narayan Posted August 14, 2003 Check this out http://www.maps.org/forum/2003/msg00331.html quote: "There has been a recent interest among young adults and adolescents to rediscover ethnobotanical plants that can induce changes in perception, hallucinations or other psychologically induced changes," Woa, we don't want this happening lets make sure they stay as simple minded slaves and not enjoy spiritual freedom! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M S Smith Posted August 14, 2003 Hi Jayson, I read the article you linked and found more damning, and truthful, information about this plant coming from Daniel Seibert than from the US Government itself. So I am not certain that this is "US propaganda" at all, but rather a quite truthful piece, regardless of the "more powerful than LSD" wording. Shoud it be outlawed, well, no, but is the plant potentially dangerous, well, yes. So I suppose ones spiritual bliss is anothers burning hell. And certainly if one listens to Daniel Seibert, or even the US Government, and makes a decision not to use the plant I would hope you wouldn't see them as simple minded, but rather wise enough to know the limits of what they might want for themselves. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerbil Posted August 14, 2003 Personally, i can't understand how so many reports can compare plants with one another, "more intense than LSD". First off, how do they know that?, have they taken both substances?, second, you can't really compare them since they are so different and have their own unique properties. Since the general public has been chocked with anti-drug, anti-lsd crap previously, reports like that just add to the mental library sourced from wankers who feed from corruption. every drug effects every single person differently, papers, and especially high ranks in drug enforcement can't make such generalised statements...well they can, but it just gives us a bit of a chuckle at their simple minds. I really would love for a huge movement, weather quiet or loud, in australia, for salvia divinorum to be taken off the schedule. I think it is possible, want to give it a go? It needs to be done before the US schedule it, after that little johnny can't think for himself (not that he does anyway) Michael, i feel it is propaganda, "DEA ISSUES WARNING FOR LEGAL HERB STRONGER THAN LSD", i'm not familiar with the newspaper and whether it is news, or a hype-paper, though that is perfect example of it...yet it can be taken two ways, depends on who wrote it, and sarcasim etc. Anything is potentially dangerous though, the real question is what will create revenue for governments... thats just what i feel though take care man [ 13. August 2003, 22:28: Message edited by: gerbil ] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted August 14, 2003 "More intense than LSD" Hmmm, they cant be talking about quantity wise, lets do an eperiment- stick a gram of sally in you mouth and in an hour rate the effects. Then stick a gram of LSD in your mouth and when you come to in 2013 rate the effects. So they must be talking per-unit-dose wise. One strong dose of LSD may seem less 'intense' than one strong dose of sally, but thats just because LSD doses are adjusted for what you can handle experiencing for 8-12 hours straight. Sally doses are adjusted for what you can handle for 30-60 minutes. If sally (or DMT for that matter) lasted 8-12 hours you can bet the standard unit dose would be significantly smaller. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted August 14, 2003 At the highest intensity of use, one loses consciousness or "at least is unable to later recall what one has experienced," according to the Web site Salvia divinorum Frequently Asked Questions. "The individual may fall, or remain immobile or thrash around," the site says. "Somnambulistic behavior may occur; injuries can be sustained without pain being felt." i thought for a minute there they were talking about 'jack daniels' or some turkey liquor like that... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narayan Posted August 14, 2003 quote: "very unpleasant consequences - panic, injuries, fires, falls and severe social humiliation" fires, what do they mean by that. Can't say i've heard too many accounts of people bursting into flames after using it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deaders Posted August 15, 2003 jayson h: quote: "very unpleasant consequences - panic, injuries, fires, falls and severe social humiliation" fires, what do they mean by that. Can't say i've heard too many accounts of people bursting into flames after using it. ah you obviously arent doing it in the proper government tested way then :D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mescalito Posted August 15, 2003 A panic attack will do this to you too For no apparent reason!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kitty Posted August 15, 2003 So what steps can we take to deschedule it? Has everybody signed the petition that is linked from Thomas Munro's website? (www.thomas.munro.com) Does anybody know who in the TGA or other government department we can write to? chris. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nabraxas Posted August 15, 2003 so, the mystery ov spontaneous human combustion has beem solved. on another note "stick a gram of LSD in your mouth and when you come to in 2013"--i was under the impression- from much experience & urban myth, that there was a cut off ov something like 500 micro grams oral, after which any extra taken had no extra effect, so taking 1 gram would have no more effect than taking 500 micro grams(if that's the right figure). i have some experiential evidence to back this up, but no real scientific knowledge---anyone else know anything? or if this is even a sound idea, are there other drugs/medicines that have a similar cut off point? [ 15. August 2003, 08:23: Message edited by: nabraxas ] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerbil Posted August 15, 2003 "So what steps can we take to deschedule it? Has everybody signed the petition that is linked from Thomas Munro's website? (www.thomas.munro.com) Does anybody know who in the TGA or other government department we can write to? chris. " http://www.thomas.munro.com/whatcanI.htm Theres a list of health ministers there, i suppose for starters if people get a chance, they could write to their states HM, outlining whats wrong with what they have done, possibly direct them to thomas' site? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted August 15, 2003 Actually, Nabraxas, I read somewhere that somebody ingested 2.5 gram of acid and died... so it can be lethal too Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerbil Posted August 15, 2003 gomaos, do you know if it was accidental? surely someone wouldn't ingest that amount on purpose..or maybe they would? :confused: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mescalito Posted August 15, 2003 Everything has an LD (not LSD) /50 rating, so i would assume acid would too. Anyway!!! Did ya's all sign the petititon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narayan Posted August 15, 2003 quote: ah you obviously arent doing it in the proper government tested way then Feel sorry for the poor buggers who had to smoke it in the government tested way then. Thats if they even tested it at all. I remember reading somewhere a while ago, I think it was lycaeum or erowid about some people snorting a couple of lines of LSD, mistaking it for cocaine. They all survived but I don't think it would have done wonders for their mental health. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted August 16, 2003 gerbil:gomaos, do you know if it was accidental? surely someone wouldn't ingest that amount on purpose..or maybe they would? :confused: As far as I remember, no reason was given?Why WOULD someone eat that amount of lsd? Why DID that dude in Spain ingest 550gram of hashish?(And die?) Smuggling comes to mind, but there can be other reasons... of course Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spiders Posted August 16, 2003 It is true that the effects of LSD plateau at a certain level in terms of psycho-activity. I did read this in various and mystical munchie friends of friends ate five slices of getafix and didnt get any further than from one or two slices... and the level and amount required to be physically dangerous are considerably higher than the mcgs we are talking about when comparing bioassay and psycho-active experiences. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted August 16, 2003 Yes like even 250 microgram would be a VERY strong dose, so 2.5 gram= 2500 milligram= 2 500 000 microgram so this would be like a 10 000 times ovedose... very very hard even to imagine what happens there and then... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mescalito Posted August 16, 2003 Probably smashing sound-scapes(metal ballads of course)and the BEST fireworks display (un)imaginable! (That's my order when they come to get me :D ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mescalito Posted August 16, 2003 "No man don't take those!"........"What?"....."shit man,I nearly gave you the wrong ones!" "I already took them :confused: "......."Whoaaa!" "what do you mean 'Whoaaa!'" "you just took more acid than anyone I've ever seen anybody take in my life maaan!"" "Ohhhh shiiiitt " Can't wait for the new movie :D [ 16. August 2003, 13:11: Message edited by: mescalito ] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gerbil Posted August 16, 2003 That could be it mescalito...maybe it was cheech? hahaha [ 16. August 2003, 13:40: Message edited by: gerbil ] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mescalito Posted August 16, 2003 No Maan.......It was only an ambulance..maaaan! :D :D :D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
t st tantra Posted August 17, 2003 sid kazyultii has told me he cannot rememmber much of his first trip,a whole 4 way clearlight,said to be about 1000mikes,taken without any experienced person at the midnight horror drive-in.all was handled pretty well concidering,but he went so deep much of the experience is not relevant in everyday consciousness and he was unable to bring it back. t s t . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted August 17, 2003 Wastl from the wastelands says his first acid was the strongest "religious"experience he ever had... taken around midnight in a dark foest with a couple of friends and a wooden hut.... first he was totally overwhelmed fo a few hours, then, with the first light of morning also came the inner enlightenment... plenty of hallucinations... the burning candle was "growing"... he imagined his mother who was many miles away, was calling him... writing appearing on grass surfaces etc etc... yep the first one was definitely the best one.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
