geometry and simulating reality

[phloom]

lately i have been seeing (or tapping into) a new sort of view of the world, which brings about a psycological change similar to hallucinogens, although more subtle. I think it stems from a sort of internal link with an external image. I'll give you an example:

When you look at a gum tree and you see the branches silouetted on the sky, and the way the trunk diverts into smaller trunks. Imagine the curves are not real, just an illusion that moves faster than your consciousness. The branches are perfectly straight as they divert, the angles are perfect. You can see the tree generating hexagons with cut corners which contain more hexagons etc etc. Crystalline forms manifesting organically. The shape of the veins on the leaf, the bark, they all become crystalline.....simulated, like seeing reality as a really cool, mythological computer game.

Whether or not this contains 'truth' or not, i dont know.....and i dont care, because it triggers a state that can and has lasted for upto a whole day. And without ingesting anything (hangovers seems to help?!)

Anyone else get this? and does anyone know what the deal is with hexagons?

[Rev]

ah hexagons :D

The universal mind lattice

The hive

the scaffolding upon which this is all hapenning

im sure the hexagonal lattice of the space and the ways bees build their nests were not lost on the ancients. they did without doubt venerate the bee for reasons not otherwise well explained

so are you realy seeing the hexagons

or just fractal sets

i sat watching the clound near murwillumbah andits all just made of fractal subunits of water molecules in dynamic equilibrium. Special units that assemble such that a small unit looks the same as a big cloud which is made of these small units. the emergent patterns the same

its amazing at first, now its just what it just is and still amazing but accepted.

to me the latter is a matter of pure mathematical physicalty

teh hexagons tho go deeper than that, in relevance.

[phloom]

Yes absolutely, fractals are what they are. You can see the complexity in all things, reproducing at any scale!

i think the hexagons represent 3 dimensions, as in the atomic lattice which all things are made, maybe they are like the cartesian grid for 3d reality?

"no one can be told what the matrix is.....you have to see it for yourself"

[wandjina]

hexagons...oooh yeah!

Many years ago a mate and I had hexagonal imagery all night, and christened them 'chicken-wire brain dots'...not a bad name for a band come to think of it.

I think there's some refs/links to articles on entopic imagery in another thread, recently i found an article written by a couple of neurological psychologists (or whatever they call themselves) that explained how the perception of entopic imagery is 'hardwired' into the brain. Very interesting. Can't remember the authors, but may be one of the articles referred to in said thread.

[Rev]

maybe they are like the cartesian grid for 3d reality?

Phloom you have an uncanny habit of being several steps ahead along the same train of thought im on :D

this had ocurred to me but i hadnt articulated it as succinctly

[botanika]

Next time you're in the supermarket, check out fruit and flowers section more closely - geometry gallore! hexagons everywhere...

[phloom]

im no mathematician, but these shapes can seed some cool visualisations. Sort of holographic, but solid.

Heres some great images:

http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Hexagon.html

[sunboy]

I like your talk of scaffolding Rev...

I've seen it in the air.....

[gerbil]

Eucalypts and acacias do it for me all the time and have never been able to see them any other way since 2 different sorts of simple tryptamine experiences several years back. Probably moreso with eucalypts as acacias tend to have a more insectile feel about them yet it can differ day to day.

It's an absolute joy looking at large spans of Eucalypt forests/woodlands from the right distance. Single eucalypt trees on dusk or on a nice moonlit night are the best IMO

[devance]

https://www.internal.pandromeda.com/enginee...urse_Notes.html

[devance]

Finally got Mojo World 3 pro.

[ballzac]

does anyone know what the deal is with hexagons?

It has often baffled me as to why hexagons feature so much in lsd visuals. Circles I could understand, as there is a perfection to a circle, the ultimate simple symmetry. Why hexagons (and snowflakes for that matter)? Why not pentagons or nonagons? Or squares even? What is it about the number six? Unfortunately I have no answer to these questions, and I feel it would probably require a neurologist not a philosopher to figure this one out.

As for fractals, I see them as self evident...if that even makes sense . The curves on a coastline, the branches on a tree...They may not be as 'perfect' as a mandelbrot, koch, or mira, but the principle is there.

Hmmm...It's late and I don't think I'm quite making sense with the fractals , but I stand by what I said about hexagons.

-Zac

[CaptAmazing]

Someone on a big dose of shrooms once asked me to explain how people make the puzzles come from their eyes.

I get that when shapes disappear and objects blend into 2D colours. ie a tree becomes block of green on blocks of brown.

I know it doesnt really link with the hexagons becuase mine were big hexagons with fuzzy edges but distinct lines but there is definitely an underlying puzzle where pieces are supposed to fit.

[ThunderIdeal]

i think water forms hexagonal crystals, light shining through clouds can produce hexagonal atmospheric phenomenon. in fact there is a moon or planet you could go to and you would see octagonal phenomenon as the sun shines through methane clouds or something along those lines.

come to think of it though, looking at rev's post, i wonder if he's on about a similar thing to this: several times on acid FOAF has looked at clouds and their fractal nature is SO EVIDENT, they seem to just leap out and say "i'm not real, i'm just a peice of mathematical formula (like everything else you see). however, my geometrical origin is hyperspatial! that's why you can only see the pattern on a couple of good drops, because it's 2D sliding over an n-dimensional structure." i could be making this up but that n-dimensional structure, which is a bit like watching things move through a kaleidoscope, might have a kind of hexagonal geometry. FOAF will try to confirm or dispel this notion one day.

[ThunderIdeal]

http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Hexagon.html

look at how perfectly (and unexpectedly to me) a hexagon fits inside three of the platonic solids.

[ballzac]

That's really weird, because about a decade ago I read something (in new scientist IIRC) about the origin of hexagons in hallucinations, and somehow I had forgotten about that when I posted in this thread.

I think the rationale was that a similar process to that which causes hexagonal cells to form in boiling water happens neurochemically in the brain, though I can't remember exactly what the explanation was.

[ThunderIdeal]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Form_constant

honeycombs (not quite hexagons but might be what you were thinking of, sans boiling water part)

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you can pack six circles around a central circle, all of which fits into a hexagon. shrug

Edited April 8, 2011 by ThunderIdeal

[qualia]

this interests me...

i often wonder how much mathematics shapes our view of the world,

for instance treat maths like a language,

as we have seen language may shape our view of the world,

but maths is a bit different, it's structured around how we see the world

and using another language to describe it, maths arises from our perception,

but, in modern times, our perception may be governed by mathematical insight,

one could argue that much of modern mathematics is derived from european thought

(modern calculus was "invented" by europeans)

so does the current field of mathematics, and all that that encompasses

(including modern physics)

governed by a particular perception, or by an "inability" of sorts by people who are

well versed in the field, to overcome the constraints of their ancestors which they base

so much of their knowledge on?

so the question is:

Maths: is it just another language, governed by cultural bias, or does it transcend everything

about the human socio-pathological influence.

(nice idea for a thesis there, if anyone is pursuing such avenues)