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Yeti101

Mental Health and Suicide Prevention Resources

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I'm only new here but in this short time I've never met a group of people with so much empathy, caring and love. The responses I've seen towards people with concerns for themselves or others is so uplifting that it gives me renewed faith in the belief that not everyone in this world only cares about themselves and is ready to screw friend or foe over to get ahead in life. I hope someday that I get to meet some of you because you guys and gals have so much combined life experience and knowledge that your ready to impart for the benefit of others that it can only have a positive influence on me. It's a shame that I didn't become a member of this group a long time ago because you guys rock. From the bottom of my heart I want to thank you all for such a beautiful approach to life.

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Nice post.

Thanks for keeping an awareness of these services out there. Times sure get tough sometimes aye..

Sure are allot of caring folks out there still, showing it in an almost fantastic array of ways =) A community to be proud of indeed.

Edited by ghosty
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Great post Yeti. Everyone needs to know these services exist.
I have have used lifeline before helped me get through a few tough nights.

This may also be useful for people In vic at least (other states probably have it too but Im not sure how it works)

http://www.health.vic.gov.au/mentalhealthservices/adult/

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I wish I'd just die, I have been wishing for it for years now... Just far to piss weak to actually go though with it on my own.

But every time I reach out for help, I just get accused of being a hardcore drug addict who's just trying to scam drugs. I mean, goddamn, I'm a suicidal loser with no hope of anything better in life... Offer me drugs and I won't say no, so what, ya pack of bitches!!!

Fuck all these bitches and there paranoia of being scammed by a non-suicidal drug addict. There so goddamn paranoid that they would rather just shun people off who possibly might go and disconnect the air filter of there car, wind up the windows and run the engine. Rather than dare let someone get a buzz from dropping a few benzodiazepines.

Hopefully, they hook others up with quality care though... But me, I'm on my own.... I excepted that reality ages ago.

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Great post Yeti. Everyone needs to know these services exist.

I have have used lifeline before helped me get through a few tough nights.

This may also be useful for people In vic at least (other states probably have it too but Im not sure how it works)

http://www.health.vic.gov.au/mentalhealthservices/adult/

I've heard mixed reports regarding lifeline, whereas I've heard only good things about Suicide Call Back Service and SANE, that's why I put them first - and don't know much about state-based services outside of NSW, so thanks for the link.

Subaeruginosin, no matter what else we've disagreed about in the past, I'm sorry you feel that way. Not sure what the answer is for you - I'm not going to be one of those douche-lords who tell you to 'keep trying' or 'just get over/snap out of it'. Take care man.

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"disconnect the air filter of there car, wind up the windows and run the engine."

that wont do anything unless your in a closed area. AND, don't take the air filter off the engine, that will only wreck an otherwise working vehicle. :wink:

sounds like your biggest problem is you attitude. To live, you must be a warrior.

so.. you can battle on, or bitch and benzo.

Only you can sort out your life. Nobody else.

perhaps without the benzo, the bitch becomes strength to battle?

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At the risk of sounding insensitive, I did ask that this thread not be used for discussing particular people or events - this includes yourself and your life. I let this go once for Subby as he's clearly having a rough time and I didn't have the heart to be stern with him, but I don't want it to get OT.

Where you are at, how you feel and what you experience are all things that you have the right to discuss on this forum. But unless your post is to make a recommendation regarding mental health or suicide prevention resources you should take your discussions to another thread.

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Yeti... :wub: :wub: :wub:

FANTASTIC post. Beautiful soul.

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just my 2 cents, I feel like talking about suicide related matters makes me weaker, like im opening the flood gates, id prefer to leave it untouched. im an anomaly though and im sure there are people in much worse situations than me.

and I totally understand that for some people talking really helps

my hostile attitude towards mental illness is really just a defence mechanism ( I have mental health issues myself), I don't want to expose myself to these possibilities.

for me its just not an option, its not allowed, simple as that, depending on the situation I have little sympathy for suiciders, they leave such a mess in their wake. I find it selfish. but again im probably not as bad as other people.

I have close relationships with people with devastating effects from others suicide, and tbh i lose any sympathy for the victims very quickly.

I can understand people that end up in real life situations that make them feel like they have no other option, like someone whos just killed 2 cops and then turns the gun on themselves.

I wont take offence if this is deleted, I know its not a positive take on things. and might fall into the personal stories categories.

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My hostility comes from my own personal experiences, those of others and a lot of reading. In summary, I think the mental health system is a broken mess and a joke. This review (I may have posted this already) and the book itself sum up my thoughts: http://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/yoke-upon-necks-poor

And don't even get me started on psychiatry or psychiatric meds..

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Yeah it's a personal story pinegapcontrol, but I think we can let it slide this time :).

My hostility comes from my own personal experiences, those of others and a lot of reading. In summary, I think the mental health system is a broken mess and a joke. This review (I may have posted this already) and the book itself sum up my thoughts: http://thepsychologist.bps.org.uk/yoke-upon-necks-poor

And don't even get me started on psychiatry or psychiatric meds..

Well the system is pretty screwed - anyone who has been through it knows that. And the review you post makes a number of good points - many of which tie in with the 'rat park' discussion. (I'll try to find the other thread where you posted the review and we can continue the discussion there rather than take this thread further off-track).

Nonetheless, it is also the case that if you are suicidal, or know someone who is, there are people who will try to provide short-term help at least. Like I said initially, I posted those links on based on my experiences and the recommendations of people I know. Some of these people hold a similar view to yourself, don't consider themselves 'cured' - and yet they still recommend SANE and the Suicide Callback Service. My intention was certainly not to pathologise anyone who's not neuro-typical (good luck doing that here!), rather I want to make sure that members in crisis (directly or not) know that there are options out there other than bottling it up and not having any idea what to do.

Just to be clear - these organisations are not going to 'cure' or 'fix' anything. But if you are in crisis, or know someone who is, people I trust have told me that they are way better than nothing.

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Hi guys, might I also drop in the Mental Health Access Line who link to a various central hospitals that then triage the call and can arrange telephone follow-up, urgent follow up by the local Acute Care Team or equivalent, or if necessary contact emergency services.

The staff are nurses with mental health experience. The teams they refer to are dedicated mental health teams with multidisciplinary staff and who have access, often 24hr access, to psychiatry trainees who have access to a consultant psychiatrist to work with. Referrals can be made for other people you are concerned about.

They can also refer to other specific counselling lines.

Never feel ashamed, stupid or weak if you feel this way. Seek help. Look out for your friends. Stay safe.

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And we don't write off drug users in mental health. What I can say though, and what is known from neurophysiology, it makes mental health diagnosis and treatment much harder, and makes treatment far, far less effective, in people who use substances particularly when use is regular. A constant state of intoxication and withdrawal (and withdrawal lasts a lot longer than most think) as well as the long term changes to brain structure and function, makes treatment incredibly difficult. And exacerbates or even creates, symptoms of depressive illness that are typically unresponsive to any therapy while use continues. The single best thing someone who uses drugs and is experiencing difficulties with mood, perception or sense of self can do, is stop using for a long period (estimated minimum time for the biological adaptations in regular use of any drug to change significantly is 1 year, more likely 2, and during this time psychological and pharmacological therapies can assist the rewiring to occur in a more wellness promoting fashion). Crisis services are still useful, but as long as you're using, you're more likely to have crises.

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sorry to butt in there but anybody got anything for the uk? ... and of course further and wider for the benefit of other auslanders

Study sheds light on why the male suicide rate is so high

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Bottling up emotions. Finding it hard to cry. Feeling ashamed about being depressed. Or embarrassed at the idea of reaching out for help. These are issues for many men. And the mental health effects of these attitudes need addressing. Male suicide is a growing crisis.

Every two hours, a man commits suicide in the UK. It’s the number one killer of men under the age of 45. Yes, a man under 45 is more likely to die by suicide than from any kind of disease, accident or at the hands of someone else. Some commentators have said that nobody knows why the male suicide rate is so high. But a new study tells us it may have to do with the masculine ideal of self-reliance.

Masculine norms

This study of 14,000 Australian men found that those who strongly identified with being self-reliant were significantly more likely to report suicidal thoughts.

Self-reliance is one of 11 masculine norms. Others include: a desire to win, risk-taking, dominance and pursuit of status.

As The Canary previously reported, the self-reliance norm may explain why so many men suffering from depression don’t seek mental health treatment. And not seeking treatment for depression sheds light on why so many men are taking their own lives. (Depression is the most common psychiatric disorder in people who die by suicide.)

Lead researcher Jane Pirkis highlights that it has everything to do with culture. She said:

Notions of masculinity aren’t just dreamed up by individuals, they are imposed by society from childhood in quite subtle ways. So if a sense of needing to be self-reliant is an issue for some men, and some women also, we as a society need to think about how we are bringing up our boys and girls. Even today boys are told not to cry and young men are told to toughen up.

Self-reliance singled out

Authors found no significant correlation between suicidal thinking and 10 of the male norms. There was only a notable connection between suicide risk and men who strongly believed in the importance of self-reliance. These men had a 34% greater chance of reporting thoughts about suicide or self-harm. This held true even after controlling for other suicide risk factors, such as depression, stress alcohol use and not having a partner.

Published in Social Psychiatry and Psychiatric Epidemiology, this study used data from the largest longitudinal study of the health of men and boys in the world. Pirkis says that:

 

the large size of the cohort puts this study at the forefront of research linking a particular element of traditional masculinity – self-reliance – to suicide risk.

Researchers asked men how strongly they agreed with statements such as: “I never ask for help” and: “It bothers me when I have to ask for help”.

Pirkis stresses that self-reliance can of course be a positive thing for many men. But we also can’t ignore the grave risk associated with it either.

Some men are more affected than others

It seems that masculine norms may be affecting some men more than others. Recent findings show that the suicide risk in the UK is greatest for low skilled male workers. Construction workers kill themselves at a rate three times higher than the male average.

So it could be that some professions tend to reinforce self-reliance as a norm more than others. Ruth Sutherland, chief executive of Samaritans, said:

The more we know, the more we can target resources and support to those most at risk.

It’s easy to forget the immense power that language has. When boys and men are told to ‘man up‘ it transmits the cultural narrative about what it means to be a man. As we can see from this new study, being expected to ‘toughen up’ is a deeply harmful attitude. Culture can’t be changed in one fell swoop. But it begins at home, at work, with friends, and in social situations. Ultimately, though, it begins with being good to yourself and recognising when you need a helping hand.

Edited by ☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ
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I can't remember if I've posted about it elsewhere, but Johns Hopkins via Coursera is currently running a MOOC on Psychological First Aid: https://www.coursera.org/learn/psychological-first-aid 

 

About this course: Learn to provide psychological first aid to people in an emergency by employing the RAPID model: Reflective listening, Assessment of needs, Prioritization, Intervention, and Disposition. Utilizing the RAPID model (Reflective listening, Assessment of needs, Prioritization, Intervention, and Disposition), this specialized course provides perspectives on injuries and trauma that are beyond those physical in nature. The RAPID model is readily applicable to public health settings, the workplace, the military, faith-based organizations, mass disaster venues, and even the demands of more commonplace critical events, e.g., dealing with the psychological aftermath of accidents, robberies, suicide, homicide, or community violence. In addition, the RAPID model has been found effective in promoting personal and community resilience.

 

Participants will increase their abilities to:

- Discuss key concepts related to PFA

- Listen reflectively

- Differentiate benign, non-incapacitating psychological/ behavioral crisis reactions from more severe, potentially incapacitating, crisis reactions

- Prioritize (triage) psychological/ behavioral crisis reactions

- Mitigate acute distress and dysfunction, as appropriate

- Recognize when to facilitate access to further mental health support

- Practice self-care

 

The RAPID model is pretty much what SANE Australia use and teach people. I'm thinking of doing this.

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That all seems well and good, for the average joe blo.

How does it apply to someone approaching 50 with multiple physical disabilities & no super and even less job prospects ?

Do I take the magic happy pills and get a menial labouring job for the next 8 - 15 years (in the knowledge I'll never own a house or anything else of any substance) or do I study for 5 years and hope to work for maybe 6-8 years after that and retire with almost no super and a body that doesn't work, & that's if I'm lucky beyond any reasonable expectations and take the gamble that a well paid job will fall into my lap ?

Why try to keep people with fucked lives alive in the name of mental health ? , it might make you feel good but it's just extending the torture for the poor bastard living the dream/nightmare.

Just fucking shoot us and get it over with.

Re-set things and let us try again,

@ Sam (not Yeti, the the other one) I'll honour all my arrangements with you, I've been unable to walk for the last few months but I'm almost back to my full crippled potential. & Solomon (I think it was you, I can't see my old messages) the Kratom never set viable seeds - so sorry bro.

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^ Where's that positive Sallubrious I've long admired?! :( . Sad for me to read things are not good for you. Thinking of you and your family. I wish I could create a better life for you. If we are our own creators, why is my friend so miserable :( . 

 

Love  to you and yours Sallubrious. May there be brighter times ahead. 

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I have to agree @Sallubrious. There comes a point where one in a rational mind, or where that has been previously decided and things are declining, should be able to make the decision to end their life with dignity. A nice pentobarbital etc infusion could be the most humane and dignified option we have in some cases.

 

I also get distressed by the 'pressure to hang around' and more so 'conform' from loved ones and friends but you know what, I've still got a bit of a life to live. We're on this planet for a brief moment, so why the f* not. Please hang around, you make a difference despite all the suffering you have. Not many people can articulate that to others, so that in itself is an achievement,

 

That said, I never hold it against anyone if they do make the informed decision to end their life. I just hope they have access to tools to do it effectively, peacefully and correctly without bringing more suffering etc.

 

I do fight for the right to die with dignity.

 

What I suggest is that you turn to less lethal options to re-set and gain a new perspective. Not that I should be technically endorsing them but f* it once again, psychedelics are a great tool for doing so.

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Hey @Sallubrious- just pm'd you. I agree with @Alchemica - please hang around - you do make a positive difference in people's lives!

 

FWIW, this thread, and those resources, are predominately aimed at situations of acute crisis. Supporting the choice - the right, to end one's life with dignity (and with informed consent) is not mutually exclusive with helping people to not take their own lives when they aren't thinking clearly and there are be better options. And irrespective of whether the decision to take one's own life is rational or not, the people left behind need support - which is a big part of what these organisations provide. 

 

Sadly, modern psychology and psychiatry, have not made spectacular headway on how to be happy, or even how to avoid being particularly un-happy/depressed/anxious etc. I don't know the answer - clearly - because if I did, I would have told you all, and things would be very different. 

 

The only thing I would say is that wherever people are at, and whatever they are going through, they don't necessarily have to go through it by themselves. Sometimes that is the best anyone can offer.

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Well said @Yeti101

 

A recent article covers things and I agree with some of it, except that the antidepressants we have are often ineffective, as are our pain management strategies. The bits I'd like to highlight from the article are:

 

Increase Genuine Connection & Community

People who attempt suicide often describe feelings of intense isolation, experts say. The way we conduct our relationships today may be adding to women’s feelings of being all alone. “I do wonder about whether there’s something changing in our social connectedness and culture [that leads to more suicides],” says Dr. Moutier. Divorce could be one factor. In a 2010 analysis published in the journal Public Health Reports, researchers noted that in 2005, unmarried middle aged women were 2.8 times more likely to die from suicide than married women, and the divorce rate in middle-aged and older people has doubled since the 1990s.

Perhaps our growing reliance on technology is another. “I would like to see more attempts at connectedness,” says Wright-Berryman. “Research shows that we need to focus on increasing the protective factors that prevent suicide. When people are feeling suicidal, they feel alone, even if they have a large circle of caring friends. So whether it's women in urban or rural areas, they need to feel like they are ‘dialed in’...meaning that there is always a way to seek and receive help, love, support.” Sometimes that may be turning to a close friend or family member, but it could also mean using technology to make a genuine, helpful connection, says Wright-Berryman. “There are crisis phone apps, for example. Someone could simply tap on their phone and chat with someone about their feelings. There are community-based interventions, such as Question-Persuade-Refer (QPR) and SafeTALK. These are short trainings that any community member can take to learn how to ask the questions, know how to respond, and guide someone to help. Suicide is a community issue, and the more our community members know about how to intervene and help, the more we can collectively make an impact on suicide.”
 

Suicide is a community issue, and the more our community members know about how to intervene and help, the more we can collectively make an impact.

Jennifer Wright-Berryman
I was taken by surprise when my close female friend went into the hospital — like I said, those of us who know and love her didn’t realize her pain and desperation had gotten so intense. Looking back, I realize now that most of my impressions of “how well” she was doing were from Facebook, or quick texts exchanged in between doing other things. I hadn’t seen her in person in five months, and we hadn’t talked on the phone in several weeks. So how connected were we, really? Social media and texts created the illusion that things were alright. But they weren’t. I’m not saying that regular phone calls from me or anyone else could’ve fixed her depression or kept her from feeling suicidal — I’ve had several major depressive episodes myself and know that’s not how it works. But perhaps more genuine connection and communication could help all of us feel less alone.
 
Anyone is always welcome to get in contact with me by PM.
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