Police get tough on drug drivers

[Chiral]

SOURCE

Four drivers have tested positive to drugs in Orange's first mobile roadside drug testing operation.

Police say out of the 158 motorists tested on Friday and Saturday night, another four were caught drink driving.

There were no arrests in Cowra where the operation ran on Saturday night.

Inspector Peter Atkins from the Canobolas local area command says there will be another crackdown in the near future.

"It's our ongoing commitment to reducing road trauma by targeting drug drivers as well as drunk drivers because our intelligence is that many accidents involved people who have used drugs prior to driving," he said.

Officers say four people also tested positive to being under the influence of cannabis, ecstasy or methamphetamines, and the results of a second test will be analysed before charges are laid.

Inspector Atkins says it is a disappointing result.

"Out of 158 tests, four indicated they had used drugs at some time prior to driving, and in addition to those four for drug tests we also arrested four for drink driving, so it is concerning the numbers still driving affected by alcohol and or drugs," he said.

[J Smith]

"Out of 158 tests, four indicated they had used drugs at some time prior to driving, ..." he said.

Lol, I'd be surprised if most people haven't used drugs at some time prior to driving.

[santiago]

I heard info that they had to wind back the number of roadside drug tests in WA due to them costing $40 each time compared to the low number of drivers found guilty.

Of course they will eventually get cheaper. Cant remember the exact numbers but i think it was around 5/1000. Its not as bad as the police make out, they just like playing with their latest toy. If some dumb drug driving shit out there wanted to go somewhere all they need to do is keep to the back streets. They only have the budget at the moment to toy with this project on the main routes via the 'drug bus'........so unlike the drink driving ads drug drivers can get home via back streets as the single patrol cars dont have the facility to drug test.

Theoretically 2 places they like to set up the drug bus in Perth are

Great Eastern Hwy Belmont (on the way out from the casino just past the sandringham)

Graham Farmer Freeway (near Belmont Park racecourse)

Safest though to just get a taxi like most normal mature social people.

Probably the thing that annoys me the most about the reliability of the tests is the good ol fav MJ. Testing positive to THC can occur reliably 24 hours after consumption. So stupid. Some dude enjoys fishing sunday morning with a small joint and 24 hours later Mr 9-5 now worker dude gets pinged for drug driving. Wrong.

[Neoshaman]

my whole issues with these tests is they are based on detecting something which at certain levels may not effect driving ability i have no problem with people being busted if there motor skills are effected in a negative way but to simply say you have drugs in your system so now we will suspoend your license and fuck your life up for the next 6-12 months is not really a fair approach. the whole statistics around drug driving are a farce anyway .............................yep we found traces of this or that in the persons system so that must have been the reason they crashed wake the fuck up, something simply being present in someones system does not necessarily mean that the substance caused the accident its just a pain in the arse revenue raising tactic and another futile waste of tax payers money brought about by the war on drugs

[Smiling Cloud]

They only have the budget at the moment to toy with this project on the main routes via the 'drug bus'

Santiago- this is not true, they have had portable drug test kits as of 2 years ago at least, i;ve been tested by them about 3-4 times. The test kits are about the length of a tv remote and half as wide. They snap it half lengthways and then scrape your tongue with it, then they put the scraper in a little solution and if it changes colour you get a free trip to the cop shop. I hate being tested, its the grossest feeling and they always act like they are onto a winner with me. I've been in the car when others have been tested and they didn't take that long. With me they always wait about 15-20 mins, probably hoping for a colour change. Its hairist i say!

Funnily enough the only time i have ever come across them having the portable ones is when the bus is in town...

I'd really like to find out what they end up doing with all the used swabs. Call me paranoid but wouldn't this be a good way to get peoples DNA on file? I can't remember exactly but if you give them a sample of your DNA freely aren't they allowed to keep it? When you give them the swab theya also have your license details so they could just bag it and send it away to be filed. Does anyone know?

[Chiral]

Mmmmm it's all a bit suss in my opinion, yesterday I was happily just driving along and a cop car turned out of a street and drove behind me, 10 secs later they flashed their lights and blurted the siren at me to pull over...for what...?

One over zealous cop shoves the breath tester through the window at me and asks me to count to 10...negative..show my license, hands it back and I'm on my way. What I don't get is what reason did they have to just pull me over whilst obeying the road rules and driving safely...?

I'd have to say it was based purely on my looks on this occasion, so now we have any cop car, at anytime, pulling you over whenever they feel like because they think they have a winner due to the drivers looks.

[rogdog]

I find it strange that the Police want all the drink and drugged drivers off the road, because they are more likely to have a crash. So they catch them, and the courts take away the offenders license for 6-12 months.

But if you actually have a car crash, you just get 3 demerit points for failing to give way. It just doesn't add up that the penalty for more likely to crash is higher than having the crash

[FancyPants]

That reminds me, time to make friends with somebody with a police scanner.

[AndyAmine.]

If you have a crash under the influence then your up for all expenses from the crash to other vehicle/person, council property, you get no insurance cover, you loose your license (in most cases of a serious nature AFAIK) and you get a fine and a charge etc.

As I understand it, if a regular smoker has a serious accident that injures themselves or another person they will more than likely have a blood test, so even if they haven't smoked in the last 24hrs and are basicly straight they will probably show up positive and have to pay god knows how much to the other person/insurer and have to pay all there own expenses.

Is this logic correct?

[Neoshaman]

If you have a crash under the influence then your up for all expenses from the crash to other vehicle/person, council property, you get no insurance cover, you loose your license (in most cases of a serious nature AFAIK) and you get a fine and a charge etc.

As I understand it, if a regular smoker has a serious accident that injures themselves or another person they will more than likely have a blood test, so even if they haven't smoked in the last 24hrs and are basicly straight they will probably show up positive and have to pay god knows how much to the other person/insurer and have to pay all there own expenses.

Is this logic correct?

very correct I know victoria has mandatory drug testing of anyone involved in a road accident not sure about other states I suspect NSW does also though I guess the point that this raises for me is that what if your not at fault but drugs are detected in your system does the other driver insurance still pay , can you still sue the other driver on face value I tend to think your screwed if they detect drugs in your system whether your at fault or not and if this is the case are the laws really impliemented to keep people safe or just another excuse to impose on our freedoms and personal privacy

[rogdog]

So the drivers using the non-government approved medicine lose thier licenses, but it's all good to drive around on valium..cool. See ya on the streets, or not! I will be in my own merry world

[Bush Turkey]

a bit of a bump! does anyone know how the test works?

[cactuscarl]

It's just like those pill testers a chemical that changes colour when it come in contact with certain drugs

You can buy them off the internet

[Bush Turkey]

im more interested on how they can detect THC off your tongue. what makes it possible?

[Slybacon]

I "think" its metabolites in your saliva. Someone with more knowledge can give a clearer answer.

[FancyPants]

What would the results be after ingesting a goodish amount of fantastic saffron?

[santiago]

Oral fluid drug tests are a popular choice with employers and with parents who want to test their teens for drugs. Among oral fluid drug tests, the swab type is the most common. The highly absorbent mucous membranes of the mouth and the nature of the glands that produce oral fluids allow swab drug tests to be surprisingly accurate.

SOURCE- http://www.livestron.../#ixzz1QC9W4xlE

so into the mouth we go

The Movement of Substances from Blood into SalivaIn addition to the organic compounds that are produced locally in the saliva glands, there are some that pass into saliva from outside the salivary glands. These compounds include drugs, drug by-products, hormones, and some proteins. The presence of these compounds in saliva has spurred research into its use as a diagnostic fluid, especially in view of the relative ease and safety of collection it offers when compared to more traditional diagnostic fluids such as blood and urine. (8)

Many of these substances circulate in the bloodstream, and many of them can pass from blood into saliva by unaided, or passive, diffusion. As described above, the capillaries surrounding the salivary glands are quite porous for many substances. Materials can pass from the blood system into the space surrounding the glands, and then make their way directly through the membranes of acinus or duct cells. The ability of a molecule to diffuse passively through cell membranes depends partly on its size, and partly on how much electrical charge it carries. If a molecule is polar in nature, or if it separates into charged ions while in solution, it will have a hard time passing through the membranes, which are made out of neutral fatty compounds called phospholipids. Steroid hormones are relatively small in size, and most of them are fatty, non-polar compounds, so they tend to pass relatively easily by diffusion. Other molecules such as the large protein hormones, or hormones or drugs that are bound to large carrier proteins while in the bloodstream, are too big to enter by this route. (15).

A second pathway used by molecules to enter saliva is by filtering through the tight spaces between acinus or duct cells. In order to do this they must be relatively small. Sulfated steroids such as dehydro-epiandrosterone sulfate (DHEA-S) and estriol sulfate, which are not able to pass through the fatty cell walls because of their electrical charges, were thought to enter saliva by this route. These molecules are too large to enter easily by this pathway, however, and this was thought to limit the amounts that could enter saliva. (15) More recent research has identified a large family of organic anion transport polypeptides (OATP) that actively transport molecules such as DHEA-S across membranes. It therefore seems likely that such a mode of entry occurs for DHEA-S into the saliva glands. (16,17) Compounds such as DHEA-S are slower to migrate into saliva than the neutral steroid hormones, and when saliva output is stimulated they may move too slowly to keep up with the accelerated flow rates, causing concentrations in saliva to drop. (15)

source-http://www.salimetrics.com/my-spit-research/saliva-501/spit-basics.php

which probably leads onto the core subject of avoiding roadside drugs testing which is one of those taboo issues, you dont want to be seen as advocating it as the real story is that everyday an innocent person dies as a direct result of a motor accident caused by a drug influenced person, if they had not consumed the drug before getting behind the wheel then there may not have been the accident.

may.....is the defining model behind it, like the twin tower jumpers for example, if they had parachutes they may have survived the fall-or if joe bloggs had not have consumed drugs prior to driving then innocent anny may have not had an accident with drug joe. so in theory i see why roadside drug testing can be a good thing as in theory every driver caught driving on drugs is seen as one of those mays taken off the road, every driver caught is a life potentially saved.

on the flipside however you dont want to be pulled over on a sunday drive and test positive to the joint you shared at the pub on friday night, that is complete horse shit and totally unjust, so certainly there is a place to debate what you might swish or swallow that sunday to protect your life from a potentially rigged detection system (mainly in regards to cannabis).

left of centre suggestions without suggesting you get fucked up and then go drive miss daisy ----------- buy yourself 100 drug saliva kits and test your theories out, will this strawberry and baking soda milkshake vary results.

stay sober for a month and spit lots into a jar, carry a hairdryer and plug it into your lighter plug and continue to dry your mouth constantly, then pour the stale sober saliva jar into your mouth and mix the greenies around until even consistancy, time this into your roadside test.

wear a neck brace and make a homemade broken jaw apparatus, simply wear whilst driving and scribble down onto a piece of paper to the officer that you broke your jaw at footy and cannot open it.

create a false mouth and tounge that fits into your real mouth, use like a fake dick urine device.

stick the most unsightly fake hairy cockroach sized mole on your near lip area, chances are i would be freaked out if i was a roadside copper and let the mole dude slide by quietly.

put jesus stickers all over your car, keep a bible handy and play a religious cd, dress up like a alter boy and ask the roadside officer if he would like to join you for church tonight, start talking in tounges to god and remember some quotes from bible that relate to law and governance, if still asked for a saliva sample explain that it is against your religion to transfuse blood, or to lose bodily fluids, explain that you converted to religion to salvate (boom boom) yourself before you die from late stage AIDS, may help if you have a book called living with aids on the dash.

fill a massive edible thing full of honey and clag glue and burst it in your mouth near zero minute, it will cover the palate and barrier from the saliva underneath.

keep a bowl of goodies handy, quickly eat a garlic clove, suck a lemon, mouthwash, ash, dog poo, parsley and curry powder really quick and smirk at your resourcefulness.

devote your nights to the science of mucous

ask yourself what ben cousins would do

take pride in yourself, of course you look like a druggy with your unwashed car, 20 redbull empty cans among your fast food wrappers on the floor, with a 3 day growth and glow in the dark fluffy bell bottom pants and a ultrasonic cd playing. first impressions count most importantly of all.................if you were a copper who would you test out of these two with only 1 test to be used.

purely subjective however certain drug related actions such as messyness are often attributed to usage. disorganisation of the mind (popular stigmatism of drug use) often leads to personal shabbyness and hygeine and simple lazyness, high level organisation is often thought of as anal which has all the characteristics of the sheldon coopers of the world and is thought of highly and generally with respect and a level of motivation and organisation not associated generally with drug use....anyway thats the theory.

or probably the best thing to do is not take drugs and pass the test like you should, at the end of the day the random police saliva test is the least of your worries, if you have an accident or heaven help you kill somebody even if you didnt mean it your going to jail and take full liability for ALL costs and thats before the others lawyers sue you for everything you have and the judge pins you for murder, unfortunately when i first started driving in the early 90's i shamefully say it was common place amongst peers and society at the time to limit yourself to a six pack before lunch, such was the freedom of seriously having no police to worry about, now i get paranoid driving to the shops after a single light beer such has the mean frequency of random testing risen.

i really shudder for the kids these days, quickly going are the byegone days of going around the block once to get your licence, doing something wrong and getting a clip over the ear by constable care instead of a lecture, having a proper fist fight in a pub without getting stabbed or glassed, in my day and im 36...it was normal to cut your teeth as a young man in the local pub, being taught the rules of man and life for 5 years before daring to call yourself a man, now its straight from the hair bleaching salon, into your skinny jeans and off to the boutique for a european pilsener, so much has changed in 20 odd years and honestly they were really really good, free and liberty and common sense was so common that it was normal, now i gotta scan my ID, smoke in a little seperate room and cant buy redbull after midnight (sad but true).

hence i post the above not to promote beating roadside saliva tests but more in the frustration of the slow and consistant loss of human liberties and freedom, its not about beating the system its more about evening out the balance of life. if you ask me the police should be getting of the side of the road where they can only directly influence the result after it has already happened and getting onto the beat and influencing actions before they happen. it seems that law these days is all about consequenses of actions as opposed to influencing the actions before they become consequenses.

i lost my point somewhere back there but i hoped some of the above has helped or simply amused you, im thinking of blaming NIKE, i was fine until i kept looking down and reading just do it

[C_T]

did you seriously waste 20 minutes of your life writing that post santiago? oh my...

[Bush Turkey]

wow! thanks man! Now the reason im asking is that im on pantoprazole (sodium sesquihydrate) for hearburn. Apparently this gives false positives for THC? Wondering if this will give a false positive on swab tests???

[SunChaser]

I just had a very close friend get pulled over and given a saliva test. He'd been smoking since he got up (about 5 am) and also had at least 3 cones 10 minutes before leaving home, he'd just been to the supermarket which took 20 minutes at the most and got pulled over on his way home. All up it would have been about half an hour since he had his last cone when he was pulled over and tested and it came up completely negative. Fuck yeah!

I've always thought these tests where BS when it comes to THC and now I've got the proof. My friend does drink alot of water, but hadn't since his last cone and at the time his mouth was completely dry and he hadn't eaten for a few hours either, which was just vegemite toast and an apple. So I don't think he did anything to cause a false negative.

The herald sun did report years ago when these tests first came out that the majority of people admit guilt before the actual test result comes though, which is how I've always thought most people who get busted for driving with THC in there system come undone.

Peace

[synchromesh]

Yeah, I've got a story that's pretty much identical to that one. The tests are unreliable as hell.

If you got tested positive for THC (and really had it in you), shouldn't you just appeal the charge whenever there's no measurable amount left in your body?

"Out of 158 tests, four indicated they had used drugs at some time prior to driving, and in addition to those four for drug tests we also arrested four for drink driving, so it is concerning the numbers still driving affected by alcohol and or drugs," he said.

8 out of 158 isn't good?

Edited July 28, 2011 by synchromesh