Conspiracy, synchronicity, the web and "The Movement"

[cycle]

I have some questions but I have to background them a little first.

I'm not partial to conspiracy theories. It's not that I think that the world is good and just or anything it's just I like to see evidence. I don't tend to believe the mass media and in the same way I tend not to believe someone telling me that they have worked out that there are giant mutant potato aliens running things.

I dunno if any of you listen to some of the OS "psychedelic podcasts" like Psychedelic Salon, C-Realm, or other Dopefiend network shows. I do and I have for quite a while. I usually find them to contain really interesting people talking about really interesting stuff (unlike the mainstream media). Anyway I would generally recommend these podcasts as places to find interesting and informed content about plant medicines, permaculture/ sustainability, takes on philosophy and psychology, peak oil, etc.

That is until recently.

Now I don't always get a chance to listen as soon as new stuff comes out. I try to keep up, relatively (within a few weeks), and I try to listen in order of release. But this doesn't always happen. This is where the synchronicity comes in. Presently the universe seems to be hitting me over the head with conspiracy theories. The podcasts I listen to, the books I'm reading, some of the websites I stumble onto... Now I know there's an old psychological argument here: I'm noticing this pattern therefore I'm noticing this pattern. That my awareness is keyed into stuff it wasn't before. Maybe. But I've known about this stuff for a long time and I don't feel like anything in my mindset has changed to make me want to entertain these ideas. In fact I've always been pretty skeptical and cynical about any information that comes my way, particularly dogmatic kinds.

But I haven't had an experience like this before where it was just really really really apparent that there are memes using whatever technology available to them to get at my head. Btw if I was reading this here instead of writing it I might be thinking - dude- manic phase, maybe needs to relax and get some perspective. You'll just have to take my word for it that I'm not exhibiting any other symptoms, maybe a little confusion, but considering the context that seems pretty sensible to me.

Another option is that these (somewhat tightly knit) group of podcasters had a secret meeting and decided to start propagating the idea of secret meetings. I dunno.

So now we come to the crux. Here's how I see it.

1. All the conspiracies are true and the universe is, fairly gently really, trying to wake me up. (I dont like 1.)

2. I'm imagining all of this, making a big deal out of nothing and giving nut jobs WAY too much credit. (I don't really like 2. either)

3. There is a connection between the Psychedelic movement and the Conspiracy crowd. (3. seems the most plausible based on the evidence but my gut tells me the opposite)

Here's a possibility. I think it's fair to say there can be elements of paranoia woven into the psychedelic experience/ psychedelic people. This may be intrinsic to the experience (likely) or as a result of being treated like dangerous criminals by everyone from family-to-freinds-to-police-to-government (also likely). Clearly paranoia (or the shear blinding light of truth) is mixed up with Conspiracy, the two go hand in hand. So there's the link. Except that paranoia is only one part of many aspect of the psychedelic experience and to me the other aspects seem to lead directly away from conspiracy ideas.

Here's the against conspiracy aspects of the psychedelic experience imho

The sense of connectedness.

The direct personal experience of otherness.

A general openess.

I think it's fair to say love is there.

Wellness and healing

And funnily enough a lot of the people who speak out in public in favour of psychedelics seem really rational and intelligent humans.

Also I think that the kinds of people who would tend to want to form an ongoing relationship with psychedelics would be the kinds of people who want direct evidence for their beliefs, preferably from direct experience (The alien told ME that evything was going to be alright) This may all be my own incorrect assumptions though.

Conversely conspiracies tend to be divisive, full of blame and hate and their proponents often seem totally bonkers. But there does seem to be a fair bit of support for a lot of them within the psychedelic crowd.

Maybe the American socio-economic-political upheaval at the moment is pushing harder on the paranoia pedal which is bleeding through into creative expression???

So is there a connection? Or isn't there? Well there definatly seems to be some kind of connection I just don't know what to make of it.

Any thoughts?

[Alchemica]

This is one for printing out and grabbing a Highlighter... I'll get back to you when I can get a good answer! Interesting ideas and definitely worth some consideration.

Edited December 4, 2008 by The Alchemist

[t st tantra]

i believe there is a collective consciousness which all thought arises from..........this is why the same idea often appears in different places at the same time.

astrological time for an idea.....theme.

'it steam trains when its steam train time' r a wilson [approx]

t s t .

[holymountain]

i've been getting into conspiracies over the last year or so and i think this has stemmed directly from the pyschedelic use i've read about...

often i feel as though i'm let into 'head office' of the world and i get to see how things are run and what the plans for the future are and get to watch humanities growth from a more galactic perspective. entities show me the behind the scenes version of life on earth... if that makes sense. it also gives me the greater ability to see through bullshit media propaganda which inevitably leads one on a search for truth and different perspectives... also i guess after you've experienced contact with entities or elves or gnomes or whatever then you start thinking 'fuuuuuuck anything is possible'...which then leads to a more open minded look at conspiracy theories. for example i didn't believe in ufos, supernatural, reptiles etc at all....but after a few encounters with all of the above i'm definitley a bit more open to their existence.... i think we're all building towards an awareness of whats really going on and tools such as psychedelics and the internet are allowing us as a species to work out whats really going on... the other alternative is that i should just chill out and trust my tv.

[holymountain]

edit double post

Edited December 5, 2008 by holymountain

[educate]

I have to agree with The Alchemist...there is a lot in there!

My 2 cents worth>

I understand there can be multi-level theories some blatantly obviously true and those which the opposite. I consider them to be like an onion's skin with me at the centre and there are some directly involving me (emails monitoring, flybuy programs, passport travel, etc) and those on the outside which happen but don't involve me directly (CIA plots to blame the twin tower tragedy on a terrorist act). There are even more further out, like the one about reptiles living amongst us and controlling us subtly. (Trip long enough and you too can see them!)

I minimise my involvement in the monitoring if I can without living in a cave. Holymountain is so right about the TV. I threw mine away years ago because 99% of the content is "bullshit media propaganda". The ones I mentioned "on the outside of the onion" will exist no matter what I do in my life. My life here, now has little involvement in the outcome (although it can be affected by the ripple).

I know that the government builds profiles on everyone, including me through internet information, emails, flight details and possibly other forms. That is how they monitor terrorist threats by monitoring "chatter" as there is a spike in key phrases or words. At the end of the day, I have nothing to hide. I am also a small fish that is not worth anything.

Cycle, have you heard of the "law of attraction"? It IS the buzz phrase around lately. I personally believe in the creation of physical matter from thought (obviously not instantaneous!!). Our bodies are created from our mind, not the other way around! What I am getting at is that if you are thinking of "conspiracy theories" and that thought is held in your mind, then they will appear in your day to day life.

Also, have you ever got a new something, like a red toyota hatch or pink ipod nano or whatever, and then you suddenly notice them everywhere. It is not that they were not there before, it is just that you are thinking of them and you notice them there.

Zeitgeist (the online documentary) puts forward the theory of a one world government. Something like that(if true) is already in motion. I cannot click my fingers and make it go away but I can only shift the direction of outcome through my time on earth and my influence on my path and those that it touches. Actually, that is what this forum is about and that is what things like EGA is for!

[chilli]

Cycle, I know exactly what you mean, I've been experiencing similar things, it makes me wonder of I'm going crazy.

Maybe it's all just in the decoding, but when I show people and explain step by step the kind of overwhelming synchronous symbols and ideas that are bleeding through our culture's every pore they usually can see exactly what I mean and are creeped out as well. Either that, or I really am nuts and they are doing a really good job of humoring me!

I don't know how to explain it, but my personal theories tend to gravitate around a force or principle of global deceit, maybe real people, maybe entities, aliens or archetypes etc. I don't know, but it's getting pretty weird and not showing any signs of letting up!

Glad you brought it up, I've been wanting to post a thread on it for a while, to hear others experiences and impressions.

[baphomet]

Entities, aliens and archetypes?

NEWS FLASH: The world is full of deceit, and it is "real people" behind it. If you can prove that it is reptilians or some other shit like that then go for it, if not then you can watch the truth of the matter unfold in THIS thread as soon as I finish painting the house.

(Hope no one thought I'd forgotten )

[compost]

Dont know who said it.."its a fine line between disillusion and enchantment"

I sympathize with the difficulty of communicating this stuff and remind myself be willing to have fun with these ideas and keep thoughts loose eg. take your thoughts lightly eg. dont believe everything you think! thereby avoiding paranoia and rigid beliefs.

Conspiracy theory > infinite regression.

'Benevolent enigma' are two words that come to mind from someones sig.

[chilli]

Entities, aliens and archetypes?

NEWS FLASH: The world is full of deceit, and it is "real people" behind it. If you can prove that it is reptilians or some other shit like that then go for it, if not then you can watch the truth of the matter unfold in THIS thread as soon as I finish painting the house.

(Hope no one thought I'd forgotten )

Do you even know what an archetype is? I'm not talking about reptilians, also not proposing any of those ideas I mentioned myself. Having said that, I do believe in the *phenomenon* of *apparent* alien/entity contact. What I think about what these phenomena mean is another question altogether, but the phenomena themselves have sufficient proof for me to keep an open mind.

Why does talking to you always feel like an uphill struggle to disabuse you of erroneous assumptions about what I'm saying?

[woof woof woof]

haha....... I have been getting more and more paranoid too! lol!

[baphomet]

Do you even know what an archetype is? I'm not talking about reptilians, also not proposing any of those ideas I mentioned myself. Having said that, I do believe in the *phenomenon* of *apparent* alien/entity contact. What I think about what these phenomena mean is another question altogether, but the phenomena themselves have sufficient proof for me to keep an open mind.

Why does talking to you always feel like an uphill struggle to disabuse you of erroneous assumptions about what I'm saying?

Why don't you break it down real clear for us simple folk who don't know what an archetype is? Don't want you to try explaining archetypes but what you are talking about when you mention aliens, entities & archetypes in relation to conspiracies?

Thanks.

[chilli]

Why don't you break it down real clear for us simple folk who don't know what an archetype is? Don't want you to try explaining archetypes but what you are talking about when you mention aliens, entities & archetypes in relation to conspiracies?

Check out archetypes on wikipedia, especially Jungian archetypes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archetype#Jungian_archetypes

As I said, I wasn't proposing those ideas just mentioning very common ideas others have proposed... I meant it the sense of "well, maybe A, B, C, who knows?" As I said, I believe the phenomena of apparent entity and alien communication is real, but am not sure if its just in our heads (I kind of hope so) or if there is something more mysterious and sinister (as is so often the case). I don't think the "just plain vanilla human animals" model is entirely sufficient as these phenomena span millenia and there seems too much complexity and chaotic artistry to be laid at the feet of just one human or group of humans.

"I don't know what is going on" is my position... maybe nothing, maybe just ultimately biological human cycles repeating, maybe other intelligences. Most of the alien/reptilian/ascended master theories seem wanting to me, and their proponents unstable, ignorant, or just nutjobs but I don't rule the whole idea out as a result...

After all, if the whole world is run on deceit, maybe the people who are closest to the truth would appear the craziest? Maybe they are a smokescreen? Maybe the best way to silence the truth would be to force it to compete with a babel of raving lunatics that use similar terminology? As I said, I like to keep an open mind, especially for things that I and others have such difficulty explaining, coming to terms with and agreeing over.

I also like to keep a little bit of paranoia, cynicism and magical thinking happening, because all individuals and cultures have blindspots. Usually the people who seem most certain are the ones I am most wary of... I think skepticism is only useful if its turned on ourselves and our most axiomatic assumptions and sacred cows first.

Anyway, there are some people who have ideas on these topics that seem quite sane and reasonable, for instance have you ever heard of the work of French scholar Jacques Vallee? Check him out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Vallee

Also, I'm reading a book that made me think of you, you may like it: "Mind Bombs: Exploding Conventional Wisdom" and its written by a journalist called Garrick Alder.

Cheers.

*edit* Having said aaaaall that... I do think the wisest approach with regards to actual practical steps is to deal with what is obvious, which is that us humans are often deceptive and are responsible for some dark and sinister stuff.

Edited December 11, 2008 by Sublime Crime

[t st tantra]

we find ourselves in this physical world........but there is talk of some spiritual existence,afterlife,reincarnation,heaven.......is this the core of this issue?

sorry early morning cognative deficit prevents me finding a better expression for this ,but i hope you get my drift.......

t s t .

[chilli]

tst, the only one that has mentioned any of those things so far is you!

I can't speak for others but it's definitely not what I'm getting at!

[t st tantra]

i still can word it properly.......it seems the situation i refer to could be the basis of the paranoia and feelings of conspiracy......we find our selves in one world we really know little about with talk of a much different world which some people seem to know something about.

any clearer........?

[Vertmorpheus]

be the changes you want to see

[chilli]

i still can word it properly.......it seems the situation i refer to could be the basis of the paranoia and feelings of conspiracy......we find our selves in one world we really know little about with talk of a much different world which some people seem to know something about.

any clearer........?

I'm just talking about the one world we really know very little about.

[compost]

Here is a recent talk from Erik Davis riffing on the idea of the 'visionary' or the 'imagination'. Anyone familiar with him?

http://www.techgnosis.com/chunks.php?sec=j...1-30-2230-0.txt

How what consciousness is, our ability to see patterns, how things inter-relate ARE interconnected with spiritual seeking.

How pattern discernment, desire for imagination/visionary...not handled well by religions.

Also talks bout the idea of belief and how it relates to practice >> a willingness to experiment allows imagination to interact with body/practice then phenom occurs which resonates with whatever you’ve been reading etc..

He briefly speculates on a 'collective agreement' with the way imagination works. And if you have low attention span , the last 5 mins relates to plant helpers...

I find Erik Davis totally far out but still well-grounded in the right mind. Anyone with similar recommendations?? I'd be very interested..