Antiquity of Entheogens and Ethnobotanicals

[Teotzlcoatl]

Antiquity of Entheogens and Ethnobotanicals-

*Amanita muscaria

*Anadenanthera = 4500 years of human usage - Earliest Recorded Evidence of Usage = 2130 BC in North-West Argentina

*Banisteriopsis caapi ("Ayahuasca")

*Cannabis = 7000 years of human usage - Earliest Recorded Evidence of Usage = ???

*Heimia salicifolia

*Ilex guayusa = 1500 years of human usage - Earliest Recorded Evidence of Usage = 500 AD in Bolivia.

*Ipomoea tricolor and/or Ipomoea violacea

*Lophophora = 5800 years of human usage - Earliest Recorded Evidence of Usage = 3800 BC at Shumla Cave, Rio Grande, Texas, U.S.A.

*Mimosa tenuiflora

*Psilocybin containing Mushrooms = 10,000 years of human usage - Earliest Recorded Use = 8000 BC at Tassili n’Ajjer

*Trichocereus = 3200 years of human usage - Earliest Recorded Evidence of Usage = 1200 BC at Garagay

*Turbina (syn. Rivea) corymbosa ~ “Ololiuqui”

Edited August 14, 2010 by Teotzlcoatl

[kadakuda]

why no booze? beer and wine/mead are pretty old...

[kindness]

nice idea to compile a list and some dates man. I was just getting into looking at the difference between an entheogen and ethnogens last night... I only really became aware of there being a difference a while ago when a friend visited. From my limited understanding an entheogen is a plant that imbibes a spiritual experience, is psychoactive etc whereas an ethnogen can be any plant that humans use, their relationship to it etc - as it a tomato is an ethnogen because we use em to eat.

Anyone care to expand?

peace

[ThunderIdeal]

yep and i think that answers kadukuda's question

entheogen - can produce or mimc the experience of god within

something very much like that

if alcohol can do that, then it is in THE RAREST of circumstances, compared with being very common on some things

[kadakuda]

weed makes me no more in touch with god than beer ;)

i know what your saying, but i guess my point is god is in the eye of the beholder. i have gotten pretty fricken messed up with booze in the past, to the point of seeing things. it was only miserable, but no less so than certain other entheogens that also made me miserable and produce no more visuals.

to some people, heat could be an entheogen, co2 could be etc etc. doesnt necessarily have to be fun, or even cause hallucinations....

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/entheogen

any substance, such as a plant or drug, taken to bring on a spiritual experience

i git my head at school when i was a kid and got knocked right out. i can still remember a vivid dream from that time, so perhaps force can also be considered.

i dunno, seems anything that makes one feel spiritual is an entheogen. even a bible for some people.

i dont personally believe in gods or spirits, so i guess nothing is an entheogen to me, cause i don't feel as though i am connecting to some kind of spiritual entity of any kind when i take stuff. i feel left out

hehe, splitting hairs and playing devils advocate is a new past time of mine, hope its not TOO annoying

[ThunderIdeal]

refers to psychoactive substances not other stuff, well apparently other stuff is arguable but it's not the common usage of the word.

"creates god within," en εν- "in, within," theo θεος- "god, divine," -gen γενος "creates, generates"

i think you're less likely to experience it if you flat-out don't believe any of it (although i reckon some people get surprised).

i guess you're right, nothing is an entheogen TO YOU, but it can still be a term describing those tools that are entheogenic to lots of people. i guess the term differentiates between entheogenic and recreational use, although it can be both at the same time.

Edited August 12, 2010 by ThunderIdeal

[Teotzlcoatl]

An entheogen is a psychoactive substance which facilitates a religious or spiritual experience... this can be anything from the wine taken at communion by Christians or Green Tea in the setting of a Japanese tea ceremony and of course things like Ayahuasca and Peyote.

The 1st post has been updated... please help me fill in the blanks!

[kadakuda]

what are you trying to do, just list plants used by humans for over 100 years kinda thing? there are lots, one hugely important one may be tobacco. perhaps any of the add mixtures to ayahuasca.

with alcohol would one call ethanol the entheogen, sugar? or the plant that creates it?

i agree. an entheogen, by definition can be anything really. and to some nothing is an entheogen.

i personally cant get myself to "feel" the spiritual pull of things. i have tried many a time, i even went to church a few times in the past looking for something. in each search i find something, but nothing spiritual. so i live bi curiously through others

i believe in nature and all that stuff. maybe by someones definition that can be counted as some form of spirituality. if so, i find moss and mist to be quite entheogenic

just kidding.

[Teotzlcoatl]

i personally cant get myself to "feel" the spiritual pull of things. i have tried many a time, i even went to church a few times in the past looking for something. in each search i find something, but nothing spiritual. so i live bi curiously through others

Me neither... until I went to Peru.

Go to Peru.

with alcohol would one call ethanol the entheogen, sugar? or the plant that creates it?

I'd call it beer/wine/mead, since distilled alcohol isn't as old.

i believe in nature and all that stuff. maybe by someones definition that can be counted as some form of spirituality. if so, i find moss and mist to be quite entheogenic

ya, that counts.

[Rabaelthazar]

what are you trying to do, just list plants used by humans for over 100 years kinda thing? there are lots, one hugely important one may be tobacco. perhaps any of the add mixtures to ayahuasca.

 

Don't bother asking such a reasonable question. It will be ignored as usual. Teotz makes lists because Teotz makes lists. I think that's really all there is to it.

[Heffa]

In reference to Fly agarics

'It has been reported that as early as 2000 B.C. people in India and Iran were using for religious purposes a plant called Soma or Haoma. A Hindu religious hymn, the Rig Veda also refers to the plant, Soma, although it is not specifically identified. It is believed this plant was the Amanita Muscaria mushroom, a theory popularized in the book "Soma: Divine Mushroom of Immortality" by R. Gordon Wasson. Other authors have argued that the manna from heaven mentioned in the Bible is actually a reference to magic mushrooms. Images of mushrooms have been identified in cave drawings dated to 3500 B.C.'

Source

'circa 5000-3000 BCE : The earliest evidence of Amanita muscaria use as an intoxicant is based on linguistic analysis of languages from northern Asia. Around 4000 BCE, the Uralic language split into two branches, both of which contain similar root words for inebriation. In some of these languages the root "pang" signifies both 'intoxicated' and the A. muscaria mushroom. These linguistic similarities suggest (but do not prove) that A. muscaria was known to be intoxicating before the languages split around 4000 BCE.'

Source

If that helps...

Edited August 13, 2010 by Heffa

[WoodDragon]

Kada.

...splitting hairs and playing devils advocate is a new past time of mine, hope its not TOO annoying.

Dude, how can you be his advocate if you don't believe in him?

[Teotzlcoatl]

Don't bother asking such a reasonable question. It will be ignored as usual. Teotz makes lists because Teotz makes lists. I think that's really all there is to it.

Well I'm glad somebody cleared that up

No seriously tho... I'm trying to provide organization in a chaotic world of psychoactive plants.... I also plan to write lots of books!

'circa 5000-3000 BCE : The earliest evidence of Amanita muscaria use as an intoxicant is based on linguistic analysis of languages from northern Asia. Around 4000 BCE, the Uralic language split into two branches, both of which contain similar root words for inebriation. In some of these languages the root "pang" signifies both 'intoxicated' and the A. muscaria mushroom. These linguistic similarities suggest (but do not prove) that A. muscaria was known to be intoxicating before the languages split around 4000 BCE.'

One requirement for this list I failed to mention.... PHYSICAL evidence must be found.

All the dates cited above have physical plant material connected with them.

I will add my sources soon.

[gerbil]

Seems not, but if interested in the booze line, seem to recall a brewery being uncovered in peru or ecuador or somewhere near there, memory says it was from national geographic, and again memory thinks it was an annual thing where people would gather from great distance, huge amounts of chicha or something similar were made, then once a year a massive intoxication for days/weeks until it was exhausted, same time next year yeah?

[inpsyght]

how about opium poppy? ~ 4000BC

[kindness]

I'm a list writer... I got a poor memory lol

how about ephedra sinica 'over' 5000 yrs use (source - not sure how reputable: http://fammed.washington.edu/predoctoral/CAM/images/ephedra.pdf)

[planthelper]

somewhere, i picked up info, claiming that ephedras have the longest historic usage by men. ephedras grow in many different parts of the world and have obviously idepentendly "discovered" by many different ancient people.

to study the same ethnogen usage, in many different cultures and countries could be very interressting as because in this form ephedra is close to beeing unique.

here is some 5600 years old proven usage of ephedra, from my birthcountry austria.

oetzi the iceman's last meal contained ephedra!

http://www.pnas.org/content/99/20/12594.figures-only?cited-by=yes&legid=pnas;99/20/12594

check out fig 2.

[Yeti101]

One requirement for this list I failed to mention.... PHYSICAL evidence must be found.

 

Will you accept archeological evidence other than actual plant material? For example, an account from the time stating that Plant A was used for purpose B. I appreciate that interpreting pictograms or illustrations can be a little ambiguous, but you might be setting the bar a little high as biological material can so easily degrade.

Furthermore, plant material, by itself, indicates bugger-all, as without some other evidence, we might not have a real idea what people were actually doing with it.

Moving on, what about the antiquity of the use of Nymphaea species, both in Egypt and Mesoamerica?

Teotz': You should make a list of all your lists.

[Teotzlcoatl]

Will you accept archeological evidence other than actual plant material?

Hmm... I should adjust that... it's too strict and excludes too much.

You should make a list of all your lists.

I will, it's gonna be called the "Table of Contents" in my book.

Moving on, what about the antiquity of the use of Nymphaea species, both in Egypt and Mesoamerica?

That's a good one, got anymore?

Edited August 17, 2010 by Teotzlcoatl

[kindness]

somewhere, i picked up info, claiming that ephedras have the longest historic usage by men. ephedras grow in many different parts of the world and have obviously idepentendly "discovered" by many different ancient people.

to study the same ethnogen usage, in many different cultures and countries could be very interressting as because in this form ephedra is close to beeing unique.

here is some 5600 years old proven usage of ephedra, from my birthcountry austria.

oetzi the iceman's last meal contained ephedra!

http://www.pnas.org/content/99/20/12594.figures-only?cited-by=yes&legid=pnas;99/20/12594

check out fig 2.

 

farout. that is really interesting... couldn't quite understand the link though... I did try! I promise...

pretty useful plant to mankind really - helps with getting through colds / flu / disease so people are still able to actively hunt and sustain themselves... makes em more able to go long distances without much food etc .. useful plant indeed.

[.dg]

An entheogen is a psychoactive substance which facilitates a religious or spiritual experience... this can be anything from the wine taken at communion by Christians or Green Tea in the setting of a Japanese tea ceremony and of course things like Ayahuasca and Peyote.

The 1st post has been updated... please help me fill in the blanks!

 

a few could use citation/ref imo