Drug bust - lab making safrole and other goodies

[Chiral]

Chiral, in my eyes "pill machine" does not equate to "laboratory capable of producing drug/precursor X"

 

Yeah agree but it's the most incriminating piece of evidence though...you might be able to talk your way out of having some chems and flasks, or twist the reasons for having them around, if you were being careful and washing things well and keeping small amounts of different precursors in different places etc..but a pill machine...there ain't no talking your way out of that one.

I will miss our beloved cloud..he was a ray of sunshine around these parts...I remember when people received random khat seeds in the mail and no one could work out who had been so generous. A good soul for sure for sure.

be well friend.

[naja naja]

Making candy ???

[tripsis]

Oh shit, this is bad. Will we be able to find out what the sentence is?

[Torsten]

it's a bit early to talk about sentences. let's see how much of the mud actually sticks. there are plenty of legitimate reasons for having some of this equipment and simply owning it isn't always an offence. eg from what I understand, making safrole isn't illegal if you can prove that it was not intended for drug manufacture [burden of proof is on defendant]. A good lawyer can probably put quite a few dents in this if the boys exercised their right to silence in time.

but to answer your question, yes, I am sure we will be able to update in time. it is customary for forum members who are in trouble to lie low for a while, so don't expect too much too soon. Found out today that this is still ongoing and that other people who were not present during the raids are still being sought, so I suggest patience.

[tripsis]

Ah, this is all so wrong. The laws in this country, like most countries, are just so hypocritcal and backwards. If indeed they were manufacturing MDMA, it is wrong that they should get the same sentence as someone manufacturing methamphetamine or fentanyl. Both those latter drugs are much more addictive and much more harmful, yet they fall into the same catergory of the law. How many deaths have actually been attributed to MDMA alone in the world? I bet it is a remarkably small number. Either all drugs should be legal or all drugs should be illegal. I don't want anyone deciding for me or anyone else what they deem suitable for others to ingest! The key is education, not prohibition. My best wishes go out to all those involved.

[Bigred]

is there a update on sentencing

[Torsten]

yes, and you'll get a good chuckle out of this.

So the defendants were facing charges of possessing safrole, possessing a pill press, and conspiracy to manufacture MDMA. Case went to court with some of the chargest reduced, but still a few years of jail time at stake. Prosecution presented evidence in regards to the safrole, but used a measurement unit not consistent with the drug scheduling. ie one is in grams and the other is in ml. because the density of the liquids is not equal 100ml of safrole or water does not equal 100g of safrole. The judge is very tough on both the defence and prosecution and holds both to very high standards. A standard not met in this instance unless they could present a certifcate or an expert witness who would testify as to the conversion ratio. Neither was at hand. The judge warned the prosecution to not make any further mistakes.

When they got to the pill press the judge asked for the certificate that proves the machine was a pill press. After all it could have been a leather press or a hole punch for all anyone knew. Apparently pill presses need to be certified to be entered as evidence. The police and prosecution did not have such a cetificate at hand. The judge slammed the prosecution for being sloppy. Then turned to the defendants and explained how they deserved to go to jail for some time, but because the cops did not do their job properly he will dismiss the case. And that was that.

The cops had a really tight case, but were sloppy and as a result they lost what would have been a substantial legal precedent.

[ghosty]

dammit.. now im worried about my order of 10 million whole fresh nutmegs and 500 sassafras tree's!

LOL.

[planthelper]

i'm worried now about my avocado trees, as they also contain safrol, in the leaves.

the judge had to be spot on, otherwise he would never been able to make a precedent case, he would if he had allowed the evidence, be the laughing stock all over the world.

Edited February 21, 2013 by planthelper

[Yawning Man]

How would it have been a precedent?

[cactuscarl]

Lol that's awsome. They better be good boys now tho I'll bet the cops are fuming and looking for any reason to bust them.

[folias]

Good to hear those guys got off! I met one of them once, they were certainly not bad people.

[planthelper]

How would it have been a precedent?

in case you talk to me, i repeated the word t used, but right away, now that i read your reply, i realised, you need the high court for that.

actualy, i got no lust to read the whole thread again to find out which court it was heard, nitspicker.

[Heretic]

a good way to get rid of the Camphor Laurel ....

[kindness]

Yeah but don't only remove them ;P

[woof woof woof]

The only thing I don't like is the chem pollution that pill production causes. Many people have been known to dump their used chems in the environment.

Maybe they can get these guys a job as lab assistants or something..... or work as lab rats... bwahahaha

I'm glad to hear they didn't get big jail time. (what about the cocaine and LSd..?) or did they dismiss that too?

[Torsten]

How would it have been a precedent?

I can't remember what court this was in, but if it is a higher court then it is binding on all lower courts in that state. eg a district court ruling binds all magistrates. While a lower court ruling is not binding on other magistrates, it is generally regarded as poor form for magistrates to deviate much from the precedent unless there is good reason.

As this was the first case dealing with the manufacture of safrole from a local source and as this was the only evidence towards the conspiracy charge, a precedent would have been sent on both issues. eg someone with 10 sacks of nutmegs and a still would have had much less certainty.

Keeping in mind that the reason for the safrole was that they were actually producing cosmetic grade camphor oil [which has to be safrole free] and the safrole was just a waste product they had neglected to dispose of appropriately!!!

[planthelper]

The only thing I don't like is the chem pollution that pill production causes. Many people have been known to dump their used chems in the environment.

the pharma companies are said to be the biggest polluters, i know it's true, i saw it on tv, hehehe.

[Bigred]

Thanks torsten , The only case i know of safrole was in qld and it was a non indite able offence, basically a summary

charge . it was classed as things used in conjunction with a criminal offence .ie glass ware, lab apparel .

What would be the current legal status of it

[Torsten]

possession is about 80% of the penalty as possession of mdma in most states. I guess they are assuming that it can yield up to 80% conversion.

[Weazelloph]

good to hear they are making mdma instead of some of the rubbish i hear they are putting in the current pills.
I'm not saying its good to hear the general public are maiking it but i believe it is alot safer and healthier to be producing safrole than to be producing "ice" & "speed" in dodgy ways ie. shake & bake, stove top then propucing pills using fillers then giving em' to the public.

i'm worried now about my avocado trees, as they also contain safrol, in the leaves.

the judge had to be spot on, otherwise he would never been able to make a precedent case, he would if he had allowed the evidence, be the laughing stock all over the world.

wow that shocked me to read this i've never heard such thing!

[ghosty]

i suppose it would be illegal to make most thai food then. safrole content is very high in plants i use to cook with. cooking them, along with the oils and water used would be an extraction wouldnt it? my body might even reduce them to mdma (is this why i feel so god dambed happy cooking and eating thai food?) then, my food, my cooking pans and me become a drug lab LOL.

god bless silly laws... oh, i recently cut down a pest laurel tree and all that material is piled up on the yard waiting for disposal. is this intent to make XXX compound as i happen to have lab gear for other reasons? hmmm..

[qualia]

yes thats right cooking thai food is illegal

[ghosty]

LOL, well yes, it was a joke. at the expense of stupid precursor laws.. my point being, EVERYTHING is a precursor to something else. even solvents... ban petrol too? i cant even get my octane booster for my legal pitbike anymore, toluene.. a joke.