Sleep work shift disorder!

[cisumevil]

Hi Everyone (Not sure if this is the right place for this one, so Mod's if it's not please move for me)

Just wondering if anyone has any surgestions on treatment for this one!

I’ve been growing my Herbal medicine (Cannabis) for 15+ years now, I have “Shift Work Sleep Disorder” and crazy Circadian rhythm paterns after working a 5 shift rotation around the 24 hour clock for 15+ years now.

I have not been able to grow my organic meds for the last year due to legal reasons and have strugled to come up with an alternative!

Abit of info on Circadian rhythm sleep disorder, for anyone thats never come across the term before......

Persistent or recurrent pattern of sleep disruption leading to excessive sleepiness or insomnia, that is due to a mis-matching between the sleep/wake schedule required by a person’s environment and their circadian sleep-wake pattern. The sleep disturbance causes clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning. The disturbance does not occur exclusively during the course of another Sleep Disorder or other mental disorder and the disturbance is not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance. General characteristics are:

There is a persisting or repeating mismatch between a person’s sleep-wake pattern and the sleep-wake demands of that patient’s environment.

The mismatch leads to excessive insomnia or sleepiness.

This problem causes clinically important distress or impairs work or social life.

It doesn’t occur solely during another mental disorder or Sleep Disorder.

It is not directly caused by a general medical condition or substance use, including medications and drugs of abuse.

“Circadian rhythm sleep disorders are a family of sleep disorders affecting the timing of sleep. People with circadian rhythm sleep disorders are unable to sleep and wake at the times required for normal work, school, and social needs. They are generally able to get enough sleep if allowed to sleep and wake at the times dictated by their body clocks. Unless they have another sleep disorder, their sleep is of normal quality.

Humans have biological rhythms, known as circadian rhythms, which are controlled by a biological clock and work on a daily time scale. Due to the circadian clock, sleepiness does not continuously increase as time passes. A person’s desire and ability to fall asleep is influenced by both the length of time since the person woke from an adequate sleep, and by internal circadian rhythms. Thus, the body is ready for sleep and for wakefulness at different times of the day.”

Over the years I have found strains (Sativa’s, Indica’s, Hazes) that help me in my day to day living and have no bad effects to contend with like the Perscription meds. Hazes & Sativa's help me with staying awake when I have to & Indica's & Kush strains help with appetite stimulation & getting sleep when I need it. I realised that I could not get my meds on the “Blackmarket” as everyone was greedy and just growing quick finishing Indica’s to make a quick buck & also growing this with all kinds of DANGEROUS chemicals! So I started to grow and be in control of my own medicine’s that I put into my body (which to me is the best thing I ever did).

It's now been close to a year since I could grow my own meds and I'm really finding it hard to get by, I'm about to crack & look into Prescription meds!

I have also tried these in the last 9+ months but nothing helps anywhere near how Cannabis helped me

Sleeping pill alternatives I’ve tried in last 12 months.

* Meditation

* Melatonin 3mg

* Valerian root and Chamomile

* Kava

* GABA (Gamma Amino Butyric Acid)

* Leonotis leonurus - Dagga Extract 30:1 (granules)

* Turnera diffusa - Damiana Extract 10:1 (granules)

* And various other Phamacy & Health food stores “Sleep” products!

Stimulation alternatives I’ve tried in the last 12 months.

* Areca catechu - Betel Nut Extract 50:1 (dry powder)

* Citrus aurantium (synephrine 98%) 4g

* Cola acuminata Extract (10% caffeine)

* L-tyrosine 6g

* Catha edulis (Khat)

* Kava

* And various other Phamacy & Health food stores “Stimulation” products!

Thanks for reading and any tips or feedback would be wonderful

Regards Cis

[Conan Troutman]

Quite a list there mate, Ive found melatonin to be the best at resetting sleep patterns with some Withania and Gotu Kola during the day to regulate GABA levels...might be time to say good bye to mary jane

[cisumevil]

Quite a list there mate, Ive found melatonin to be the best at resetting sleep patterns with some Withania and Gotu Kola during the day to regulate GABA levels...might be time to say good bye to mary jane

That's the problem mate I have said "Goodbye to Mary Jane" as I can NO longer grow my own. I now cant bloody sleep when I have to & cant stay awake when I have to. As you can see my shifts at work are all over the place..... I am lucky to get 3 hours sleep a night/day and have been like that for months now!

Week #1 = 6am - 2pm (6 days a week, opt to work 7)

Week #2 = 9am - 5pm (6 days a week, opt to work 7)

Week #3 = 2pm - 10pm (6 days a week, opt to work 7)

Week #4 = 5pm - 1am (6 days a week, opt to work 7)

Week #5 = 10pm - 6am (6 days a week, opt to work 7)

Note that the shifts dont always run in that order as you might jump from Week #1 to Week #5 back to Week #2, It can be in any order

Cannabis was such a good medication for me and worked VERY succesfully for 15+ years!

Edited August 1, 2007 by cisumevil

[cisumevil]

Does anyone have any experience with Modafinil, as that might be an alt for my waking hours, then I have to work on something to get me to sleep!

"Modafinil is a eugeroic drug generally prescribed to treat narcolepsy, made by the pharmaceutical company Cephalon Inc. It is not a typical stimulant and is often described as a "wakefulness promoting agent." The drug is sometimes prescribed off-label for ADD/ADHD. In mass-media advertisements and websites, Cephalon markets the drug for improving 'alertness' and reducing 'excessive daytime sleepiness."

Thanks for any replies Regards Cis

[cisumevil]

"Some insomniacs use herbs such as valerian, chamomile, lavender, hops, and passion-flower. Valerian has undergone multiple studies and appears to be modestly effective.[4][5][6] Cannabis indica has also been suggested as a very effective treatment for insomnia."

Cannabis Indica, Well then why the bloody hell can I not still be using it! Shit this pisses me off!

[Conan Troutman]

Does anyone have any experience with Modafinil, as that might be an alt for my waking hours, then I have to work on something to get me to sleep!

"Modafinil is a eugeroic drug generally prescribed to treat narcolepsy, made by the pharmaceutical company Cephalon Inc. It is not a typical stimulant and is often described as a "wakefulness promoting agent." The drug is sometimes prescribed off-label for ADD/ADHD. In mass-media advertisements and websites, Cephalon markets the drug for improving 'alertness' and reducing 'excessive daytime sleepiness."

Thanks for any replies Regards Cis

Hey might be time to see a health care professional then mate, I wouldnt be looking into stims you will have no chance of sleeping! better seeing the doc get your sleep patterns in order, which should help with daytime wakefulness...

[ajna]

hey cisumevil, might be a bit obvious to suggest but how long since you had a holiday or at least some decent time off work? is this a possibility?

after doing 7days a week shiftwork for 15years, i can imagine there's only one thing your body really wants and thats a damn good rest!

[cisumevil]

@ Conan Troutman

Mate I cannot get my ("better seeing the doc get your sleep patterns in order, which should help with daytime wakefulness...") sleep patterns in order due to the CRAZY shift work I do.

@ ajna

Would love a bloody holiday mate

But with a morgage & 2 kids under 3 and being the soul income earner, the machine has me trapped! Oh but I dream of a Holiday (in my small amount of sleep time, lol), shit even a long weekend would be refreshing but bill's, bill's & more bill's put a STOP to that!

Edited August 1, 2007 by cisumevil

[gamma.goblin]

You should at least see a doctor for the purpose of having your(now chronic) disorder documented. The more evidence the medical fraternity has to arm themselves with, the better to get laws relaxed in regards to medicinal pot. Maybe you could sue the government for taking away the only effective medicine, and who are therfore in effect doing you physical harm? Shame 'you are making me tired!' doesnt have the same zing as 'you are making me blind!', even though the long term health effects of your current lifestyle are sending you to an early grave...

[Conan Troutman]

As said above...your best option is to talk to your G.P, Natropath, counselor or whatever, aand get a diagnosis, Most health professionals would be shocked to hear your tale of 15+ years of shift work, 3hrs sleep is not enough and if it hasn't already, will fuck you. A doctor should be able to at least help you with getting to sleep...Goodluck

[SaBReT00tH]

regarding valerian I've fonud taking several tablets relaxes me a little but still doesn't quite push me into sleep. I also find too much has horrible zombie like after effects the next morning when you're trying to wakeup. You're mind/muscles/body does not wakeup for a few hours and you feel like SHIT!!!

[ramon]

I often do rotating shifts but for a while I have been doing nighshift.

I always revert back to normal pattern for my days off. For instance I finished work this morning but shall avoid having a kip until it is dark tonight. Small amount of alcohol and I sometimes sleep for up to 12 hours.

[cisumevil]

@ ramon

Yeah I try to go back to "normal" hours on the Sunday as thats the day I get off most often and it's my best chance to be involved with the family but some shift changes I just cannot do it

And Alcohol, Mmmmmm where do I start! Yes I find that a few quite drinks also makes me sleepy but I try to avoid having Alcohol in the House as my partner suffers from Depression (Her little Brother died of a Heroin overdose) and she's not copeing to well atm & Alcohol would be too much of a temptation for her atm & with all the Med's she's taking I would perfer to just keep alcohol out of the house!

Edited August 1, 2007 by cisumevil

[ramon]

Restavit which is available from pharmacy works pretty well.

I find half a 25MG tablet works really well without any hangover in the morning.

Not sure about its interactions with other medications so it might not be any better the alcohol to have around the house.

[cisumevil]

@ ramon

Yeah mate I looked into that also but found this.....

"Restavit helps relieve insomnia. It is intended for short term use to re-establish regular sleep patterns. Do not use it for more than ten days consecutively."

No good to me as I cant see myself having regular sleeping patterns anytime in the near future

Why cant they just bloody let me use my Organic Cannabis!!!!!!

[ramon]

I would suggest you try and have another night of normal sleep around Sunday.

As long as I get two night of sleep I seem to be able to deal with a chaotic sleep pattern.

[cisumevil]

Well I did go to see a GP yesterday & have been refered to a "Sleep Disorder" specialist GP

So I'll update when I can, Thanks to all that helped

[woof woof woof]

i work 6 hrs on and 12 hrs off.

so example start midnight, end 06 followed by 12 hrs rest, then start 6pm, end midnight,...start 12 noon,. end six pm etc etc - this goes on for 6 days a week (12 off / 6 on)

melatonin does it for me!

plenty rest, healthy food, excerize and un/fortunatly no more cannabis.

one more thing..... prolly the most important "DICIPLINE!"

[jasemateau]

i think there is one thing that is important for those responses. have all of the responders workes these shifts for 15 years!!!!

i worked early mornings for the best of 7 years one job i had, i had to start at 5 pm and finish at 2am, that was the worst shift i had....

after 7 years of 12am, 2am, 3 am starts. i gave it the fcking flick and chose another job that was more challenging, and creatively more rewarding.

but now i dont work a 8-10 shift, now i can work upto 18 hours a day for months on end, so it's still a crap idea for getting ahead, but i do love what i do so thats plus....

perhaps look for a job in a similar line, even if it is a little less money. your body will thank you for it, and you wont BURN OUT your youthful capabilities earlier.

my father said to me not too long ago

well shit your 30 now son, half your working life is over, so you better get your shit sorted sooner than you thing, coz when your get older your mind may still be young, but your physicaly endurance has a shorter threshold.....

i;m not saying to quit your job, i'm saying perhaps its better to look for other opportunities, before you move, your family may be a little bit worse off, but if you spend more time with them, you will have more soul food, for it tho............

and i'm sorry but in the society we live in the corporations have designed it so even our sposes have to work, perhpas just a part time position for your girl,

atleast it can do is offer more stablity to the relationship. and some confidence or some self respect for your missus.

dont be offened bro. you put your hand out for some opnions, i just gave you mine ok

Edited August 2, 2007 by jasemateau

[cisumevil]

Thanks for your comments jasemateau

Yeah I would LOVE to get the missus back to work & I also think she would like to be back also, well at least part-time but the problem is that then we will need to put 2 kids (ages 26 mths & 41 mths) into daycare & that will cost us $500 per week then we will need a second car & in my partners feild of work she will be lucky to bring home $700 bucks clear per week.

It's just not worth it

Daycare is so EXPENSIVE!

[ramon]

i think there is one thing that is important for those responses. have all of the responders workes these shifts for 15 years!!!!

I have worked them for 22 years.

I really don't think it is taking that much of a toll on me.

In the past I have done full time study and full time nightshift and that definately took a toll.

[chilli]

Has anyone seen the movie "Thank You For Smoking?" The main character asks Rob Lowe's character when he sleeps and he says "Sundays".

Probably not the most appropriate time to mention that

My sleeping "patterns" have been pretty messed up since I was 14, when I basically was suddenly able to do whatever I wanted so left school and stayed awake all night taking various drugs. I can get into a regular pattern of sleep, but it takes a lot of effort and if I stop putting in the effort I easily gravitate back towards vampirism. Healthy sleep habits regulate cortisol surges, which in turn reinforce the habits. The release of cortisol can be programmed for certain times by disciplining yourself to get up and go to bed regular times... at first it means missing out on a lot of sleep until your body gets with the program so to speak. Of course, it would be nice if it was this simple but it is complicated when people have natural circadian rhythms that don't sync with their life's external requirements and commitments or when they work rotating shifts, although I imagine it would be possible to set up a kind of meta-rhythm for that situation.

So basically I am saying stuff that everyone else has already said, but I think using herbs to sleep and wake is like a mild form of taking uppers to do stuff and downers to relax... it is artificial to your body's natural system and while it may be suitable form short-term fixes for example an exam week or a particularly volatile work routine, it ultimately contributes to the disruption of your body's cycles.

If your work hours are not regular you need to start getting hours that are, and if they are conflicting with your commitments to your fam, then you might need to look into changing them... the hours, not the family Of course, the trouble is that the work is also what's feeding and sheltering your family, so it's a bit of a paradox I guess. You also need to start taking into account eating habits, physical exercise, what you do before you go to bed etc. Basically, I am suggesting looking into more mundane solutions such as changes to work or family routines, and the implementation of healthy sleeping habits... do a Google for "sleep hygiene" if you haven't already, it sounds like the most obvious stuff but it's what any knowledgeable medical professional who gives a shit point you towards, even if she prescribes you meds for the short term.

*edit* I don't know how helpful this is, but it sounds a to me bit like you haven't really given up pot mentally, as you keep going back to it... I know the feeling, and I think a lot of your current sleeping problems are to be expected for long term pot smokers who suddenly have to give it up, but it doesn't mean using it again is the solution, maybe it was actually part of the problem if you know what I mean.

Edited August 3, 2007 by IllegalBrain

[BlackDragon]

Im amazed at how so many people here have blamed pot or his lack of use for things/sleeping disorders... are we seeing anti-pot drivel even within our own ranks?? Does anyone have any support for these claims? He has already said that it helps, why try to turn him away from its use?

I/we know it can mess with a few things like cortisol, but i think Cis knows how the pot has/is effecting him... and if it helps the situation, whats the hells wrong with that?

He is going to a doc, they will only sleep test him and then pretty much do fuck all. Maybe pescribe some pills. I have a friend that has bad bad sleeping troubles, i made him go to sleep disorder specialist(SA has Australias leading sleep lab if i remember correctly) and after extensive tests, they basically said yep, you have a sleeping disorder, its not life threatening(life threatening or life shortening??) there you go. No real fixes for the problem, other than llifestyle and drugs. If Cis cant change his current lifestyle due to family commitments and cash flow, then the only way to help is drugs or basic light regime changes. Pharmacutical drugs or herbal drugs, whats the difference?? Natural or synthetic? Its not for us to deny his use of anything.

May i also point out, his sleeping problems have arrised due to the lack of use of the herb, Quoted from Cis, "Over the years I have found strains (Sativa’s, Indica’s, Hazes) that help me in my day to day living and have no bad effects to contend with like the Perscription meds." Its not his choice to stop using his own meds, just the laws that prevent him from doing so.

Is this humane?

Quoted from Cis-"It's now been close to a year since I could grow my own meds and I'm really finding it hard to get by, I'm about to crack & look into Prescription meds!"

All i can say is i hope you find a compassionate and helpful doc.

Bd.

Edited August 3, 2007 by BlackDragon

[jasemateau]

fark!!!!!

500 bucks for 2 kids for 5 days??

so if your missus could take care of say 5 kids a week thats already 1200 a week.

wot do you need to take care of kids?????

i know you need some card that indicates no history of sexual tendancies.

but other than that????

fark regitser your self as a cheap child care professional, with a homey feel. just your genuine mother taking care of kids only the way a mother could, instead of the manufactured child care, oh and get public liabilty insurance.

dang!!!!!!!!!!!!!

just a thought

Edited August 4, 2007 by jasemateau

[chilli]

Im amazed at how so many people here have blamed pot or his lack of use for things/sleeping disorders... are we seeing anti-pot drivel even within our own ranks?? Does anyone have any support for these claims? He has already said that it helps, why try to turn him away from its use?

I/we know it can mess with a few things like cortisol, but i think Cis knows how the pot has/is effecting him... and if it helps the situation, whats the hells wrong with that?

He is going to a doc, they will only sleep test him and then pretty much do fuck all. Maybe pescribe some pills. I have a friend that has bad bad sleeping troubles, i made him go to sleep disorder specialist(SA has Australias leading sleep lab if i remember correctly) and after extensive tests, they basically said yep, you have a sleeping disorder, its not life threatening(life threatening or life shortening??) there you go. No real fixes for the problem, other than llifestyle and drugs. If Cis cant change his current lifestyle due to family commitments and cash flow, then the only way to help is drugs or basic light regime changes. Pharmacutical drugs or herbal drugs, whats the difference?? Natural or synthetic? Its not for us to deny his use of anything.

May i also point out, his sleeping problems have arrised due to the lack of use of the herb, Quoted from Cis, "Over the years I have found strains (Sativa’s, Indica’s, Hazes) that help me in my day to day living and have no bad effects to contend with like the Perscription meds." Its not his choice to stop using his own meds, just the laws that prevent him from doing so.

Is this humane?

Quoted from Cis-"It's now been close to a year since I could grow my own meds and I'm really finding it hard to get by, I'm about to crack & look into Prescription meds!"

All i can say is i hope you find a compassionate and helpful doc.

Bd.

Wow, quite a heated response there... not sure where you pulled most of that from though! I am not trying to turn anyone away from anything, or deny anyone their use of anything, just offering my perspective, which is what cisumevil has asked for. If you try taking off the green-tinted glasses and re-reading what I wrote, maybe you will realize that you have totally misunderstood my points.