punk culture mad me think of Vic Turner, the anthropologist. Below is a paragraph I wrote a while back. I'm feelin ya.

... the Turnerian idea and architecture of 'communitas', which can be generally defined in opposition to structure. It refers to liminality, marginality, inferiority and equality. Society for Turner evolves through a dialectic process between communitas, that is, the undifferentiated community of equal individuals, and structure, of differentiated and often hierarchical systems of social organisation. Turner states that 'maximisation of communitas provokes maximisation of structure, which in turn produces revolutionary strivings for renewed communitas', creating a cyclical process of social evolution'. Furthermore, he suggests that communitas inevitably 'decline and fall into structure and law' after which a new form of communitas may emerge again."

thanks for the thread

Micromegs, your words belong on the back of my toilet door next to the poem Desiderata. Great stuff man, thx.

Al, If you love "science", i'd suggest to play around the edges of the discipline, exploring things such as Husserl and Merleau-Ponty's phenomenological approach to metaphysics, also, quantum physics, and geomancy. But i also reckon that the mystico-phenomenological science of Toa is pretty heavyweight.

With luck and love.

Lao Tzu - The Tao Te Ching

The way that can be spoken of

Is not the constant way;

The name that can be named

Is not the constant name.

The nameless was the beginning of heaven and earth;

The name was the mother of the myriad creatures.

Hence always rid yourself of desires in order to observe its secrets;

But always allow yourself to have desires in order to observe its manifestations.

These two are the same

But diverge in name as the issue forth.

Being the same they are called mystery--

The gateway of the manifold secrets.

[Alchemica]

Thanks again for the input, all been slowly digesting in between my neurotic week.... there's some great points that have come up.

For anyone in similar shoes who's also a bit put off by where science is at today, you might want to check out these articles. If you stumble on anything good, feel free to post away. Science without creative (but harmless) anarchy just ruins it's spirit.

Real Lives and White Lies in the Funding of Scientific Research http://dx.doi.org/10...al.pbio.1000197 (FULL)

Letting Scientists Off the Leash http://opinionator.b...-off-the-leash/

How to think, say, or do precisely the worst thing for any occasion. http://www.wjh.harva...er%20(2009).pdf (FULL)

The importance of stupidity in scientific research. . http://dx.doi.org/10.1242/jcs.033340

"Every time someone tells you to 'be realistic' they are asking you to compromise your ideals." http://bit.ly/4xsVrd personally not a fan of "just being" to keep society as a functional economic slavery for a government wanting boring, perfectly "apparently" moral do-gooder sheep unwilling to think differently.

Cheers.

Edited February 7, 2010 by Alchemica

[drugo]

"schizoid personality disorder" ~ sounds like a good description of popular western culture to me

[ThunderIdeal]

it seems you've modified your last post but

could aspergers/autism come into it?

i sometimes think i've got a mild case, although i've dealt with a few in my time and i can't say i appreciate their company very much. then again there's a lot of company i don't appreciate much. hence the suspicion!

[Chiral]

I have a sneaking suspicion that Alchemica is a fundamentalist...if so and I might be way off here, but when you think in fundamental terms it becomes increasingly difficult to find satisfaction or "contentment"

I have personally adopted fundamental reasoning and questioning to every single object down to a microbe...what has it got me...sweet fa, but it does become a large part of your makeup as an adult when you enter into this line of thought.

Food for thought.."ignorance is bliss"

that is the hardest hurdle to ever leap in my mind.

[mescalito]

Man I just got sick of thinking and started doing.

Fuck'em if they don't think you fit in...I'd rather not

I just got off my case then got dressed in my metal T,black jeans,studded belt, went to Karaoke and sung my arse off !

Now I'm happy with a new bunch of friends and a Beautiful Preggy Hippy as a result!

They won't come to your door.....but they are out there

[Alchemica]

Yeah, quite likely a problem of thinking too much. It's bad when everything in life becomes a "problem to be solved".

Quite likely some form of mental diversity/abnormality - not that getting anything diagnosed seems to improve any outcomes (or prescriptions).

Time to slow the thinking and start doing.