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The Corroboree

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I've written a few things on here from time to that people have taken offence to. I believe that what I've said has been taken out of context by people who know nothing about me. These people have taken objective statements I've made and put their own twist on it to score cheap points.

I was going to make this thread a poll but that seemed like a childish way to "score points" as well.

If you really think I'm racist or xenophobic then ponder this & then chime in. I'm sure you'll have to express your moral superiority again.

When I went to school the main interaction I had with my old man was whenever he bashed me. One year it came the point where he decided that I wasn't allowed to play football anymore. I was quite a gifted rugby league player at the time, so in effect he shut my entire life down.

Upon hearing that, the father of another player in my team wouldn't accept that and he paid my fees for the year and took me to all the games. This man is an Australian Aboriginal, he became more of a father to me than my dad ever was. If anyone is interested his son went on play football for the Newcastle Knights. Before and after that happened, I got into many physical altercations sticking up for my black mates when they were harassed by white people both on and off the field and at school. One time even involved the parents of the players from another team.

At high school I never stood back and watched someone take a beating that I didn't think they deserved. One time I stuck up for a young Macedonian boy that always seemed to cop the rough end of the stick and as a result I had to deal with 3 year 11 fuckwits (I was in year 9) . I got hurt fairly badly but they were all much worse. Anyway let's just say that no-one at the school ever gave me any trouble after that day.

In the last few years at my kids school, there have been several racially and religiously motivated cases of violence and a few of the kids have been in my kids classes, The cases in point involved an Aboriginal and a Muslim kid. When my kids have told me what's happened I've encouraged them to befriend the kids being victimised and given them moral lessons (in the form of questions) as to whether that is acceptable behaviour. My kids befriended the kids being victimised and stuck up for them and now they have some good friends as a result.

Now if I make a passing comment about something I don't like, I'm a racist. How the fuck am I supposed to describe someone without using the accepted label for what they are without beating around the bush and talking in riddles ?

Is it only acceptable to describe someone from a different race or religion with the appropriate term if you are speaking of them in a positive light even if what you are saying is true ?

Political correctness has gone way too far in this country and now we have a situation where we can't have a negative thought about someone without being slanderously labeled as xenophobe or racist if they aren't from our demographic.

Coming on here and seeing my name dragged through the shit (again) by someone that knows nothing about me has really pissed me off, as that's just not the way I am.

Feel free to lay the boot in again.

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I will answer your question with a question. Have you ever said im not a racist but...

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Hey Sally

I initially missed the comment/post it was that set this off, but I've known you for a while and I don't think you are a 'racist'. You expressed a thought that might have been a bit prejudiced - and that's worth thinking about - but don't beat yourself up too much - I know that you are a good person under that occasionally grumpy exterior.

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I think its best if you dont know someone personally then just dont take their comments as a personal attack

For what its worth ive always thought your a good bloke, and id say everyone else here that knows you would feel the same way

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From memory, there was a thread awhile back (haven't even lurked this site for at least 2 months) about extremist middle eastern people, where you were just eating up that government propaganda like it was young pussy!

So quite honestly, being labeled a racist is probably your own fault for being such a tool for MSM propaganda.

'All' main stream religions are just a way to feel more superior than others.... well preaching complete contradictions and blatantly hateful speech.

Kind of serves you right for being called out as a racist, for believing ISIS is anything else but a creation of western MSM and believing Islam is some how more evil than Christianity.

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i liked paradox's post because it was funny and true, not because i felt that what you said deserved some kind of reprimand.

sally, i agree that things have gone too far if you are racist for expressing fears about a religion or saying that one culture has been ripped off by another.

you're a reasonable and intelligent person, i suggest you just continue being yourself. i don't think you're too bad. if somebody takes issue with your words then a discussion can ensue and we all become wiser or perhaps dumber as a result.

muslims fuckin scare me too sally. so do murricans. and north korea.

Edited by ThunderIdeal
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Hey Sally, I don't think you're racist, I don't really know you at all & it wouldn't be for me to judge you like that.. In that other thread I was just lightheartedly pointing out that I thought your comment was dumb.. As thunderideal said, not because I thought you should be singled out & reprimanded. I didn't think it was a big deal, It was just too easy to call you out on.

if you're confused as to why I thought what you said was dumb then you may not be racist, just a bit ignorant in regards to specific things perhaps.. But that's just my opinion of course..

& it's based on nothing except a bunch of words you typed once that I thought was dumb

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Cheers subby, if that was coming from an intelligent person with the ability to read things and actually comprehend them in the context they were portayed in I"d probably be offended by that.

In case you missed it, I have more reverence for a bessa block than I do for any religion & my opinions on islam were formed over 20 years ago.

I appreciated paradox's post too TI, I could see where he was coming from and from an outside perspective it seemed appropriate. Doublebenno seemed to want to buy into for a cheap swipe and then paradox seemed quite happy to line up with him to have a laugh at my expense after showing some signs of what seemed like fake humility.

I'm a poor man with few resources, all I have is my honour. When someone that doesn't know me tries to diminish that I find it hard to take it on the chin, especially when it's false.

@ Yeti - if it wasn't true about me being "occassionly" grumpy I would have been offended by that observation. Coming from you, I can see it was an objective comment :rolleyes:

Maybe this where I'm heading ?

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Cheers subby, if that was coming from an intelligent person with the ability to read things and actually comprehend them in the context they were portayed in I"d probably be offended by that.

Yeah, but intelligence and the basic ability of comprehension is all relative, anyway...... I mean, let's face it.

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Sorry you felt that way Paradox, even though I'm a child in this world, I've always looked up to you and appreciated the wisdom in your posts.

I'll never own a patch of terra firma in this country I was born to. Chances are neither will my kids (obviously some baggage there).

I've been screwed by Chinese people by a factor of ten in comparison to aussie swindlers that have taken me for a ride. If telling people that's the case is racist then maybe my time on the internet should end now.

Edited by Sally

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Of course you're racist Sally. Or if you're not, you'd be a rare egg indeed. We all are. I certainly am. The human brain is a great machine for finding patterns - generalising people by race is just one example of the prejudices that can result from our overactive pattern-finding. Like other logical flaws, it can take self-awareness plus alot of training to overcome. So some people don't act racist or make racist comments, maybe some of them don't even have racist thoughts, but this is because they've trained themselves not to. And before anyone says it, no, I am not making a biological-determinism argument excusing racist fuckwittery. It might stem from a natural source, but so do many kinds of douchewad behaviour. I'm just saying maybe it's time to stop denying it, just own the fucken mess, and move on towards fixing it. What do they say - the first step is admitting you have a problem?

On the topic of logical flaws though Sally, your OP is one. Saying "I'm not prejudiced against race A because I like people from race B" makes even less sense than the "I'm not prejudiced against A, some of my best friends are A" argument. It's like saying "I can't possibly be racist because I like all the Beatles equally"

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(This was posted in another thread but I thought I'd respond here because it was a useful topic & I didn't want to derail it further.)

I'm just the villiage idiot - haha . Stand in a circle and revel at my dumb comments for now, there won't be any more.

What do you mean? You're not leaving over this are you? People say dumb things sometimes. Sometimes it'll be you, and sometimes it'll be the people telling you that you're dumb. But if you storm off every time someone tries to call your bullshit, you'll eventually be left with... well, I'm not sure exactly, but I imagine some very boring conversations. Take a deep breath, with nicotine in it if necessary, take a break for awhile if you want, but think about whether you want to give up everything good this site represents because you're having a bad day. As far as I can tell, this whole thing was about 90% joking, 9% lighthearted pisstake, and 1% Subbie, so why get all hot & bothered?

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I'll join the grumpy old cunt club Sally....lol

As for Subby....lol.... well some may remember his racist rants that were deleted.

I do, and they were out and out racist. Some of the worst poison I've seen on here for a while.

I'll go back to back with any man of honour :wink:

I don't think you are racist, and yes its all fckn PC now. I also agree with some of your points on Islam.

I'm not here to argue about religions but.

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i think racism is a bad word thats banied around wayy too much, i encounter racism at least every couple of days and to be honest i dont fkn care as most of the time is someone that dont know me trying to make some kind of connection. Without a friendship with a person, the only way to make any kind of connection is a gereralisation based on first impressions. in lots of cases thats racism, but is it wrong? i dont think so unless its with some kind of predjudice

Gingers make me horny, so i guess im racist too.

Predjudice against people you dont know for any reason is whats wrong, not my love of the firecrotch

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Good points anodyne.. A friend of mine said the same thing to me a long time ago. We're all inherently racist.. Whether it's cultural or instinctual or a little bit of both.. She said it's not that you're racist that matters, it's how hard you choose to work on it..

I didn't mean to open a can of worms & I didn't mean to offend you so much Sally, I have really enjoyed your posts too.. We're all just children in this world hey man & I think if you're talking about leaving then that's really silly & think most people would miss your input.

I meant what I said as a passing jibe as I just couldn't let that one slide.. I've said all sorts of dumb things on these forums & off, don't worry bout that!

Of course there's a lot of dodgy arse Chinese business men. Everyone probably knows that.. Just as a large proportion of business people from any where on earth are totally dodgy. Seeing as there's more Chinese people on the planet than any other & considering the economic realities of china quickly becoming a ginormous superpower ie there are huge numbers of Chinese people who can now afford to go into business who have come from poverty etc, there's a fair chance just statistically that a businessperson that ripped you off May be Chinese.. I have a very good Chinese friend who is now an Australian citizen & the way he talks about modern mainstream Chinese culture is horrifying.. If he were white he would be considered a hardcore racist.. Even though he's extremely proud of his heritage, he is the greatest critic of modern china I have ever encountered.. Just like I probably might be considered if I weren't white & expressed my views of 'western civilization'..

This guy also happens to be one of the smartest & trustworthy people I've ever met..

It's a complex issue, but it's a very different thing to using a single word 'westerners' to define hundreds of millions of people who in this context (I'm sure you don't really mean it that way but that's what your words say) are all being ripped off by 'the Chinese' (billions of individuals).. Global politics are complex & you are well in your right to be concerned about whatever you choose to be of course.. It's just if you use your words carelessly, in this case it is to generalise about close to half the human population of earth then I just can't help but comment..

Quite obviously to anyone who has many Chinese friends, not all Chinese people buying property in Australia are dodgy people ripping off westerners..

If they're all so dodgy then who're these dumb westerners that are so happy to sell it to them?

It was just too easy to call out because western civilization has for many thousands of years been responsible for the worst of the worst of ripping people off.. For the first time in a long long time the west perhaps is beginning to get a bit of its own medicine so to speak.. But at this stage in history, casting westerners as the innocent victims is a hilarious idea..

Anodyne is right, my comment was just an offhand one.. 90% good humour, 5% me feeling your comment was a bit dumb, 5% I can't keep my trap shut when I feel that way & 100% no idea I was opening a can of worms.. But I guess it's an issue pretty much everyone on earth can relate to in some way & it's a struggle we all have to go through so maybe it is good it has now become a discussion..

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I agree WB. And I really agree with Hillbilly - that's why I talked about prejudice, not racism.

Making a broad generalisation on the basis of finite information/experience can be prejudiced. Even with perfect information, if it's a finite sample, you can only talk about probabilities, at best. In the case of people of a particular ethnic or religious background, they could be a lot more like you or I than you think - you don't know for sure until you get to know them. I say this for other people's information - I wasn't going to lecture Sally on this, because he knows this already (because he isn't an idiot).

Making flawed inferences on the basis of (probably) dubious information is something that many people do - including many people here, myself included. All you can do is try to be mindful of what you are thinking and why you are thinking it.

I don't want to start telling people what's what. On reflection, I think that's a piece of self-deception - I really do want to. Sort of. Either way, it's hard to to resist :blush:, especially when I see the word 'propaganda'. So I'm going to say what I think and if people don't like it, and want to get all upset because they think it's a bit preachy, they can get bent.

A big part of (what I think is) the real problem here is not just that Sally expressed prejudice. It's at least partially how he stated it, and how people reacted. Someone saying something you disagree with does not justify being unkind to that person. Ask yourself, when you think someone is wrong, do you want to hurt them, or do you want to help them?

At the risk of sounding a bit wet, maybe we could all T.H.I.N.K:

Before you speak/type, ask yourself -

T - is it true?

H - is it helpful?

I - is it inspiring?

N - is it necessary?

K - is it kind?

Not sure of the origin of this (have seen it attributed to various sources, ranging from Ephesians 4:28 to Noam Chomsky), but I'm not sure that it matters.

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Very true yeti.. If I may I will just say that I don't think I was being unkind. I made an impersonal sarcastic joke about the comment who's sole purpose was to lightheartedly point out the irony jn his statement. After Sally took that personally, which I can understand.. I wrote another reply & when I posted it I saw doublebenno had said almost exactly what I had posted, which I then acknowledged. This gave the impression we were ganging up on him, which definitely wasn't my intension at all.

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Sorry to be a drama queen boys.

I need a break

I'll see you on the flipside

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No worries bro, we've got your back!

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Don't stay away too long.

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I've never noticed any of Sally's posts with a racist tone?

Racism and homophobia is just dumb, and I'd like to think dally is none of those.

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You are not a racist Sally me lady *tips beanie and does a wee jig ..........with heel clicks an all :) Paradox just was doing what he does - remember how steamed he got over what is a meme :o....and he has every right to.....i like the idea of a sab democracy.

Anywho, having had many open discussions in pm with Sally, i'd say you seem a tad touchy over some other shit in your life and what Paradox said just set off the alarms in your head.

Both of you chaps are excellent contributors here and i've learned much from both of you.

No shit.

If per chance you require some R&R Sally - just take it mate but please don't go awol because of some lexical semantic mixups.

I mean , please don't leave us to used and abused by the whim of people like olive and his crazy meme thread :wink:

That thread has made me platz on so many occasions i reckon my keyboard is on it's last legs.

Hope you feel better/stronger/higher soon Sally.

It's alright guvnor, keep your hands on the wheel.

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i find channeling all my hatred towards global human misunderstanding of words to be an effective strategy to ward off those lingering shreds of racial prejudice i still haven't worked through yet..

Actually i'm full of shit, i was just having a shitty arsed day & figured being a tard over something pretty meaningless online was preferable to harassing an innocent person who was actually in front of me.. Funny how that seems to be pretty much the case whenever someone has a spaz on the forum..

pretty cool we actually do care about each other pretty well round here..

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