Pezzhuascan Posted May 2, 2003 auxin- i am very impressed, indeed you are correct and have made me look very foolish but i am still right about it being inactive aren't i? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pezzhuascan Posted May 2, 2003 danozz- i have to watch the movie again but Dr. Gonzo in other Hunter S books refers to his pysche counterpart- he is know as the 'gonzo journalist' for this style writing. The Dr. Gonzo he writes of is based on a (mexican?) friend of his but only so far as the character, i am still under the impression that he means it to be the voice in his head in physical form, but like i said i have to watch the movie again... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pezzhuascan Posted May 2, 2003 oh sorry danoz yes the book, yeah i should read it again but i am slack... btw interesting that this thread turned into pharmacology rather than movie review... im pretty sure that if adrenochrome is what i think (an oxidised chatechol derivative) then it is a metabolite of one of the endogenous transmitters that is inactive. I'm almost certain it is inactive- if it is a metabolite then that would pretty much seal it... and i don't think an indole like that would have any effect at a chatecolamanergic synapse anyway- but i ain't quite well enough read... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted May 3, 2003 "auxin- i am very impressed, indeed you are correct and have made me look very foolish" Nah, its a wise man who learns from mistakes. "but i am still right about it being inactive aren't i?" :confused: Cant say I know from personal experience, just that the reports on the true compound generally say its active (I say the true compound because its less stable and thus trickier to make than many people think). "im pretty sure that if adrenochrome is what i think (an oxidised chatechol derivative) then it is a metabolite of one of the endogenous transmitters that is inactive." It is a oxidized catechol (if you compare a pic of adrenaline with a pic of adrenochrome you can see where two protons were abstracted turning it from a catechol to a 1,2-quinone and where two more protons were abstracted resulting in ring closure), but its a intermediate oxidation product highly prone to further oxidation- when chemists make it they have to use a certain type of mild oxidizing agent under the right conditions for it to work (I'm pretty sure they were highly successful in using mercuric oxide to oxidize adrenaline to adrenochrome in anhydrous peroxide free ether, but its been a few years since I looked into it). As for it being a in vivo adrenaline metabolite I dont know, I havent checked with the scientific journals on that one. I do know if it is a metabolite, then it is a intermediate metabolite (because of its inherent instability)- and MANY intermediate metabolites are biologically active. Question is- if someone had pure adrenaline, would they really want to turn it into adrenochrome? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pezzhuascan Posted May 7, 2003 yeah thats my next question auxin- i do have pure adrenaline- well noradrenaline (better), off the top of my head i can't remember what molar i have it in its sitting in my freezer (concentration written on the vial). Though i haven't taken it on the basis that i am dubious as to wether this would even be fun? surely its just gonna make my heart beat faster and me wet myself? without the dopamine action why would i possibly want this instead of regular stimulants? - i just got it cos i saw the opportunity so i took it, now i dont think i even really want it... you seem to know your stuff well auxin- what do you do with yourself? biochemist? pharmacoligist? i am studying nueropharmacology- (still studying in case it didn't show ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted May 8, 2003 I'm an organic chem guy, although some of the topics that come up in here make me broaden my horizons a bit. Still dont know just what segment of o. chem. I'll specialize in, very probably somewhere in synthetic o. chem. Synthetic phytohormone research has always been an interest (brassinosterologists are extremely rare, maby I'll be that), but phytochem has also been increasingly tempting, who knows- maby I'll end up becoming a prophetical entheochemist in the mountains of Peru, or I might just chuck it all and become a member of the Sangha in a Indian monestary, ya never can tell for sure when your only 23. So your a aspiring neuropharmacologist? COOL! Keep us informed of all the cool stuff you learn. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted May 8, 2003 quote: Originally posted by Auxin: - maby I'll end up becoming a prophetical entheochemist in the mountains of Peru, or I might just chuck it all and become a member of the Sangha in a Indian monestary, ya never can tell for sure when your only 23. [/QB] Both possibilities appear more tempting and promising than sitting in a chemist shop for the next 50 years... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted May 8, 2003 "Both possibilities appear more tempting and promising than sitting in a chemist shop for the next 50 years..." You dont understand how bad I've got the chemistry bug. I get aroused by glassware and chemicals (I'd roll naked in broken glass for dicyclohexylcarbodiimide), there isnt a single room in my half of the house that doesnt have chemistry paraphanalia, after watching a liquid reflux for six hours it is still entertaining, and for each one sex dream I have I have 364 chemistry dreams. Of course entheologist in the mountains of peru IS still chemistry related- so its not too far out there. I couldnt see myself EVER giving up on chemistry, but if I ever lost EVERYTHING I might spend three years in the theravada sangha- it wouldnt just be three years of good deeds but it would also give me the mind training needed to be an even better chemist afterwards. I've got it bad, man. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fractalhead Posted May 9, 2003 LOL You're lucky. At least you get 'some' sex dreams. All i have are chemistry dreams. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fractalhead Posted May 9, 2003 Just for people's interest, I found this: "The chemical concepts of psychosis were partly derived from the stories of "pink adrenaline" in the war. Pink adrenalin is epinephrine which has been oxidised by the oxygen in the air, especially at a pH higher than 6. The resultant compound, known as adrenochrome, has been claimed (27) to produce mild to moderate psychic reactions. However, the effects of these "chromes", including noradrenochrome, serotoninochrome, dopachrome, adrenolutin, etc. either have been rejected or yet to be confirmed." From: Sankar, D.V.S, 1975. LSD: A Total Study, PJD Publications, NY The reference (27) is: Hoffer, A., and Osmond, H. In: Hoffer, A., The Hallucinogens, New York, Academic Press, 267 (1967) Haven't read (27) myself. Sankar's book is a wealth of info, however Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darklight Posted May 9, 2003 Fractal, you have the sexiest references Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted May 9, 2003 All I ever get is Sex dreams-too much for comfort really(the PAST keeps haunting me) and I'd love to swap them for chemistry dreams...where do I start? I mean I can sit down in the garden and watch plants grow, that can be great...but chemicals? I wouldn't know how... I know the only way to get rid of sex dreams is to DO IT but which woman would like a fat old dude like me(apart from the one I don't like)? So YOUR chemistry dreams must be saying: DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted May 9, 2003 "the only way to get rid of sex dreams is to DO IT... So YOUR chemistry dreams must be saying: DO IT!!" I dunno, I knew a nurse who saw a guy in the emergency room that had a very embaracing and painful accident with a big sexy test tube when he decided to DO IT!! That gal had some good stories from the ER- like the guy that thought he could make the perfect male dildo via a concrete enema. The things some people do without thinking!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theobromos Posted May 10, 2003 I knew someone who injected a friend (really - it wasn't anything to do with me) with adrenaline they had robbed from a chemist. His friend went into spasm and shock instaneously and bounced off a far wall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pezzhuascan Posted May 12, 2003 thats about what i thought at best it would give you some nasty shock, it is noradrenaline and i hate IV so i pretty much gave up on the idea of taking it cos i dont think i can be bothered going through the maoi business for an NA hit, ek that doesn't sound as fun as the idea that first entered my head when i saw it available to me... one of the things i was told though was to keep it refrigereated cos it will oxidise in the air- i dunno if this what they called adrenochrome or not (they didn't use the term) but yeah fractal head your references rock- i dunno about sexy but they are good... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
