Chowing Down On Meat, Dairy Alters Gut Bacteria A Lot, And Quickly

[teonanacatl]

If you want an easy and cheap protein powder buy skim milk powder. Aside from all the fancy and probably useless extras added to protein shakes it is just milk proteins.

[C_T]

skim milk is still high in sugar, even in powder form

Edited December 17, 2013 by C_T

[Subaeruginosin]

You can get pea protein powders quite cheap these days. I don't know how they taste as a drink but they would be a good way to add some protein to your diet if you were to add it to vegetarian recipes.

You can get all natural whey protein powers that have no artificial sweeteners from the supermarket or whatever quite cheap. It tastes really bland but would definitely be an awesome and easy addition to vegetarian dishes

If you want an easy and cheap protein powder buy skim milk powder. Aside from all the fancy and probably useless extras added to protein shakes it is just milk proteins.

Used to love the skim milk, but don't touch it anymore. I've come to the conclusion that milks only use is putting fat on baby cows really quickly. One serve of skim milk is like 130 calories and only has about 12 grams of protein at best and at least 10 grams of sugar. Whereas a serve of good protein powder has about the same calories but up to 30 grams of protein and only 5 to under a gram of sugar. plus if you don't mind artificial sweeteners you can get chocolate or vanilla flavour, it tastes absolutely lush! For breakfast I usually always mix in 4 weetbix with one serve of protein powder and 2 raw eggs, it tastes awesome and is just as nutritious as any meat dish for breakfast, imo.

Edited December 17, 2013 by Subaeruginosin

[teonanacatl]

Yeah it has lactose in it, sugar isnt a bad thing, I see your counting calories though. The main advantage I see is cost!

[C_T]

nah the whole point of making better informed food choices is so you don't have to count calories. its more about making things easier not harder. cheers

the example above is good to outline things, but i dont personally encourage counting calories full time. although it is a good idea to do it for a few days, to so you can have a good perspective of how much your really are eating, and then correlate that to how your feeling etc.

trust me when i say, eating clean you have way more energy and feel better for longer.

eating processed food with gluten and sugars only feels good while its going down.

made the mistake of eating a few pieces of white bread at work late last week (was craving bad and caved in). felt sluggish for hours, if not ruined the following day too. if we always eat it, that just feels "normal", when you take a month off gluten then eat some bread, lookout! (same can happen for lactose)

Edited December 17, 2013 by C_T

[teonanacatl]

trust me when i say, eating clean you have way more energy and feel better for longer.

eating processed food with gluten and sugars only feels good while its going down.

made the mistake of eating a few pieces of white bread at work late last week (was craving bad and caved in). felt sluggish for hours, if not ruined the following day too. if we always eat it, that just feels "normal", when you take a month off gluten then eat some bread, lookout! (same can happen for lactose)

Gluten and sugars are natural and we have been eating them for a long time. Most people who claim to be gluten intolerant are not and do not even know what gluten actually is. Its quite a fad to buy gluten free food and "feel better" though I wonder how much of that is a placebo.

A common thing to hear is how someone dropped something from their diet only to eat a small amount later on and feel shit/ get cramps/ etc. This doesnt show how bad the food is for you but rather that you are no longer use to consuming it, your digestive tract optimises itself around the food you are eating. This is why people often get the runs or constipated when they go to other countries or do something (roadtrip) that they normally wouldnt do, its mostly due to the change in diet.

[tripsis]

Used to love the skim milk, but don't touch it anymore. I've come to the conclusion that milks only use is putting fat on baby cows really quickly. One serve of skim milk is like 130 calories and only has about 12 grams of protein at best and at least 10 grams of sugar. Whereas a serve of good protein powder has about the same calories but up to 30 grams of protein and only 5 to under a gram of sugar. plus if you don't mind artificial sweeteners you can get chocolate or vanilla flavour, it tastes absolutely lush! For breakfast I usually always mix in 4 weetbix with one serve of protein powder and 2 raw eggs, it tastes awesome and is just as nutritious as any meat dish for breakfast, imo.

Need I point out that whey comes from milk? If milk's only use is putting fat on baby cows, then you should be using a different type of protein powder.

[teonanacatl]

Need I point out that whey comes from milk? If milk's only use is putting fat on baby cows, then you should be using a different type of protein powder.

Hehe I figured that was too obvious

[Sallubrious]

For the most part I agree that gluten sensitivity has been vastly overstated in recent years.

Although I've seen a few arguments that would suggest wheat is not as natural as many believe.

Although wheat is not genetically engineered through modern gene splicing techniques, before gene splicing became widely used plants were subjected to more haphazard forms of manipulation.

Wheat was modified extensively in the 60's and particularly the 70's using chemical & radio energy mutagens and extensively hybridised to focus on selected traits and the protein profile was altered in the process. As I understand it nutritional analysis at that time focused on macro nutrient levels but individual proteins weren't much of an issue.

Modern wheat produced through such methods produced a high yielding fast growing crop requiring less fertiliser, but in the process also modified the gliadin protein molecule. As result modern wheat contains the Glia-alpha 9 sequence which was said to be previously absent from tradition wheat. (if anyone knows this to be incorrect please correct me as I can't find any direct evidence of this, just a few statements on various websites that are not referenced)

So we could have a situation where plant genetics have changed much faster than one generation of humans could adapt to.

[teonanacatl]

Cant be bothered to research modern and heirloom wheat protein levels, so Ill stay broad, sorry.

Not much in this world was designed to be eaten, its a biological arms race. Many many crops contain toxic compounds that are limited, destroyed through cooking etc. Natural selection says that individual plants could have novel compounds present- whether those genes are propagated into the future depends whether the compounds contribute to survival. Toxins are everywhere and our bodies have evolved to remove them effectively.

For some reason people seem hell bent on avoiding various compounds; gluten, vaccines, fluoride, nitrate/nitrite. Yet, as has been the same throughout history, other compounds are declared to have healing properties, in general the weirder the better.

[teonanacatl]

hehe http://www.theguardian.com/education/2001/sep/06/medicalscience.healthandwellbeing

[C_T]

reading that article, is like saying, it doesnt matter if your happy or sad, your alive

well, frankly thats not good enough when theres a choice, id rather put food in my body that makes me feel good, not sick

just my opinion

Edited December 18, 2013 by C_T

[LokStok]

^article

-junk filler by someone who has just returned from holidays and needs to submit some-thing quick.

Cant be bothered to research modern and heirloom wheat ...

it could be worth your while doing that, if just in the name of up-to-date knowledge

Edited December 18, 2013 by LokStok

[teonanacatl]

The article was meant as a humorous note, it really doesnt even have much to do with this thread topic. There was a springerlink article on the same subject running in the same vein if you'd rather a "scientific" paper.

LokStok it is an interesting question, maybe if I get some spare time.

[Sallubrious]

Yeah I was going to respond to Teos post but I really agree with most of it so I held back.

I'm gluten intolerant so my reply could easily be taken as personally biased and emotionally motivated.

It took me almost 9 years to find a quack that would give the appropriate tests to rule out gluten intolerance. Back in the 90's it was relegated to the realms of hippy nonsense and wasn't taken seriously by the the medical establishment.

I was showing all the classic signs of wheat allergies and elimination diets resolved it every time. I was suffering from auto immune issues & similar symptoms to what C_T mentioned, but somewhat paradoxically ingestion of wheat products were manifesting in constipation where most ceoliacs get diarrhea, so doctors ruled it out on that premise. When I finally found a doctor willing to do a biopsy and the relevant blood tests my suspicions were confirmed.

There's a lot of published work on the adverse effects of wheat proteins but many doctors prefer to ignore it for some reason. Coincidently some of the doctors who refused to do the tests I wanted gave me similar abridged speeches to the article Teo posted as a joke.

No one else in my family has any issues with gluten or wheat so it seems that environmental factors could play a role. There's been some suggestion of wheat proteins modifying the opiod response which is somewhat unproven but the zonulin-gliadin connection is well established in published work and much more common than once believed.

I'm a bit like C_T in that I will avoid something that shows a negative effect on my well being. If I eliminate something and feel better for it, I'll do a few cycles of avoidance and reintroduction and evaluate the outcome. If something is showing an adverse effect multiple times then I'll eliminate it for good.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Sally

[teonanacatl]

I'm a bit like C_T in that I will avoid something that shows a negative effect on my well being. If I eliminate something and feel better for it, I'll do a few cycles of avoidance and reintroduction and evaluate the outcome. If something is showing an adverse effect multiple times then I'll eliminate it for good.

This is for me the key to living, everyone IS different! I dont however see it as something that one needs to make a big song and dance over- ie just because you are wheat intolerant doesnt mean wheat is evil. I do believe there is some truth to the idea that you are more adapted to diet similar to you close ancestors, however once a selective pressure is removed a whole manner of things can pop up, ie intolerances.

[C_T]

robb wolf talks extensively on wheat and gluten as negative autoimmune response triggers. good point sally (or barry)

we just can't compare old school paleo foods with new age crops. its nearly irrelavent. as is the meat profiles.

if anyone is having problems, food and sleep are the 2 biggest influences on life. period. those 2 working for us, instead of against us, can make unbelievable positive changes.

i'll go as far as saying most medical conditions could be treated (over time) by simply working on food and sleep. big call, but i'll stake my reputation on that.

[C_T]

This is for me the key to living, everyone IS different! I dont however see it as something that one needs to make a big song and dance over-

its not a song and dance, its simply putting the facts on the table, and although you are enlightened and can see past the bullshit, not everyone reading this is in the same position.

its not about demonizing it, its about awareness. published papers will tell you gluten is fine, wheat no problem. reality will tell you thats not true, "some" people it "may" be fine. and since i don't have access to news media or any commercial avenue (i would refuse anywho), i'm using this discussion to bring awareness of certain issues that might be right infront of the persons face.

i lived most my life thinking i was fine too, that gluten had no impact, that milk was good for me... well i can't believe how wrong i was. we are allowed to be wrong, not learning from that is when it becomes a problem. or being in denial because of an ego or stubborn viewpoint. not saying anyone is doing that, just saying i used to be that (and probably still are somewhat!). but i'm slowly learning too

Edited December 18, 2013 by C_T

[teonanacatl]

Food, sleep and EXERCISE! Cant forget that one!

Science relies on statistics and normal distributions (for the most part) so there are always exceptions to everything. The problem is not with the science or with the papers its with the interpretation of them. News articles and popular media dont care about the stats or problems with the experiments, just the number of likes they get for it.

I think this quote adequately sums it up though it is perhaps a little harsh:

"A stupid man's report of what a clever man says can never be accurate, because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand" Bertrand Russell.