Is my pup monstrose?

[MORG]

This is my first ever cactus. I got it in Febuary (thanks Wandjina )and it's put on a bit of growth since then (probably about 2cm, he's currently around 5cm).

I was told it was most likely a T. peruvianus. The growth looks weird though, almost etiolated. You can see there's no real hint of a rib structure.

What do people think? Is my pup a freak or not?

Edited July 30, 2006 by MORG

[Dirty Old Man]

I don't know if its monstrose but its definitely some kind of freak.

[strangebrew]

Yeah that's pretty wack. To soon to say if it's starting to sort itself out or not.

Keep us posted, could be special.

[PD.]

It almost looks like a TBM, but darker green.

Very strange.

[AndyAmine.]

Yep, its a TBM if you ask me..

[genki]

it does look quite like a TBM. as its a small cutting dont worry about the new growth being thinner than the base, it will most likely thicken as it adds more height

[Alice]

Wandjina, do you have a photo of the mother plant this pup came from? perhaps you can shed some light? awesome cacti Morg

EDIT: spelling

Edited August 1, 2006 by Alice

[dqd]

I had the pleasure of receiving an identical pup from Wandjina some time ago . Although a slow grower pre-warmtime it's shown itself to be a TBM for sure, but pupping from the very head rather than mid or basal (very cool ). I have plants from 3 other sources and none of them have shown this characteristic. Thanks P!

[strangebrew]

De_Quinceys_Dream Posted Yesterday, 10:03 AM

I had the pleasure of receiving an identical pup from Wandjina some time ago . Although a slow grower pre-warmtime it's shown itself to be a TBM for sure, but pupping from the very head rather than mid or basal (very cool ). I have plants from 3 other sources and none of them have shown this characteristic. Thanks P!

Can we get positive confirmation that this plant is TBM or maybe a photo from you De? I would've thought Wandjina'd know what a TBM was.

Both of these pups (Morg's & DQD's) look and sound as if they're pupping from the tip. This would be a first for a TBM yeah?

[Tripitaka]

I would've thought Wandjina'd know what a TBM was.

I think Penny's pretty informed!

Edited August 3, 2006 by Tripitaka

[dqd]

Can we get positive confirmation that this plant is TBM or maybe a photo from you De? I would've thought Wandjina'd know what a TBM was.

Both of these pups (Morg's & DQD's) look and sound as if they're pupping from the tip. This would be a first for a TBM yeah?

Certainly haven't seen it happen before, that's for sure . Don't have a digital camera myself but Alice Dee may be able to help out, I'll send a messy ( that doesn't quite sound right ), otherwise I'll have to wait for the eldest to get home. I respect your knowledge Wandjina and am just as happy to be wrong as right , just giving my unskilled opinion strangebrew . A good day all...

[transDiMenTional]

Certainly haven't seen it happen before, that's for sure . Don't have a digital camera myself but Alice Dee may be able to help out, I'll send a messy ( that doesn't quite sound right ), otherwise I'll have to wait for the eldest to get home. I respect your knowledge Wandjina and am just as happy to be wrong as right , just giving my unskilled opinion strangebrew . A good day all...

Funny cos i was just thinkin of u this morning De! And also another funny coincidence; one of my TBMs looks as if it is pupping from the tip!!! First time ive seen anything like it... I will post sum picks of my TBM and i will try to get up to ur place with a camera today De. Will beep U ;)

[transDiMenTional]

P.S Where are u Wandjina? We wanna know what the mother plant looks like

I personally dont think the plant in question is a TBM, just doesnt look right.

[dqd]

Looking forward to it

[teonanacatl]

See at the base of the central spine in one of the pictures how the base of the spine is enlarged, this is indicative of kk242 or peruvianoid/cuzcoinoid plants. Looks monstrose to me, some of my seedlings showed that but then grew as normal as they got older.

[MORG]

P.S Where are u Wandjina? We wanna know what the mother plant looks like

I don't think she's looking here...

I've sent a pigeon so she should drop by soon and perhaps shed some light.

[wandjina]

just got your pm morg...thought I felt my ears burning

sorry guys...didn't see this thread.

Yeah, the mother plant is a funny one...and truth be told I don't know for certain what she is...your guess is as good as mine. She's only small, but pups like a champ!!! She looks just like morgs, only larger and pups base.

Three more on her at present, and a couple more out and about in the garden.

Sorry, but no camera, so no photos. I'll try and borrow one eh?

But I can't take all the credit here...she originally came from planthelper...maybe he might know...although I'm pretty sure I've asked and he wasn't sure.

I wonder if he remembers where he got her from?

can we chase down the source?

so glad you like her morg...obviously you're taking very good care of her...grown heaps!!!

Edited August 6, 2006 by wandjina

[Sebas]

I can't help but think it's just TBM short clumping type, but with some non-standard growth.

Don't know if these shots are useful in any way.

[AndyAmine.]

IMO she is only pupping from the tip because she has sustained some damage there?

If you look close you can see some damage, like a scratch or something. its common for TBM's to pup from the tip if they get a damaged meristem. and this growth can often become long and phallic-esque

Here is a TBM of mine that got one of its tips nibbled on by a rat that I posted some pictures of in another thread. its really dehydrated in this pic but she is nice and plump now and powering on.. still no sign of converting back to the clumping style growth either.,.

http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/inde...&hl=phallic

http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/inde...ost&id=1204

Edited August 6, 2006 by AndyAmine.

[MORG]

She greeted the growing season with a flush, but as you can see she's had a run-in with what I believe to be a reckless mollusc.

There were no witnesses.

Any further thoughts as to her identity?

[planthelper]

i just read this thread for the first time...

all that i know is that i gave wandjina a normal tbm pup.

the specimen must have morphed or the pup in question was geneticly different to the rest of the plant.

wandjina does your specimen show the same unusual puping from the top?

anyway lets hope this trait is permanet and doesn't revert back into it's original form.

if down the track any of you have a pup of this kind to spare, i gladly rise my hand, no i go even better, please if it ever happens.

anyway my source of this tbm was sab, (with the voice of a sport moderator) it's back to you torsten.

morg u are a lucky man!

[MORG]

Here she is 2.5 years on.

I'm a little worried about those orange spots I noticed the other day... maybe rust?

[Ace]

OMG - that's one awesome mostrose bridge! Almost certainly a new form in Aus (IMO at least) but definately bridgesii-esque. Looks a lot like the unusual 'other' TBM forms (such as clone C) that are becoming more common in the US and EU. I'm IDing purely on colour, rib structure, spine structure and general form - TBM thru and thru - just not the typical clumping aussie clone.

In regard to the rusty spots - I'd ease right off with watering cos I think its a sign of a little too much. It could be a number of other things too, but I'd put my money on excessive water uptake thru the cold period.

If it were me (which it sadly is not) I'd slice the top inch off and graft it to pachanoi. That will increase growth speed on the cutting and also encourage pups to form. This however will change the growth style due to the pup/s (making it a branching specimen, not a single column - but it may eventually do that anyway), but it will pay off by increasing biomass (also reducing risk of losing the clone to rot or other nasties). Plus, you will be able to share the clone with the rest of us if she starts pupping jks

[apothecary]

So it's just a TBM? What makes you say it's almost certainly a new form Ace?

You can clearly see in the original photos it is a standard growth TBM which suffered some apical damage. planthelper has clarified this is just a clone of a clone of a clone a SAB TBM plant.

My guess the only difference is environmental conditions and ravaging by insects or animals. I doubt there is anything truly unique or new about it.

[Ace]

Thanks for that info Sina - I hadnt realised that planthelper clarified on the matter (and looking back now it looks like I totally missed his post ). I was thinking clone C because of several pics on the nook that look a lot like that fella there. I could be letting my imagination run (it appears I am), but I think it looks like several I've spotted while reading over there.

I wonder perhaps if the clone c could be just a mutant form of the aussie TBM (like what happened with Morg)? Maybe this one come in contact with some sort of nasty (when the tip was damaged) that triggered columnar growth instead of clumping? I dunno about how it all happened, but it does seem to be permanent (well no signs of reverting yet). It'll be interesting to see it in a few more years, thats for sure.