Hip Hop Bitches, Hoes and Niggaz

[chilli]

Okay, I haven't thought this through much, but I'd love it if some of you could do a bit for me...

I was just thinking about misogynistic lyrics in hip hop music, you probably all know the ones I mean.. the objectification of women and the implied and real violence, sexual and otherwise that is often promoted in hip hop songs and videos.

What is the difference between this kind of thing, and some white guy rapping about "niggers" acting like violent criminal thugs and drug dealers, like he could just say "I'm just talking about niggers who don't respect themselves and who act like niggers"

What's the difference between that and the same kind of attitude towards the dehumanization of women in hip hop?

In case anyone has wet their pants, I love women, hip hop and people of all races, and don't advocate calling anyone nigger.

[Teotzlcoatl]

Watch the "Boondocks" on "Adult-Swim", you'd love it!

"Boondocks TV Show"

[nabraxas]

What's the difference between that and the same kind of attitude towards the dehumanization of women in hip hop?

I aint got much for ya, 'cept to say i don't think there seems to be all that much diff really.

[ThunderIdeal]

"What's the difference between that and the same kind of attitude towards the dehumanization of women in hip hop?"

are we after a smart ass answer? whereas women have no control over their dehumanisation, in this case the rapper has a choice to not 'act like a nigger'.

[Moses]

"I'm just talking about niggers who don't respect themselves and who act like niggers"

how do you act like a nigger?

or

what is a nigger?

this is a wierd word cos it can be used as a term of endearment as well as villification.

stumbld across an interview by oprah on tv one day where she had a handful of top black actors(men/women) and posed the question

"why do you all use that word to describe yourself"? and all the men had no problem with it but all conceded they found the word extremely offensive if used in any other way.

all the women found it offensive used in anyway

and who can forget Jackie Chan in rush hour "Wat's up ma nigga"

I love women, hip hop and people of all races, and don't advocate calling anyone nigger.

as do I

[Teotzlcoatl]

You would all hate me if I said what was on my mind...

Should I do it? Can you not judge?

I love women, hip hop and people of all races, and don't advocate calling anyone nigger.

I agree with 3 out of 4 of those things... and yes, I do like hip-hop/rap.

[JDanger]

You would all hate me if I said what was on my mind...

Should I do it? Can you not judge?

Do it.

And keep it gangsta.

[faustus]

Watch the "Boondocks" on "Adult-Swim"

word nigga

definitely my favourite animation series

[chilli]

I aint got much for ya, 'cept to say i don't think there seems to be all that much diff really.

Good, I thought maybe I'd missed something.

[gromit]

What is the difference between this kind of thing, and some white guy rapping about "niggers" acting like violent criminal thugs and drug dealers, like he could just say "I'm just talking about niggers who don't respect themselves and who act like niggers"

wow, a hip-hop discussion on sab

i sort of agree the two are comparable, but hip-hop started as a form of BLACK expression, not female expression, so any whitey who would use the n word would be totally ostracized from the hip-hop community (if not shot) for using it, especially in that context. (i mean there is a big difference between 'hanging with my niggas' & 'you act like a bunch of niggers."

i think you'd struggle to find a white rapper who would use that word at all (except maybe necro ), but he is not really taken seriously

[chilli]

wow, a hip-hop discussion on sab

i sort of agree the two are comparable, but hip-hop started as a form of BLACK expression, not female expression, so any whitey who would use the n word would be totally ostracized from the hip-hop community (if not shot) for using it, especially in that context. (i mean there is a big difference between 'hanging with my niggas' & 'you act like a bunch of niggers."

i think you'd struggle to find a white rapper who would use that word at all (except maybe necro ), but he is not really taken seriously

Yes, I know... that's part of my point, that it would be unthinkable for a white rapper to say something like that, because of their privileged status as opposed to oppressed black people.

The example I offered was using hyperbole to ask what the difference is when another relatively privileged group, males, use oppressive language towards women, and use similar arguments in an attempt to justify it.

*edit* Why are you so stunned that hip hop would be discussed on this forum?

Edited July 18, 2008 by Sublime Crime

[tardistestpilot]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/N.W.A

[baphomet]

Okay, I haven't thought this through much, but I'd love it if some of you could do a bit for me...

I was just thinking about misogynistic lyrics in hip hop music, you probably all know the ones I mean.. the objectification of women and the implied and real violence, sexual and otherwise that is often promoted in hip hop songs and videos.

What is the difference between this kind of thing, and some white guy rapping about "niggers" acting like violent criminal thugs and drug dealers, like he could just say "I'm just talking about niggers who don't respect themselves and who act like niggers"

What's the difference between that and the same kind of attitude towards the dehumanization of women in hip hop?

In case anyone has wet their pants, I love women, hip hop and people of all races, and don't advocate calling anyone nigger.

"Man pimpin aint dead, these hoes are dying to be lead, but who's to lead 'em, talk shit to 'em and BEAT them?"

- Glorified dirty little (self proclaimed) nigger known as snoop doggy dog.

"If your bitches talk shit I'll have to put the smack down!"

- Another glorified, dirty little (self proclaimed) nigger known as Dr dre

Want more? I can try and remember some about rape, etc if you like but can you please tell me why? Are you going to do something with this infomation?? If people knew what these filthy cunts were all about they would be FAR less popular IMO! People need to hear this shit but instead snoop doggy dog features in fucking kids movies

Where are the feminists when you need 'em? Germaine Greer is always sticking her nose in where it doesn't belong and annoying the shit out of people just to get publicity but says nothing about anything that really matters, feminism used to be a strong force for change but now it is as about as useless as a used roll of toilet paper! They used to crack the shits over men opening the door for them and march in the streets but now they put up with all this talk of bashing women, glorifying prostitution, being labeled "bitches" and having the most degrading things said about them and having these ideas reinforced into the minds of their children at an age where they are willing to freely accept it.

Not just the feminists but white people in general have become a weak useless bunch of politically correct morons with a misplaced sense of guilt! That is why they allow their kids to listen to music that likens them to "white meat" and promotes the indiscriminate killing of white people! But they throw a fucking hissy fit when anyone says anything about black people (whether it is true or not), they promote racism against whites and in the form of things like the 'Affirmative Action Program'!

Here in Australia we have bleeding heart softcocks promoting racism against non aboriginals in the form of concessions made to aboriginals whilst claiming to be against racism... fuking idiots!!!

it would be unthinkable for a white rapper to say something like that, because of their privileged status as opposed to oppressed black people.

"Opressed black people"? GTF outa here! Slavery ended 143 years ago! they have no one to blame but themselves!! But many of them like to blame everything on the white man, other immigrants such as koreans live in the same neighborhoods and start off with even less in many cases but due to hard honest work they usually own the local corner store in no time and send their kids through college! I am generalising and I know it but if the black people in these neighborhoods were a little smarter, more honest and hard working, had a stronger sense of morals, stopped stealing from and murdering their fellow man and stopped selling crack to their mothers, then maybe they would get somewhere?

"but hip-hop started as a form of BLACK expression, not female expression, so any whitey who would use the n word would be totally ostracized from the hip-hop community (if not shot) for using it, especially in that context."

Hip hop started in the starecases of the brownsville projetcts (built by "whitey") by a bunch of fucking crackheads! Ask People like Doloris Tucker if she feels represented by these filthy lttle cunts!

BTW This "whitey" doesn't give a fuck about the hip-hop community and if some "n" called him "whitey" he would bust a cap in their ass quick smart

"i think you'd struggle to find a white rapper who would use that word at all (except maybe necro ), but he is not really taken seriously"

That's because white rappers define the word 'tryhard' and are nothing but a bunch of (edited for the sake of political correctness) Fuck I hate wiggers!!!

BTW necro is just a deranged jewish crackhead who has no talent at all! No wonder he is not taken seriously!!

Edited February 23, 2009 by baphomet

[Teotzlcoatl]

You would all hate me if I said what was on my mind...

Should I do it? Can you not judge?

Do it.

And keep it gangsta.

Are y'all sure?

I don't even think I need to... looks bophomet already did...

I will add a side note tho... Theres alot of good people of every race, and a little bad, just as every community has it's "low-lifes", every race has it's "niggers".

Edited July 18, 2008 by Teotz'

[blizznshot]

I dunno, I think a lot of this is based on the premise that the objectification of women is accepted by the Hip-Hop community at large. I don't agree with this. The best rappers...the founders of Hip Hop...are largely against misogynistic "rap."

Gangstarr, KRS One, Pete Rock, all the members of the Native Tongues (Tribe, De La, etc), not to mention Jeru the Damaja and the other Brooklyn Gutter Rats or even RUN DMC, to name a few.

In the words of Gangstarr:

Listen yo, the best way, it ain't always the fast way

And yes the best way, it ain't always to act nasty

I'll open up the door always before you pass me

Baby Doll, because you're royalty

[baphomet]

Yea KRS one says that black women are royalty and also says that white people are "white meat" and refers to them as "Devils".

For eg: "White meat carrying a bag of some sort, life is short white meat is quickly caught, like mother africa white meat is violated, we quickly dissapear like santas little elves and go into an area to fight amongst ourselves, we say peace 'cause thats what we really want, a piece of the pie that america flaunts"

"OH YEA! thats what you say when you see a devil down OH YEA! thats what you say when you take the devils crown!"

So some rappers don't openly condone the degradation of women? So what, most do!! Especially the most popular ones that children are listening to!!!

[ThunderIdeal]

i'm a bit out of my leage here, but ganststa rap has probably been popular since NWA. heaps of rap is not gangsta rap. i've never heard any aussie hip hop, for instance, that could be taken as gangsta rap. don't let a few bad apples ruin the whole damn bunch - that would be like me hating metal because many metal bands are meat head demon worhsipping fucking retards. it's an insult to all of the intellectual metal bands out there, and some of the most intellectual lyrics i have EVER heard came from black rappers, NO FUCKING DOUBT ABOUT THAT my friends.

[blizznshot]

And where does Kris's disdain towards the white establishment play into misogyny?

In the last KRS show I went to (last month), he actually did a whole history of the word "Devil." It doesn't refer to white people overall, it refers to the establishment and has roots in the concept of Babylon.

IMO, rap does not equal hip hop. Maybe I'm splitting hairs, and getting away from the OP, but it soils a way of life for many to say "Hip Hop conveys this because everyone listens to Snoop Dog and Lil Wayne," when the real statement should be "Look at these imposters trying to make a buck by disrespecting women and each other under the heading of Hip Hop."

I'm just trying to set the record straight here.

[ThunderIdeal]

you have my vote. i may judge people who take gangsta rap very seriously, but it shouldn't really consider into my general view of a race, african american or aboriginal.

[nabraxas]

People need to hear this shit but instead snoop doggy dog features in fucking kids movies

Slavery ended 143 years ago! they have no one to blame but themselves!!

They used to crack the shits over men opening the door for them and march in the streets but now they put up with all this talk of bashing women, glorifying prostitution, being labeled "bitches"

RAOTFLMAO

drop it like it's hot

[baphomet]

IMO, rap does not equal hip hop. Maybe I'm splitting hairs, and getting away from the OP, but it soils a way of life for many to say "Hip Hop conveys this because everyone listens to Snoop Dog and Lil Wayne," when the real statement should be "Look at these imposters trying to make a buck by disrespecting women and each other under the heading of Hip Hop."

I'm just trying to set the record straight here.

I think you are just an apologist and what you are doing does amount to splitting hairs and is intentionally so for the purpose of propaganda.

Because a few people, ancient relics of hip hop are apparently not sexist, etc does not excuse it as a whole! The names you quoted are all "old school" and couldn't get away with what rappers do now 'cause they would have been fucking lynched!

You talk about gangstarr and KRS1 not being misogynist, well maybe not but many others who appear on their albums and whom they promote are! As are 99% of all hip hop artists (and I use that word loosely)! What you are trying to say is that those who you deem to be real hip hoppers are the only real ones who represent hip hop and the others whom the rest of society considers to be hip hoppers are not, gimme a fuckin break!! According to you only .0001% of those calling themselves hip hoppers are the real thing and the rest are impostors? So Tony Touch and his band of misogonists from brownsville projects are not the real deal because you say so? GTF outa here!

"And where does Kris's disdain towards the white establishment play into misogyny?"

It doesn't, just shows that he is a racist!

"In the last KRS show I went to (last month), he actually did a whole history of the word "Devil." It doesn't refer to white people overall, it refers to the establishment and has roots in the concept of Babylon."

Bullshit! He uses it in the same context as malcom x and makes no secret of this (except when he is trying to convince a bunch of wiggers paying to see his show maybe?)

"look at malcom-x and try to be that or get lost if you can't pick up where malcom-x left off"

-Racist rapper krs1

He made a song called free mumia (a black panther leader who is in jail for killing a white man) in which his co rapper says: "Kicking vowels is how we release the tension, until we start to bounce white people like suspension" no mention of the "establishment there buddy!

[ThunderIdeal]

man i didn't want to believe you were full of shit, but i think you are. what the fuck do any of us know about it sitting here in australia anyway?

[baphomet]

 

Are you alright?

[blizznshot]

Jeez man, no need to get all worked up like that.

I disagree, whatever. Take it back a notch. No need to bring this to where it seems to be going.

It's a freaking matter of opinion on all our parts!

edit: Wiggers?!?! That's about as ignorant as it is trollish. What do you know about the Eastern Live Hip Hop Scene?

Edited July 18, 2008 by blizznshot

[ThunderIdeal]

i was a over stimulated.

sorry man but some of your views are so hateful and in such a generalising way. maybe your views on the middle east are valid but this saying that hip hop is 99.9% misogynistic can't possibly be true. it bugs me because

"and some of the most intellectual lyrics i have EVER heard came from black rappers"

i'm not making that up. what are rappers, they are a bit like lyrical athletes or something, it's very lyric oriented, and some of them have come out with some good stuff just in my tiny experience..... and the scene is not limited to just the united states anyway, are you going to say the same things for the UK and aussie hip hop scenes? cuba? and anywhere else where hip hop is huge (there are bound to be more).

and since we're talking about the 0.1% of rappers that you see in music videos..... why are so many of them women?

edit: it bugs me because i resonate with quite a bit of what you say. it's like you need to listen to "imagine" a few more times.

Edited July 19, 2008 by ThunderIdeal