apothecary Posted July 21, 2007 Three fleshbags, A B and C were the subjects of this experience. All subjects are daily cannabis and tobacco smokers, having moderate to in depth experience in tripping. The substance of choice was approx 1g dried/powdered Ps subaeruginosa in combination with a small ball of Heimia resin each. The resin balls weighed 350-400mg and were equivalent to approx 2g of foliage, produced by traditional fermentation of activation dried foliage which was then boiled down to resin. Ingestion was at 1600, none of the subjects having eaten for two hours previous. Subjects A and C also ingested a can of Red Bull (approx 80mg caffeine?) at this point. Slight tingles and visual sparkles noted by 1630, however all three subjects noted that effects seemed to be subdued and were prepared to be disappointed. Luckily things became interesting shortly, with effects coming and subsiding in small waves, the effects of each wave being slightly more pronounced than the last. By 1730, all three subjects were into a ++ experience, which was notably of a different quality than that of subaeruginosa ingested alone. Music, conversation and any other audible phenomena was noted to influence visual phenomena greatly. At this stage all three subjects lost their conception or empathy to the time as the experience ramped up to a +++. Subjects A and B noted that the experience had taken on a much more LSD like feel (subject C having never experienced LSD), with the normal bemushroomed haze being replaced with a state of mental clarity and OEV/CEV both being a lot more intense but clean and lucid. Pyrolisation of cannabis was perceived to have little/no effects on the subjects. The only other time this phenomenon was experienced was a 2c-b ingestion by subject A. Subject A is known to become sleepy upon ingestion of tryptamine hallucinogens (unknown reason) and usually will fall asleep at T+5:00 regardless of dose, but during this experience no tiredness was felt by the subject. Effects began to slowly ramp down by 0100 the next day, but by 0200 when subjects went to sleep, CEV and euphoria was still present. All three subjects exclaimed that the experience was definitely very different from normal, and something very special. The lucidity of the visuals and mental clarity was greatly appreciated. The results of this experience definitely support previous research done by member tantra on potentiation using Heimia, and I am left to wonder if this potentiation is due to the anticholinergic activity of Heimia and if so if there are similarities in effects between using Heimia and using small amounts of Brugmansia leaf as a potentiator (which some members here have also reported being very effective). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auntyjack Posted July 21, 2007 Excellent report, very interesting. AJ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
t st tantra Posted July 21, 2007 its interesting the synergy is often about 3X similar to maoi. saw a note on the net once claiming native use ,smoking heimia leaf while on shrooms. similar results with pedro and sally to the post above. can easily be as visually impressive as sid but with so much content ,rapidity of flow ,complexity and oneness that its easy to accept some other entity,a plant spirit may have created it. there is a very definate character to the heimia which is redily recognisable from the effects of any other plants consumed. a number of times i have had intensely visual exps about 'my life' and come out much more content. t s t . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted July 21, 2007 Very interesting. Has anyone compared synergy potentials of myrtifolia vs. salicifolia? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ajna Posted July 22, 2007 great work guys "Music, conversation and any other audible phenomena was noted to influence visual phenomena greatly." if this was a prominent feature of the experience for all subjects it ties in nicely with the reported auditory hallucinations/effects of heimia. my initial thought was that this may suggest some activity other than anticholinergic, but then auditory effects may be common to anticholinergic compounds also, i'm unsure Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
-YT- Posted July 22, 2007 Awesome Post Apoth Definatly an awesome synergistic funkiness going on there, good to see more info getting spread about heimia, i should have a few samples of the resin balls come spring if anyone is keen to bioessay.. "Very interesting. Has anyone compared synergy potentials of myrtifolia vs. salicifolia?" Very good question Auxin i wasnt aware myritifolia could be utilised... might have to source a few plants and play around with them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
apothecary Posted July 22, 2007 great work guys if this was a prominent feature of the experience for all subjects it ties in nicely with the reported auditory hallucinations/effects of heimia. Indeed this was experienced by all subjects. The exact moment that went from ++ to +++ was a moment of confusion when one of the subjects somehow managed to get the music player to play two tracks at once, with one at half speed, this 'double play' was definitely the trigger and none of the subjects know how it occured Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
apothecary Posted July 22, 2007 The anticholinergic idea is just hypothesis based on comparison to peoples reports of using tiny amounts of powdered Brugmansia as a psilo potentiator. Regardless the effect could be different because Heimias anticholinergic pathway is nicotinic while tropanes are muscarinic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
t st tantra Posted July 22, 2007 once i had a heimia only exp in which the auditory component was dominant. sounds first became more distinct and i felt imersed in a local soundscape. then all sounds became equidistant and formed a ring of sound around me. at this stage the urge to fetalise at the centre of the ring came over me. i closed my eyes and went off into visions.......... have a half kg or so of activated leaf to trade. t s t . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted July 22, 2007 Very good question Auxin i wasnt aware myritifolia could be utilised... might have to source a few plants and play around with them. Myrtifolia seems more common than salicifolia, its just usually labled salicifolia. On myrtifolia leaves are a bit smaller, flowers are a bit smaller, other small differences, most distinctly identifiable by substantially different seed pod morphology. On myrtifolia the calyx encapsulates like 2/3 of the seed pod and has small spikes and the seed pod is like a fragile paper balloon. On salicifolia the calyx fully encapsulates a woodier seed pod that beaks into distinct segments and the calyx has larger spikes. On myrtifolia the calyx/seed pod unit is spherical or somewhat squat while on salicifolia the calyx/seed pod unit is somewhat elongated. Side-by-side they are very easy to tell apart based on those differences. I have both but my container grown salicifolias are ridiculously bad seed producers so I never got any of them distributed... the salicifolias were grown from SAB seed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
t st tantra Posted July 23, 2007 thought i'd add a reminder of some interactions i did a few years back. one was heimia and brug,i consider it too unpleasant to repeat though it wasnt really that bad. basically it was experiential,i appeared to have 2 voices[centres of consciousness] in my head and they were somewhat antagonistic towards each other. how does that tie in with anticholinergic effects? t s t . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
