psychedelics and mental health

[alien]

From erowid: Individuals with a family history of schizophrenia or early onset mental illness should be extremely careful because psychedelics have been known to trigger latent psychological and mental problems.

I was planning on going to Amsterdam and I wanted to try some mushrooms while there but now im a bit concerned as I have bipolar. My psychatrist tells me I need to stay away from psychedelics because they will trigger problems with me (mainly make me manic). I actually dont just have Bipolar, I have an anxiety disorder aswell and paranoia (there is some conjecture as to whether or not im actually Schizoaffective rather than bipolar).

Schizophrenia runs in my family I believe. My Aunty is schizophrenic, my other Aunty has had 3 breif psychotic episodes and my Grandmother has also had a breif psychotic episode.

Pot makes me really paranoid hence why I havent smoked it in so long and if I go to Amsterdam I think i might be tempted into smoking it again. My paranoia is almost gone since I have been on anti-psychotics. Im just curious also, wouldnt the anti-psychotics that I am on prevent a mushroom trip or a trip with DMT or anything like that as they use them to pull people out of a bad trip? I think they usually use Largactil to pull people out of trips dont that? God that drug is horrible. I hated being on that.

I also have pretty bad anxiety which I am sure most of you have read in my previous posts lol. I take benzo's regularily to stop it.

I think if I was ever to take something like mushrooms or acid Id be terrified and have a bad trip because of my paranoia. I have this thing with my paranoia where I think everyone is trying to poison me (its much better now since I have been medicated but I still keep a close watch on my drinks). But there is some truth to this i was drugged by a so called "friend" once with some speed that he put in my drink. When I was younger I took ecstacy and that gave me panic attacks and I ended up just crying thinking I was going to die.

Maybe I should just grow spiritual plants and appreciate their beauty (legal ones of coures, which is what Im doing now). I guess it would be crazy to try anything overseas anyway considering Id be away from my family and wouldnt have people to look after me. Id hate to end up in a psych ward overseas.

Anyone here relate to what im saying? Amulte I need yr help Thanks and take care.

[alien]

Another thing, I really dont like speedy drugs. I guess because I get so speedy when Im manic. I figure its similar to being on ecstacy for me, but without the crying lol. I dont sleep for weeks, im scattered, all I think about is sex. arghh.

Its not fun though. Hypomania is kind of more enjoyable i would say as its not so intense but when I get manic i start to halucinate and think everyones out to get me. Please dont think im dangerious or anything like that, Im 100% non violent even in these states. I just kind of keep running away from everyone. I think the mentally ill get a bad wrap in the press but i dont know. When I was hospitalised there was this one dude who was bipolar that made me sick. He would go and beat people up he could find on the street when he was manic, and he had no remorse he just blamed it on his illness.

I think ill just work on my garden for a while and keep trying to quit smoking lol.

Take care

[alien]

I baught some "lion's tale" from earthbpod a while back, is this a relaxing herb?

[alien]

lol the avitar i just added is me when im having an anxiety attack lol

[apothecary]

DomoKun!

[Rev]

watch out for too much weed or stuff thats too strong

i do think weed is a good thing for most dont get me wrong, like beer is a good thing for most im moderation and with periods of non usage.

time after time i see people going under with it (esp guys in teen to early 20's)

losing the plot and exhibiting unusual behaviour that mimics some psychosis but usually they dont make the connection though they do exp the distress. Which insnt suprising when we have 2 conflictiing extreme ideologies between cannabis culture where the plant is a panacea (& natural and safe) and the official reefer madness propaganda.

I usually recommend to them leaving off the smoke a couple of weeks and when theyve taken the advice there has always been an acute improvment in focus

I already tend to be a bit unfocused which is why ive found total abstinence is the only option lest i fall back into the eternal haze again

im not going to offer any other real advice. but ill say if i was in your situation i would prob only try shrooms and then in a low/mod dose and in a safe familar environment (where being manic is OK) with a close friend - not some overseas location.

[jasemateau]

i reccomend NOT to go to amsterdam full stop.

coz the cafés are every where and the menus are very inticing.

i dont smoke mj but seriously thought about it once reading the menus.

shroom shops are a bit further apart in the burbs of amsterdam. them i could'nt resist :D :D :D

but traveling and doing these things means you must be fully aware of the concequences. holland may have there eyes close with legislation of mj.

but perhaps imagine what kind of yellow house you may end up in.

parts of the main streets in amsterdam are full of wierd critters. and if they have'nt made it to the yellow house.

it could very well be the closest thing to hell i would imagine.

it's your decsion, choose wisely

[Northern Gnome]

alien:

lol the avitar i just added is me when im having an anxiety attack lol

I can't comment on mj, have stayed way from tht kind of thing my entire life, well, I tried it when I was a young teen and once more a bit later and it just doesn't do anything for me that I find pleasurable, but neither do I like the effects of Alcohol either. To each his own, however I wanted to remark upon your anxiety attack avatar.

I used to have anxiety attacks bad man, I mean bad, but that stopped after I quit eating wheat based products, go figure.

[nabraxas]

have to agree, why go to amsterdamm?

go to india. much cheaper. you wont need shrooms--it's enough ov a head trip.

dope is available--a bit more illegal though, BUT in A'damm you're stuck in a city--i always found it was too many people that drove me psycho; in India you can 'get away from it all' & relax properly.

& yes, anti-psychotic medications should reduce the effects ov any shrooms or grass.

--make sure you take your meds properly labeled w/a letter from your doc., or whatever it is you need these days.

[alien]

thanks people.

what does DomoKun mean????????

[apothecary]

DomoKun is the name of your avatar. Do a images.google.com search

[planthelper]

dear alien,

there is an old topic by myselfe called brainswitch, find it and do the test, if you see the dots dissapearing frequently, we could rule out bi polar for you.

http://www.shaman-australis.com.au/cgi-bin...t=002119#000000

you have to find out which factors trigger, your anxiety and than try to fix them as good as possible. say my fear of dogs, might get better if i work with dogs.

avoid all stress, and surround yourselve with caring enviroment.

i met people diagnosed with schizophrenia, which said selfmedicating with cannabis doe's help them.

on the other hand smoking cannabis whilst beeing psychotic can worsen the feeling, but once the thc wears off the voices or halus will fade back to previous levels.

coffee and all type of uppers, increase the anxiety levels dramasticly, and people like you have to avoid them.

but i believe that a shroom trip could be very benefical, for people with symptoms as described above. but you woud need to surround yourselfe within a beautyfull enviroment, and only with loving caring people around you.

try a very small dose first and wait, if you like it, consume a bit more.

if a trip goes scary, than you have to learn to navigate away from this fearfull parts, and believe me you can learn how to do this, by using somehow your brain and thoughts.

i don't believe in the old idea of the "model psychosis", where lsd and shroom halus get equalled to active psychosis. i have experienced both to a certain degree...

a mushroom trip can go from very scary (and that's the stuff, you learn the most of)to extreemly pleasant within seconds, and i think it's this metamorphosis of scary stuff into, aha now i understand stuff, which is so healing.

lsd in the early days was used to treat schizo, but most trials where done in a wrong way, i guess without any caring loving babysitters and nice surroundings (set & setting!!).

[ 26. March 2005, 10:51: Message edited by: planthelper ]

[apothecary]

I just did that brain switch thing and scored 3. Heh.

[alien]

oh lol i didnt know that about the avatar. Whats it from ? I just found it on a link of avatars at a site didnt say anything about it.

Thanks Planthelper, thats really encouraging. I will do the test on the link u gave me and see the results.

Take care all

[alien]

One more thing. I really dont think there is any doubt that I have bipolar though. I do get manic and depressed. I cycle and have period where I am "normal" too. This all started when I was about 17.

[apothecary]

It's some retarded japanese cartoon. Immensely funny because it's so absurd.

[alien]

lol i just did a search on the avatar pic, cool i like it hehe

[alien]

is it hard to get? lol i might order a copy of it it looks cool.

Are u into anime?

[SunChaser]

Alien mate, I would stay far away from MJ with that information it make’s even me paranoid when I haven’t smoked in are while and I’ve seen friends who are not violent get very violent on it when they have schizophrenia in their family history like I don’t drink alcohol for that reason, I can’t see how doing mushrooms once or twice can hurt they have always kept me calm and there not speedy like acid.

Opium is like a potent hit of MJ except there’s no paranoia to it so I’ve heard but that’s illegal and for some people can be addictive if you use to much so I would not recommend it. Just be careful, and take it easy what ever you end up doing

[spiders]

I would say that MJ often brings out weird shit in some families. My best mate at highschool went very strange - when he tried to quit he lost the plot and tried to kill us with a sword. His brother seriously only had a bout four cones and started talking with a german accent. He was never the same - became very much a paranoid schizophrenic.

On the other hand i have a mate who is bipolar and he smokes to control the symptoms, rather than the opposite.

For me, when i was sick and my nervous system was overactive because of a physical problem, i was anxious as it was, and MJ would make that much worse. I couldnt handle mushrooms either, they made me very anxious. Now im back to normal pretty much ive just started smoking for the first time in a year and its great.

For me, i have always found LSD and weed to have a fairly low possiblity of problems - and nearly all the people ive seen who have problems with weed either stay away from it, or its because of chronic use - and trust me chronic use can make quite a few otherwise normal individuals go rather weird. (i knew it was time to slow down after two years merged into oblivion and i was paranoid my girlfriend was sucking my guitar-playing skills out of my finger)

SHrooms can be rea bad for anxiety - if your anxious, i wouldnt go shrooms - acid is much more relaxed.

[alien]

Thanks guys for the responses. Ive had shrooms before but I cant remember much of it, I was manic at the time and I took 5 valiums which is 25mg of Diazapam and ended up falling asleep. Mind you I had a high tollerance to Benzo's back then so who knows why i fell asleep. If I ever did try shrooms again (where its legal to do so of course!) I would go on the lower end. Would a benzo be good to take with shrooms to calm the anxiety? I have such a fear of having a bad trip. I dont know if shrooms would work on me though considering Im on an antipsychotic at the moment. If i were ever to try shrooms or mescaline would it be best to have some largactil and/or a benzo on hand to bring me out of a bad trip? Thanks

[Thelema]

actually its more likely you will have a bad anxiety attack on a low dose of shrooms compared to a large dose. This is because anxiety results from the force your ego exerts in trying to hold itself together. A large enough dose leading up to a higher scale of ego-loss will eliminate these symptoms.

[alien]

oh serious. Ill keep that in mind if i ever do try it again. would the anxiety be that bad like would it likely make my paranoia worse?

Like tonight I thought my paranoia was under control but its not. I get the most fucked up thoughts. I was in a cafe and this guy walked in. I thought he was coming to kill me. He walked straight out and stood outside which was another reason he was coming to kill me, waiting for me to leave so he could do it. Then he used his mobile so I get these thoughts that hes calling his friends to come kill me. I just wanted to run to my friends car but I tried to hold myself together, I had so much anxiety it wasnt funny. We eventually left and Im home now. I dont know why I get these thoughts. They are crazy I dont like them and I dont understand why i get them. I think they might stem from when I was robbed and chased by a group of people on the train. I dont know. Anyway Id like to say that Id never EVER hurt anyone, even if they were really trying to kill me I dont think I could do anything. I just hate the way sometimes I dont know whats real. It can be horrible.

I feel like my pet rat. She is scared of the dog that my Mum bought. She use to run all over my Mums bed but now she is too frightened and likes to stay in her cage. I take her out and hold her but she shakes and so I pat her to calm her down until she is alright. Id never let anything happen to her but she doesnt know that. I feel as if she is the only thing in this world that I can relate to. Seriously anyone who wants a pet should get rats they are just the best I love my rat so much.

Anyway, Take care

[apothecary]

Relate to me.

When Shihad was touring recently, me and two friends went to the Annandale hotel to see them.

Before I left I smoked a joint. Before I continue this story, I'm telling you the weed I get is very potent (and this isn't one of those lame ass my weed is better than yours things).

When we got there, the support act was quite poor, so we went across the road because one of my friends wanted McDonalds. When she was done, we sat outside for a while, and I lit up again.

We went back in, and I got a beer from the bar. It was pretty packed and we were squashed right into a corner.

As I tend to do, I looked around the room for interesting people to examine (I love doing this, I find myself doing it even at night clubs). My eyes caught onto this guy, I realised he was looking at me.

Every time I looked that way, he'd be looking at me. I thought I'd offended him somehow, and he was waiting for the chance to beat the crap out of me. I looked again, and the guy was talking to his friend, then his friend looked at me.

I thought "fuck" and concentrated on my beer. My mind was racing and I was shit scared. Not even listening to the conversation my friends were trying to have with me.

By this point, I thought I was definitely in for it, I gave up my beer to my friend and tried to calm myself down. It didn't work. My mind took about another 5 minutes, then went into meltdown. It was like I fit 50 thoughts into that last second before it happened and they all led up to "and you're afraid of dying".

Meltdown. I simply walked out. I spent almost half an hour outside trying to calm myself down, the whole while the bouncer was looking at me trying to decide if he would let me back in or not.

The rest of the night was great, mainly because I managed to clear my head from the high, but I will never forget the fear from that corner in the Annandale.

If you were curious, I have never had a paranoia attack or similar on weed before, and have been smoking since I was 15. I'm trying really hard to quit.

My first step was to simply throw away all my lighters. Thats stopped me from smoking alone, and I can only smoke around other people who use lighters.

I recommend that as a first step if you're trying to quit. Throw out all your lighters. Then it doesn't matter if you have a bong or a stash around, because you simply can't use it.

Then a few weeks later, throw away all your papers, so you can't roll joints. That way to smoke you'll need to be around people, and using a bong or pipe or similar. That limits the situations you can smoke in even further.

I'm throwing my papers away tomorrow morning.

[nabraxas]

alien--if you are getting these "paranoid delusions"(---thinking someone is calling their mates to come & kill you, is no mere anxiety), in your "normal" state(--ie: when you're not high), then you are right, you have not got your illness under control.

it's not suprising that this is horrible for you.

i know folks who went through years ov this, & I guarantee it's just as horrible for those that care about you.

i hate to say it, but in the end, the only treatment that seemed to work was taking & sticking to the medication given them by a psych.

if you are getting treatment, it is clearly not adequate---if it were you wouldn't be feeling as bad as you sound. make another appointment for a psych, & be totally honest---if you can't tell the psych your problems - he can't help you.

if you are not seeing a psych, then you really should be.