phytosanitary cert to import?

[PD.]

I recently sent 2 bridgesii cuttings and some seeds to a member in the US, i just got news that (U.S.) customs took the lot and destroyed it due to the importer not having proper documentation for said cuts/seeds. Now i have sent cuts to the US before and havent had any problems like this occur. Can anyone tell me if this is likely to happen every time now and a phytosanitary certificate is indeed required on the other end or could it be a case of some anal customs cock tractor just going a lil too far? As far as i knew it was ok to send cuttings as long as they were rootless and free from any soil plus have the correct labels.

I was about to offer cuttings to a few folk at the Nook but now im not so sure its a good idea if they are just going to wind up being destroyed.

Any help much appreciated.

PD.

[Undergrounder]

AFAIK all plants imported into the US require a Phyto, i never seen that in writing, but i would think a Phyto would be minimal, as well as CITES and even an import permit

[Chiral]

I was about to offer cuttings to a few folk at the Nook but now im not so sure its a good idea if they are just going to wind up being destroyed.

Any help much appreciated.

PD.

You can offer them to me instead...

[kadakuda]

luck of the draw, many make it through ok. like Undergrounder said, your suppose to have cites/phytosanitary and the importer needs a small seed pack permit (forget the name).

[PD.]

Thanks for clearing that up lads

Hunab, you can PM me and tell me what you want!

[Evil Genius]

Hi Pass! Yeah that happens sometimes! I´d say there is a 50% chance that they keep the plants! At the last shipping that you´ve sent some to me, they kept them for a few weeks and handed them out later! I´m not sure why! Probably to make sure that they are healthy! bye Eg

edit: german customs do what they want sometimes! Thats why i dont send plants anymore! They destroy packages and plants at free will! Very annoying! I recently watched a doco about the german customs and i was shocked how they treat the goods!

Edited March 15, 2009 by Evil Genius

[recondite]

I live in the US and have received cacti (from the UK, not OZ) with no papers. They weren't trich cuts so the package was more inconspicuous. They were declared as "*edit*".

Edited March 17, 2009 by recondite

[Gunter]

I got some Phalaris seeds from Oz that had a phytosan cert, it was rejected by the states the first time, despite having correct information. The sender re-did everything including phyto cert and it went through and i got them.

it can be frustrating but seems to be one of the only ways to do this at times.

[spunwhirllin]

Usually just luck of the draw.

When sending both seeds and plants its best to send them in two different packages.

[kadakuda]

I got some Phalaris seeds from Oz that had a phytosan cert, it was rejected by the states the first time, despite having correct information. The sender re-did everything including phyto cert and it went through and i got them.

it can be frustrating but seems to be one of the only ways to do this at times.

you, the importer, are supposed to have a seed import permit for them in the states. small seed import permit or some such name. so they can deny delivery based on that alone. also certain species may be considered noxious weeds/invasive and denied for that reason (from any level of government). not sure if phalaris grass is restricted in your area, but its possible.

[Gunter]

The inital rejection did claim that there was no such reciepient or address or something like that. it was strange.

The phalaris was the one mentioned here:

http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/inde...?showtopic=8579

P paradoxa CPI 14073, not an issue in my area.

[kadakuda]

perhaps just the import permit. technically they can take anything or return anything....they can just say "its dirty" even if you have all permits and documentation! if it has an egg, a bug, a piece of a bug, a spec of dirt anything, they can just reject or destroy. but realistically they usually never check ....its random or looks suspicious.

[Teotzlcoatl]

My Lophophora made it in just fine...

[trucha]

All cacti shipped into a country that is a signer of the CITES convention require a phytosanitary certificate for ensuring delivery (variable price but in a range around $80-100 US is common) The actual details of what is involved to obtain one varies from one country to another and in some countries can change literally from one month to the next.

They can only actually open and inspect so many parcels (probably much less than 50%) so if noticed it will run into problems and if not it won't.

Unless something has changed recently, its not the usual case in the US they get destroyed but rather the most common scenario is customs will contact the addressee and ask them to either provide documentation OR sign a release that permits a nearby botanical garden to take possession. If neither is done they will be destroyed.

It is in fact luck of the draw whether an undocumented plant gets through.

The majority I am aware of people sending to each other in the last ten years and in the last year have slipped through.

Loss of undocumented plants is a real risk.

Of course I have also been noticing a lot of billboards along I-10 telling us Americans that failure to possess our new internal travel passport may result in OUR not getting back home.

[Chiral]

Of course I have also been noticing a lot of billboards along I-10 telling us Americans that failure to possess our new internal travel passport may result in OUR not getting back home.

You guys have to have an internal passport now...? Since 9-11..? ...so is that like you need an internal passport to fly between states etc...?..I was wondering which country would pull that stunt first....man 9-11 has really been the turning point for security and identification...it's used as the excuse of the century to implement new forms of control...etc...I bet the terrorists had no idea of the flow on of all this type of security etc would be so hard core...I can't imagine how things would be if another attack of the same magnitude happened.

H.

Edited March 16, 2009 by Hunab Ku

[trucha]

The laws have been on the books since either the Patriot Act or the Patriot Act II but only now is it apparently gearing up for implementation.

The recent ratcheting up is news to everyone I know, myself included. This is posted along the highways so I am assuming its not just going to apply to internal flying but simply internal travel between states.

Edited March 16, 2009 by trucha

[kadakuda]

wow thats pretty extreme! and the new prez. is ok with that? or is it an unstopable process now?

some cacti dont need cites though, here is a quote from their website.

CACTACEAE spp. 6 #4 (Except the species included in Appendix I and except Pereskia spp., Pereskiopsis spp. and Quiabentia spp.)

#4 All parts and derivatives, except:

a) seeds, except those from Mexican cacti originating in Mexico, and pollen;

seedling or tissue cultures obtained in vitro, in solid or liquid media, transported in sterile containers;

c) cut flowers of artificially propagated plants;

d) fruits and parts and derivatives thereof of naturalized or artificially propagated plants; and

e) separate stem joints (pads) and parts and derivatives thereof of naturalized or artificially propagated plants of the genus Opuntia subgenus Opuntia.

6 Artificially propagated specimens of the following hybrids and/or cultivars are not subject to the provisions of the Convention:

– Hatiora x graeseri

– Schlumbergera x buckleyi

– Schlumbergera russelliana x Schlumbergera truncata

– Schlumbergera orssichiana x Schlumbergera truncata

– Schlumbergera opuntioides x Schlumbergera truncata

– Schlumbergera truncata (cultivars)

– Cactaceae spp. colour mutants lacking chlorophyll, grafted on the following grafting stocks: Harrisia 'Jusbertii', Hylocereus trigonus or Hylocereus undatus

– Opuntia microdasys (cultivars).

[Teotzlcoatl]

Wait, wait... so I can't get plants shipped into the U.S. now?

Your saying things have changed within the last year or so...?

[kadakuda]

yes you can....its a risk, as always but if the sender doesn't pack them stupid you are almost always ok......no dirt, big plus! anyone experienced in export will know how to ship them well and they usually make it. get the paperwork and they always should.....just know that a pissed off inspector that has a chip on their shoulder can deny anything...no matter how clean and legal it is....but they would likely return to sender....

[Teotzlcoatl]

One of my buddys out in Cali told me this the other day-

I just ordered a bunch of Kratom from Indonesia.... about 75 kilos of kratom are stuck in FDA inspection.

Anybody have any idea why this is and what may happen?

Do you guys think I can get a bunch of Psychotria to the States from Oz this Spring?

Edited March 18, 2009 by Teotz'

[kadakuda]

because its a powdered plant...if its labeled for human consumption that may raise eyebrows! plus 75kg is a lot of dried material, so it would probably be best labeled for a legitimate use.

[Chiral]

Teo you could prolly play a numbers game and order various amounts of Psychotria from different sources here and the likeliness is that some or all may get through...once you have your couple of plants obviously you can clone and propagate to your hearts content...that's what I'd do anyway.

H.

[Evil Genius]

75 Kilo??? Fuck me thats a lot! Kratom that was sent to germany, got controlled every time! even already in Amounts of 1 or 2 kilo! Teotz, no wonder that they are inspecting it! Customs read the "table of content" on the package and get suspicious because a.) they dont know Kratom and b.) It could also be another herb (coke,Poppy) labelled as Kratom! 75 kilo, my dear! Thats a huge risk of loss if you ship such a large ammount at once! Imagine something happens during the shipping! The insured value is way below the actual value! If you lose the whole shippment, the post just pays you 12 Dollar per Kilo! They just pay the value that the shipper states on the package! And its usually very low to keep the Customs taxes low! bye Eg

Edited March 18, 2009 by Evil Genius

[trucha]

Live cacti that get noticed will not get through without documentation. This has been true for a decent number of years now. I had a Cereus colosseus being sent to me from England get seized by the USDA for lack of permitting nearly a decade ago.

Cacti that do not get noticed won't ever be affected.

Its all luck of the draw whether a box with live cacti in it gets opened for inspection.

Homeland Security is answerable to no one, not to Congress or the President. The New Reich is a done deal - all that is unclear is just how far the new police state gets ratcheted up.

[Teotzlcoatl]

Teotz, no wonder that they are inspecting it!

It's really not mine.

My friend owns an ethnobotanical shop, he has to get his Kratom somehow...