psychotropic water kefir

[withdrawl clinic]

hi!

 

one time a member here stated something like, "if this herb get's processed with water kefir, it might help to jump the blood brain barrier"....

water kefir mixed with herbs is a not very researched subject.

maybe it doe's though work and it might even do the trick with herbs which are not easy to extract.

 

the advantage right away is that, the brewing process is very simple, and very cheap, as such this ought to give a lot of room to experiment.

my hope would be that one could use a very wide variety of plants as part of a kefir brew.

kefir has a very nice taste, and said to have gut related health benefits.

 

i bought my kefir granules at my local health food shop, and they needed to, wake up, but now they are ready for a "medicinal brew"

kefir excited

Edited January 11 by withdrawl clinic

[Alchemica]

There's been a bit of research into fermentation of different plants with either lactic acid bacteria or yeasts. I've tried to summarise a bit of it here

The Science of Fermented Fruits, Veggies and Plant Medicines - Pharmacology, Chemistry & Medicine - The Corroboree (shaman-australis.com)

 

The bacteria and yeasts are in a way potentially mildly psychoactive, hence their often-termed action as "psychobiotics". I've only tried milk kefir, which is interesting in it's own way, as the kefir peptides are too mildly psychoactive but you're right, fermenting a plant into the mix is an interesting concept and worth exploring more.

There's the classic example of Sceletium which I've tried to explore here with yeasts 
yeasts to encourage bioconversion.pdf
 

Quote

Alongside the nutritional and psychobiotic effect, a diversity of peptides from casein are released by kefir including at least 5 opioid peptides. Opioid effects have been also reported following oral administration of casein hydrolysates. The peptides may exhibit anxiolytic-like and cognition enhancing activities. Kefir peptides may also act as anti-oxidants, immunomodulators and anti-obesity agents

 

Let us know if you do any experimenting

yeasts to encourage bioconversion.pdf

Edited January 16 by Alchemica

[fyzygy]

I notice that water kefir grains are sourced from prickly pear pads -- are these just the grains I've seen forming naturally from cut Opuntia pads? Water kefir seems less fussy to ferment than kombucha. I'd give it a shot, if someone had grains to spare (do they tend to multiply, like kombucha SCOBY?)

 

 

[rottenjonny]

I'm regularly making both kombucha and milk kefir. Are we saying I can throw things in there and create superdrinks?

[withdrawl clinic]

some of my sceletium preparations, turned out to have a "cheesy" flavor, after just following the traditional preparation.

scelly would be on top of my list to add to water kefir.

it's a very easy straight forward operation, but the details i still have to work out.

as it's said to have been found, naturaly with opuntia fruits, i used dragon fruit for a brew, but the seeds were hard to remove from the granules.

so i will not do this again. putting the additavies (thinnly sliced ginger (or galangel) and lemon with skin, in a bag of muslin cloth produce a weak brew.

 

there are many things i still have to learn like how to dry the granules and than store them in the fridge, when one got tiered of having to brew every few days...

my instructions said, rinse granules, with a strainer with cold water (previously boiled water). but i noticed that this way, one throws a way young granules.

 

alchemica's input explains the mild head sensation, it's the bacteria it'selve and not the galangel mild properties.

drinking the beverage, seemed to have eased a bit my diverticuly disease pain.

i did throw out the ginger, but maybe it could be re used.

do make a brew with say withania, it could work to add, the already heat and water extracted roots.

i have wishfull thinking that, the kefir aids to facilitate the solubilety of actives, into water.

 

[teamwhy]

Lactobacilli with Amanita muscaria is meant to be the good way to convert Ibotenic acid to Muscimol.  I only know people that has used milk but there could be a vegetable route also. 

[withdrawl clinic]

your replies, make me aware of many different, mechanism, which i did not know about, thank you.

although the process is very, very simple my outcomes vary to a large degree...

some brews, were so nice, i prefered them over my own, favorite beverage beer.

some turned into a bubbly jelly which, not as tasty as hoped.

 

one time i used dragon fruit as flavor, and the brew was tasty, but the seeds, took i while to remove from the granules.

as well, if you use a strainer, save the straining water, and decant carefully, and save all the baby granules, so you get more granules.

i am not certain, but the granules seem to have a certain life span, even with good care, so always look out for tiny granules.

 

i tried to put the, added fruts or ginger, tied into muslin cloth, to avoid contaminating the brew with seeds and flaky fiber, but that didn't work well for the brew.

the additatives, need to be loosly held in the water and agitated once in a while.

an other idea i had is to use the brew, as a dispenser for micro dosing.

next will be to use minced ginger, out of the jar, and see if the preservative are not harmfull to the brewing process.

[withdrawl clinic]

ok, big update!

 

a friend of mine did lend me two books about probiotic (fermented drinks) which inspired me greatly.

seems that some people use only sugar for the primary fermentation, and only add fruits (simmered down in a little water and sugar) at the botteling (second fermentation stage).

this would keep the granules much cleaner which could be a big advantage (fruit pulp is hard to seperate from the granules), but i still add fruit to the initial fermentation, as it produces a better brew.

 

my current batch had raspberries and a little sugar added at botteling stage. the book said the fruit sugars (fructose?) will produce the fizzyness of the drink and i agree. thats why i add fructose in form of ginger and citrus fruits to the first fermentation, already. maybe thesecond fermentation is enhanced, by already fruits beeing added at the first step.

i found out that the granules can be stored in the fridge (not freezer) once they have been cleaned, for a few months.

as well i had a bottle of second fermentation brew in the fridge for maybe 2-3 months and it was delicious, and a little psychotropic..

 

i have not yet experimented with ginger out of a jar, but reading suggested that water kefir granules don't like metal, and detergent residue.

 

what i observed, but never read about, is that water kefir seems to be able to keep fruits and ginger and galangel very fresh (it is conserved well) so maybe it's good to use the same ginger for several brews (i use ginger thinly sliced currently).

 

i still havent brewed by adding some of our "more beloved" ethono plants, but the fact, that the second fermented drink keeps very well, in the fridge for a long time, gives me hope it could work. in other words, i always thought the added organic would be in contact with the water kefir for a too short periode, to facilitate a transfer of active compounds.

 

my initial excitement, was brought on by the thought that, similar like "spit kava" the granules would help to extract compounds.

i would like to add kava or withania to a brew, would be nice if it would work. withania is quite heat stable so one could add this plant, in form of a simmered water decoction.

 

[Ishmael Fleishman]

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Edited August 16 by Ishmael Fleishman

[Ishmael Fleishman]

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Edited August 16 by Ishmael Fleishman

[Slocombe]

I once participated in a (different) forum, that had people adding MSG to their microbrews, in the hope that the yeast would then convert some of the added MSG into GHB along-side the alcohol. This wasn't as wrong-headed as it sounds, since trace amounts of GHB is sometimes found in wines.

 

Anyway, I don't remember anyone being able to show that this works; but this thread reminded me a bit of that other thread.

 

Happy brewing everyone!

Edited September 15 by Slocombe
tautology

[withdrawl clinic]

this is interesting, and inspires...

do you know, if adding gabba, would be a pathway?

 

i don't know if it got mentioned in this thread, so i repeat what i was told (and sparked my kefir interest) water kefir might facilitate, blood brain barrier, transfere.

in other words, it might help, some substances, which can't cross, to be able to achive this task. this is potentially dangerous i say, as the bbb is ther for a good reason to protect us. however imagen a phamaceutical which can't cross the bbb, do be able to do, so to varying degree.

this would help to fight disease, making pharma more effective. putting some pharma which is deemed, not very effective, very effective.

now there is technolegy currently developed, which allowes, molecules to be directed to specific parts of the body (say for cancer treatment), but i think they struggled with bbb transfere.

hope this inspires....