DMT in the NT

[calea]

Yo, I'm new here. *waves*

I've been living in Alice Springs for the past couple of months and recently a friend of mine (let's call him Garth) asked me if I knew much about DMT-containing acacias in Central Australia. I consulted the internet and some old gurus, but I don't have any real leads so far. Does anyone know much about finding some suitable acacias here? Garth likes his bushwalks and going camping but he doesn't know a great deal about local native plants. He is starting to think he might have more luck ordering in some phalaris and waiting for that to grow, but he plans to leave town soon and doesn't know if he'll really have time for that. Garth thanks you for your time and awaits your wisdom! =)

[transDiMenTional]

censored

Edited May 16, 2008 by transDiMenTional

[ENtiTY]

Welcome to the forums bud.

First thing you should do is look into the legalities regarding DMT and the possesion of material containing it. Then there is the problem of careless harvesting of established native species to their detriment.

Just some thoughts for you to ponder

All the best.

[chilli]

My wisdom is: all good things come to those who wait.

Obviously, this is a generalization, and YMMV.

Reminds me of a "Catbert" t-shirt design I saw by Scott Adams: "Your efforts and your rewards are no longer related"

[Alkron]

He is starting to think he might have more luck ordering in some phalaris and waiting for that to grow, but he plans to leave town soon and doesn't know if he'll really have time for that

How about Desmanthus illioensis/virgatus? Easy to get your hands on some seeds, I'm pretty sure legal to grow in NT and will grow up there, producing a decent amount (for yourself ) even in just one growing season. Growing your own is very rewarding and doesn't mess around with the little wild habitats we have still left . We've already done the damage to your backyard, so use it. It might take a little patience and work, but isn't that usually the most rewarding path? Just an idea.

Good luck, I belive it is worth pursuing.

[Fenris]

You won't find it above the 26th parallel. Its much more South West and mid West WA.

Edited May 18, 2008 by Fenris

[occidentalis]

There are several Juliaflorae wattles in the area which may prove interesting.

calea, have a look at any Acacias that have spike flowers and phyllodes. Get back to us if you find anything interesting.

Edited May 18, 2008 by creach

[calea]

Hmm... I have to admit, my friend was looking for more of a "quick fix" solution, such as a particular species he could locate out bush and get some bark scrapings off, as opposed to growing the stuff. I am aware of the careless damage some people cause to trees in the process, but is it possible to get bark scrapings without too much inconvenience to the tree? Perhaps by getting a small amount of many trees?

I can respect the fact that some of you are against harvesting from the wild, and maybe I'm out of my depth here, but there is a LOT of scrubland around here. I know there are loads of acacia of different species in the general area and I have no doubt that some are the ones my friend is looking for, the problem is he doesn't know which ones.

If my friend decides to go through with the phalaris idea or otherwise grow something else, how much time would be needed? He's open to growing his own stuff but doesn't have much gardening experience.

[elzar]

I recall reading here once, correct me if I am wrong.

When taking bark from 1 tree alone you would have to take so much that the tree would suffer perminant damage and potentially die. It may also become infected by bacteria as has happened down south. This may in turn take out many around it.

Somone suggested only taking bark from recently fallen branches and recently fallen trees Right after a storm.

[occidentalis]

Growing your own is always better for a number of reasons, but at the same time it is much less practical for a number of reasons.

Inland Australia is vast and there are several good possible active Acacias that cover large amounts of it that need to be tested more thoroughly. It would take an army of Acacia harvesters to do any significant damage. The situation in inland and western Australia is different to that on the east coast, where such an army does exist, and Acacia populations are much smaller. Saying this however, make sure you identify every species you are harvesting from and ensure that it is not in any way threatened. Some species are more abundant than others. It is important to remember than in at least some areas Acacia stands are an artifact of human mediated ecological change through removal or introduction of fauna and modified fire regime. They are not necessarily 'natural'.

Personally I don't see a major conservation issue in inland and western Aus as long as people are respectful and not greedy. There are other reasons why I would discourage anyone from harvesting Acacia material though, a major one being the illegality.

As for the argument between harvesting from one or many trees: The best thing to do IMO is prune a large branch, strip that and leave the rest of the tree. That way you are causing the least ecological damage (not killing any entire trees) and the least biological damage (pruning a single branch creates the least surface area for infection by pathogens).

[incognito]

As for the argument between harvesting from one or many trees: The best thing to do IMO is prune a large branch, strip that and leave the rest of the tree. That way you are causing the least ecological damage (not killing any entire trees) and the least biological damage (pruning a single branch creates the least surface area for infection by pathogens).

thats what i said! great minds think alike!

[Alkron]

RESEARCH you say!? Acacia's are a very diverse and wonderous species, however abundant on our continent, have proven to yield great potential, from a psychonautical perspective. The real question Calea is what is your intent? Do you want to experience DMT, share this experience with your friends, discover a new potentially viable source or profit from the sale of a psychoactive chemical? I have done damage to trees in the bush. I have experimented with Acacias that are unknown/untested for alkaloid content, from samples taken from the bush. I know first hand that 500g-1kg samples taken from 1 mature specimen in the bush is not detrimental to a community and more often than not even to the individual. 500g-1kg extractions of a viable source would yieild quantities greater than your own immediate consumption. The question I pose again to you is what is your intent? What is the reason for your search? Say you discover a source, say this source is ecconomically viable, say this source yields quatities equivilant/greater than the reported yields of the obtuse or phleb. What will this discovery mean? What will you do with this knowledge? Do you release this newly attained knowledge to the general public? Do you expose an innocent species as a newly discovered ethnobotanical to a (potentially) commercial market for (potential) exploitation? I don't know. I'm a strong advocate for the availablility of these potential earth-shaking experiences for the majority of the human species but at the detriment of another species? You may spend years and dollars towards this glory. All I am saying is that Desmanthus is proven, easy b to aquire/grow and if your intent is riding a wave of the universal pattern, will easilly yield quantities that will modestly arrest your desire to aquire the akashic knowledge. I'm just asking you to ask yourself the question. I really don't want to see either another Dodo nor schedule 1. What I would like to see is more people experiencing the magic that permiates our reality. Good luck. Honestly I hope you can discover some yet unknown, potentially viable Acacia and can extract enough amounts of DMT to radically influence the NT population, but don't assume that a quick buck is just as accessable as the nearest dirt track and all your money problems are to be solved by the exploitation of a naturally occuring species close to home. Grow it! Learn from it! Show it what you are! Show it you appreciate it! And all together we will hopefully move forward.

Peace.

[occidentalis]

Alkron, I don't recall calea saying anything about plans for commercial exploitation.

[mark80]

Hmm... I have to admit, my friend was looking for more of a "quick fix" solution, such as a particular species he could locate out bush and get some bark scrapings off, as opposed to growing the stuff. I am aware of the careless damage some people cause to trees in the process, but is it possible to get bark scrapings without too much inconvenience to the tree? Perhaps by getting a small amount of many trees?

I can respect the fact that some of you are against harvesting from the wild, and maybe I'm out of my depth here, but there is a LOT of scrubland around here. I know there are loads of acacia of different species in the general area and I have no doubt that some are the ones my friend is looking for, the problem is he doesn't know which ones.

If my friend decides to go through with the phalaris idea or otherwise grow something else, how much time would be needed? He's open to growing his own stuff but doesn't have much gardening experience.

quick fix? start dying.

[Googarman]

quick fix? start dying.

There are some species of Acacia that have just as much DMT in their leafs, compared to their bark. Thus, you can try harvesting leafs from such species as A. obtusifolia and you will subsequently not damage the tree. Alternatively, there are also many other species where the DMT is much less in the leafs, like a third, quarter or eighth. Despite this, you can easily harvest alot of leafs from a tree without hurting it, compared to the bark. Even if DMT is much less in the leafs, a kg of leaf is still going to give you a great deal more DMT than you need, if you know how to extract it properly. Unless you want to sell it illegally and make money, in which case, forget it.

[Plantsoma]

Have you looked into Petalostylis cassioides?

This grows in Alice Springs.

I read there was alkaloid content in the leaves, can't recall the reference but i can dig it up if you have no luck with google etc.

I always wanted to grow this plant, but even the native specialist nurseries were unable to source me seed or plants, probably because of my geographical location.

Heres a link for the cultivation:

http://www.alicesprings.nt.gov.au/communit...ylis_cassioides

[t st tantra]

prosopis is a weed around wa,nt and sa.........could be worth investigating,i'm curious about it.

t s t .

[rootbark]

I have also just moved to Alice springs and it appears that there are a lot of interesting plants to examine.

[rootbark]

Have you looked into Petalostylis cassioides?

This grows in Alice Springs.

I read there was alkaloid content in the leaves, can't recall the reference but i can dig it up if you have no luck with google etc.

I always wanted to grow this plant, but even the native specialist nurseries were unable to source me seed or plants, probably because of my geographical location.

Heres a link for the cultivation:

http://www.alicesprings.nt.gov.au/communit...ylis_cassioides

it certainly looks intersting