Lophophora PRON

[Torsten]

I was recently invited to have a look at a VERY serious cactus collection with a heavy emphasis on Lophophora. I believe this collection is usually not available for inspection so I felt very honoured and will certainly guarantee the collector's anonymity 100% (ie, don't bother asking who or where). Sadly this collection is not in Australia, but in Asia.

The first pics are of the Loph collection. Each pic is a different bench. I am still getting another film developed which will show the main benches (these are just the small ones).

This is a Loph in a 160mm pot, spilling over the edges.

Here we have Loph williamsii 'Paila'. When I asked the collector about Lophophra giganteum (as sold by Arizona in Victoria) I was told such a species/form doesn't exist, however that it is sometimes erroneously applied to Loph williamsii 'Paila' due to the fact the sngle heads can get larger than any other Loph. This one is in a ~160mm pot. The coin is about the size of an australian dollar coin - maybe a little larger.

And by far the most freaky plant in the collection is a crested Loph. This one is also in ~160mm pot and spills quite a way over the edges. I presume total length would be over 25cm!!

[Evil Genius]

Wow, that´s a pretty serious collection. I don´t know which one´s coolest. All of them are great! bye EG

[hebrew]

hebrew drools over his keyboard

that is impresive

[teonanacatl]

wow nice one. how long they been growing for? id imagine if alot of those are seed grown they are old or perhaps inherited them. Now thats somthing to aim for!!!

though i must say im not to keen on all the different varieties, seems asthough by adding the location name seed retailers can charge more and also make more because you just havta collect the whole set lol

man thats nice.

[occidentalis]

The large headed Paila form is very interesting. I think I got a packet of those in my recent SAB order .

So Torsten, are you enlightened now?

I would think standing in that room would have quite an effect.

[Alice]

speechless.

an exquisite collection

can i ask, is the collection in the hands of an individual?

and how long has this person been cultivating loph's?

and finally, have all (or most of) these been cultivated by the collector, or was the collection acquired?

[Torsten]

creach - in the face of taxonomy having failed dismally in regards to Lophophora I would suggest that collection location data is by far the most relevant naming component - keeping in mind that so far the Loph collection locations have only been applied to fairly different forms (rather than having several names/numbers for a single location as used by Karel Knize).

The current research into seed morphology, shortly to be followed by genetic analysis will focus on these locations rather than on any other parameter. So if you want to make sure to have a somewhat future proof naming system then growing forms of assigned locations is the best investment.

Enlightened? Flabbergasted might be a better term. When I went to see this collector I had no idea he was even a grower. I thought he was a taxonomist and *maybe* had a small collection. As I was being led from one grow house to the next and the next I was just stunned. My immediate response was 'shit, why didn't I bring the good camera?'. So the pics were just done with my holiday happy snap camera, but luckily they turned out OK.

Ahh yes, and jealous might be another term that comes to mind

can i ask, is the collection in the hands of an individual?

and how long has this person been cultivating loph's?

and finally, have all (or most of) these been cultivated by the collector, or was the collection acquired?

More or less one individual, who has been cultivating them for several decades. All locational plants were collected as single specimen from the wild either as plants (several decades ago) or as seeds. The collector is a strong believer in conservation and propagates literally thousands of plants for other collectors and has been doing so for many many years - which took a lot of pressure off the wild plants even before they were protected.

[prier]

INSTABONE!

[jasemateau]

FAAAAAAAAAARK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Gunter]

I love the divirsity of forms, he should breed them.

[Torsten]

I love the divirsity of forms, he should breed them.

he does. although being a taxonomist he puts more value on the pure location forms.

[Gunter]

That is cool, I'd love to find a domestic source of hybrid loph forms myself. I am not nearly as interested in pure forms, though I am for Trichocereus.

[wandjina]

WOW! This person should do a calendar! Every month from the same collection...imagine when they're flowering!

I couldn't even keep my lophs alive

[Gunter]

Torsten, did you get any information such as what media this person uses?

[Torsten]

Torsten, did you get any information such as what media this person uses?

I saw a few bags of commercial cactus mix. didn't look like there was access for trucks, so it must just be bags. not sure if he was mixing anything into the soil. he's not organic. he also doesn't go for fast growth in most cases and the cacti are not overly juicy as a result. hence virtually no fungal problems.

we did not discuss cultivation parameters too much. I was more interested in his grafting techniques (pics are on the other roll of film - coming soon), taxonomy, and travellog.

[teonanacatl]

hell yeah archaea i think cultivated forms of lophs are much more interesting, im thinking of buy a mixed bag of loph seeds from a few places and just letting nature inter breed them, or me doing it. very cool :D

[DuG]

wow

now that is something to aim for. can't wait to see the grafts!

[M S Smith]

I can't imagine that he can afford to go through the necessary steps to prevent open cross-pollination in such greenhouses full of plants, therefore a great deal of the seed and the offspring are going to be unintended hybrids...not that that is bad or anything, as that is what will keep the species healthy and diverse. I would think that to maintain purity of natural variations, based on genetics from particular natural populations, he would need to bring these in themselves (from nature and not from another similar grower), and then work to keep each pocket he wishes to maintain in purity away from all possibility of other plants in other greenhouses bringing in their pollen. Difficult to say the least.

Lophophora, in cultivation, seems as equally outbreed as most Peruvian Trichocereus appear to be in nature. In the former modern indoor domestication causes a lack of any pure species, and in the latter ancient outdoor domestication seems to give the same results.

~Michael~

[occidentalis]

I would think that to maintain purity of natural variations, based on genetics from particular natural populations, he would need to bring these in themselves (from nature and not from another similar grower), and then work to keep each pocket he wishes to maintain in purity away from all possibility of other plants in other greenhouses bringing in their pollen. Difficult to say the least.

Really?

I would think that if you wished to breed particular individuals exclusively all you would need to do is remove them from the group before flowering and keep them together while flowering, transferring pollen between them just to make sure. One of those large plants would have several flowers each season and could produce many many seeds. Surely that would be enough to ensure the availability of at least some pure varieties (if such things exist).

[M S Smith]

Certainly it doesn't look as though this fellow is attempting to prevent unintended crosses. And if he is creating the right conditions these plants will bloom all season long for months, unlike in nature when they would bloom more seasonally, avoiding the cold of winter (causing dormancy) and the excessive heat of summer (flowers require lots of water).

~Michael~

[Gunter]

I hope this isn't the wrong place to ask if homozygous Lophophora seedlines exist...?

Edited June 15, 2006 by Archaea

[occidentalis]

I hope this isn't the wrong place to ask if homozygous Lophophora seedlines exist...?

I would have thought that seeds resulting from autogamy would be largely homozygous, particularly if the parent was itself partially inbred.

[Torsten]

I can't imagine that he can afford to go through the necessary steps to prevent open cross-pollination in such greenhouses full of plants

yes, he can.

[M S Smith]

Maybe he can afford too, but the question really is whether or not he actually is, and from the photos it doesn't appear he is. Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks like multiple "varieties" all blooming alongside each other which then will create seed that isn't "pure" to any one of these particular "varieties." This isn't a problem with me, but if I was to get seed from him (if he even provides it to others) with the expectation that they are true to their natural origins, and then I saw these photos, I would question the seed actually being %100 percent what it was claimed to be.

Beautiful all the same of course.

~Michael~

[Torsten]

Maybe he can afford too, but the question really is whether or not he actually is, and from the photos it doesn't appear he is. Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks like multiple "varieties" all blooming alongside each other which then will create seed that isn't "pure" to any one of these particular "varieties." This isn't a problem with me, but if I was to get seed from him (if he even provides it to others) with the expectation that they are true to their natural origins, and then I saw these photos, I would question the seed actually being %100 percent what it was claimed to be.

Beautiful all the same of course.

~Michael~

He has at least 4 isolated grow houses on different properties (several k's apart) - but may well have more. He produces all sorts of intentional hybrids all the time, so is well aware of the requirements for producing them and for preventing them. Obviously if you have several thousand mature Lophs you can't keep all them in a separate isolated building each. So the bulk are in the main grow house and obviously these would not produce pure seed. To get pure seed all he has to do is shift all plants of one locality strain (btw, these are not varieties) to one isolated building and let them produce seed for a few weeks.

What you point out as specialist problems are given facts to him.