New member Markcond needs alittle help!

[Teotzlcoatl]

A new member "Markcond" has been posting question in this thread about his cacti, since he doesn't know the rules about stayin' on topic, I thought I'd help him out and start this thread for him... "Markcond" has no relationship to me other than being a member of the Corroboree.

Here's what "Markcond" said in the other thread-

Hi, I thought this might be the right place to ask about Echinopsis cordobensis (Lance plant). I recently purchased one without really knowing much about it. Is it comparable to pachanoi, peruviansus or macrogonus in terms of chemical content. Is it fast growing. What is it best suited for ie grafting lophs or cultivation for it's own use. It's a really attractive specimen anyhow. I should learn to post a picture. Any feedback appreciated. Thanks

Hey, I'm a newbie so forgive my being a bit blatant/naive. That Burbanks' pic looks pretty much like my plant. I'm just discovering the cacti world and the information and misinformation I have found so far is a bit much to take in. Can you at least give me a straight answer about my plant cordobensis and where it fits i the classification picture? After a bit of googling around I realize I am a minnow in a pond of much older and wiser fish.

So let's all give "Markcond" a warm welcome, and see what we can do to answer his questions!

Welcome to wonderful world of ethnobotanicals!

There are two tried and true psychoactive cacti- Trichocereus species (specifically T. bridgesii, T. pachanoi and T. peruvianus) and Lophophora species (specifically L. williamsii)

You can view those here- Lophophorae, Trichocereus bridgesii, Trichocereus macrogonus/peruvianus, and Trichocereus pachanoi "San Pedro".

There are also alot of cacti which we don't really know the psychoactivty of.... I call these "Lost Peyotes".

Good Luck! If you have any questions feel free to ask! Most members are more than glad to help!

~Teotzlcoatl~

Edited July 13, 2008 by Teotz'

[Teotzlcoatl]

Is it comparable to pachanoi, peruviansus or macrogonus in terms of chemical content.

It has little or no etheogenic vaule, IMHO.

Is it fast growing.

It's Echinopsis, the tall, fast growin' psychoactive cacti are often still called "Trichocereus".

I donno if you know this or not, but Trichocereus and Echinopsis, have recently been merged, but most people still call the psychoactive, columners "Trichocereus". So... Echinopsis = Trichocereus.

What is it best suited for ie grafting lophs or cultivation for it's own use.

Neither, I'd say, unless that use is lookin' pretty.

May I ask... Are you in the land of Kangaroos? Oz?

Edited July 14, 2008 by Teotz'

[Osprey]

Sheesh!

[gilligan]

Teotz, who the fuck are you, the red carpet brigade?

Why don't you let people speak for themselves, if they haven't had any joy with their question, why the fuck start a new thread on the same topic and act like a martyr? Aren't they capable of saying *bump* or something similar?

and you wonder why you get shit thrown at you!?!?!?!?!?

[Teotzlcoatl]

Teotz, who the fuck are you, the red carpet brigade?

Why don't you let people speak for themselves, if they haven't had any joy with their question, why the fuck start a new thread on the same topic and act like a martyr? Aren't they capable of saying *bump* or something similar?

and you wonder why you get shit thrown at you!?!?!?!?!?

The guy was having alittle trouble and was posting off topic in another thread... rather than allowing him to de-rail Mr.Smith's wonderful thread, I kindly tryed to move his comments to a new thread.

I don't care if I get made a fool! At least I'm nice and willing to help a noob, you asshole!

Can we not be nice to each other gilligan? I thought you liked my crystals?

These will be the only non-cactus comments I make in this thread, please do not waste my time, "Markcond's" time, and everybody esle's time, by making posts about how stupid I am... THOSE kinda post, are 10x more damaging then ANYTHING I ever posted!

God Bless the NOOOOOOOOOOBS!!!!

~Teotzlcoalt!!!~

Edited July 14, 2008 by Teotz'

[Ace]

Gillie - Teotz is just trying to help (even if it is a little over the top). No need to give him that sort of a post. Remember: if you dont have anything nice to say, dont bother saying anything

Teotz - the mods here are more than capable of splitting threads and helping out in times like these. While you are trying to help, I'm sure Markcond would benefit and learn more by doing things himself (perhaps with a *small* nudge in the right direction). The mods (and the thread-starter) are able to advise if a thread is moving in the wrong direction and noobs generally get plenty of slack until they figure things out for themselves.

All Teotz bashers - he has actually tried to help heaps here, even posting helpful links for this new character (which we have asked of him (Teotz) in past times - do his own research before asking common questions and post information for other people's benefit). Cant we be happy that Teotz is (at least trying to) be useful?

Edit: THOSE kinda post, are 10x more damaging then ANYTHING I ever posted!

Everybody knows that forfty percent of statistics are made up on the spot. (Simpsons quote)

Edited July 14, 2008 by Ace

[Teotzlcoatl]

Let's please make this the last post about me in the cactus forums, tho I do thank you for your post Ace.

If anybody needs to make any comments about me, please start a thread in the chill space or other area of the forums were it is proper to do so...

[Jesus On Peyote]

Such a friendly bunch arnt we..

Good job Teotz, dont let the other fungouls get you down.

[apothecary]

This sort of divisive behaviour is exactly what got Teotz banned from the nook. He would repeatedly start threads "helping" people (who requested nothing of the sort), some people would complain about his litter-like threads others would say he was helping.

In the end it became obvious what was going on.

As for the fact that all the "help" he provided (did you even read it Ace) was either completely incorrect or links to his own litter...well I will let that speak for itself.

Markcond, please consider that Lance plants are fast growers which have just as much entheogenic value as any other standard pachanoi or peruvianus with good potential for growing on its own roots or as use as the base of a graft. Teotz has NO first hand data on this plant and any "facts" on his part are gleaned from elsewhere and often misrepresented as the truth.

[Teotzlcoatl]

Let's please make this the last post about me in the cactus forums, tho I do thank you for your post Ace.

If anybody needs to make any comments about me, please start a thread in the chill space or other area of the forums were it is proper to do so...

Guess that didn't work...

Sina did you not see the links I posted started by Mr.Trout and others...???

[apothecary]

From now on I will refer to you as "he who has requested to remain uncommented" if it makes you feel any better?

[Teotzlcoatl]

Well this completely did not work...

Sorry, new member "Markcond"...

I tried...

[Himdumb]

roflmfao.

[Ace]

As for the fact that all the "help" he provided (did you even read it Ace) was either completely incorrect or links to his own litter...well I will let that speak for itself.

Yes Sina, I read it and even checked out his links (believe it or not). While they were mostly irrelevent, they were an obvious attempt at showing Markcond a bit about entheogenic cacti. While I agree they had nothing to do with Lance (cordobensis), they weren't all about promoting Teotz's threads (apart from the one about the lost peyotes thread).

So you get kicked off ethno forums for attempting to help or posting links that you feel might aid people in understanding the rather complex world of entheogens (in what looks like a simple good deed)? Fuck, what has this world come to?

I totally agree that Teotz didnt need to start this thread. Markcond is surely more than capable of learning himself or just making his own desicions about starting his own threads or adding to others. But at the same time, is there any need to burn Teotz for just being a bit over ambitious and keen to share what he is learning?

Edit: I didnt pay much attention to what happened at the nook or any other anti-Teotz forums (I only occasionally check out other forums for information about plants, not so much the political side of them), so I will pipe down in that regard. If you think it is necessary for Teotz to mind his own business, that's your call (as a mod). I'll be butting out now because this isnt my shitfight to start with. I just hope you can see his situation from all angles (as I hope I am able to do too).

Edited July 14, 2008 by Ace

[apothecary]

So you read his statements and agree that Echinopsis cordobensis is a slow growing cactus with little or no entheogenic or grafting value (except for looking pretty) is good helpful advice for a newbies first SAB purchase?

That you assume I decided to wake up this morning thinking shit I can't wait to burn Teotz for his over-enthusiasm today really shits me.

What about I woke up this morning, decided to read some SAB and see Teotz spouting absolute crap as fact to newbies who don't know any better (made worse by his encapsulation of said crap in useful info), called him on it and essentially got accused of "Teotz-bashing" with some thinly veiled sarcastic statements.

If you think it is necessary for Teotz to mind his own business, that's your call (as a mod).

I don't mod this sub-forum and have no control over anything in here.

Edited July 14, 2008 by Sina

[Teotzlcoatl]

Markcond posted TWICE, COMPLETELY off topic is Mr.Smith's thread.

Here's Markcond's first post-

Hi, I thought this might be the right place to ask about Echinopsis cordobensis (Lance plant). I recently purchased one without really knowing much about it. Is it comparable to pachanoi, peruviansus or macrogonus in terms of chemical content. Is it fast growing. What is it best suited for ie grafting lophs or cultivation for it's own use. It's a really attractive specimen anyhow. I should learn to post a picture. Any feedback appreciated. Thanks

Here's his second-

Hey, I'm a newbie so forgive my being a bit blatant/naive. That Burbanks' pic looks pretty much like my plant. I'm just discovering the cacti world and the information and misinformation I have found so far is a bit much to take in. Can you at least give me a straight answer about my plant cordobensis and where it fits i the classification picture? After a bit of googling around I realize I am a minnow in a pond of much older and wiser fish.

NOBODY reacted or responded to this poor noob!

So I said-

Sure we can do that... but let's start your own thread for it, ok?

Here I'll help you out...

Just post your questions here...

...and remember, each thread has a specific topic, and we need to stay on that topic in that thread, so if you want to bring up a new subject, just start a new thread. You can do that by clicking "New Topic" in the main area of each forum.

Cruxify Me!

I'm asking for a self-imposed 1 month ban... It would be good for everybody.

Please somebody close this damned thread! Tao, Buddha, Christ, Allah, Great Spirit help us!

Edited July 14, 2008 by Teotz'

[Vertmorpheus]

Cmon fellas deep breaths... imagine the scent of lily flower... better?

Being handed a pen when you asked for a peg IS helping, if your helper is under say, 3 years of age. It's close enough to helping to probably need a smile more than a smack anyway.

I admire Teotz evident passion... once the fluff wears off I reckon he'll have one helluva green leafy patch and the right kind of spirit to go with it. If nothing else, a civilised human vector in an area where almost anything grows like a weed isn't such a bad thing. I know a few A grade freaks in NC, helps me keep faith for now

Unless he gets all jaded n bitter in the meantime.Ends up married with 4 kids to some crazy lady and has to spend his days in an office somewhere instead of playing with his tobacco patch. Etc. That'd be sad. He's what, 19? Christ when I was 19 I may have made a lil more sense of things, but I certainly had my mind on much less productive activities, most of the time.

I don't think Teotz is an INTENTIONALLY divisive member as I think Ace took Sina to mean, but rather his presence has a divisive effect on the community in question.. ie there's nothing wrong with any one lil action, but they make a kind of irritating overall picture to some... so when say Gilligan wants to roll him in red carpet and chuck him down some steps (purely for example ) it isn't methinks because of wanting to help Markcond... it's the whole straw and the camel situation... for every time Gilli says that, Gilli has refrained from saying something similar a few dozen times. So bonus muffins for Gilli

And when Ace for example says to Gilli hey steady on, thats a bit harsh, it isn't perhaps about Gilligan either, totally... its about all the other negative responses to Teotz style, maybe mixed with a little "i want to slap him sometimes too but I don't, so why are you?" In the nicest of ways, of course! Think of it as when you love the lumps off your child's other parent, but you still end up having lil niggles and blues over what you both think is the best way to handle the kid having a few upsets, maybe? All in all its just about wanting whats best for the ppl involved and the smooth running of the household, and its important to focus on resolving rather than just dissolving.

If I gave more of a poo I'd be irked that almost any common ethno keyword now gives you a big googlebag of Teotz dodgy threads... but I choose to take it as a good thing.

Think of it as human shadecloth or screening plants... smoke and mirrors. Who wants google coughing out nothing but superintelligent, lucid, helpful, detailed posts from experienced greenthumbs and greenminds anyway? It was getting positively dubious for a bit there, you could barely search for anything without finding half a page of SAB And it was all GOLD whereas now much of it is more like liquid gold... perhaps for the best?

I have a friend who is a moderately high function autistic, and when communicating online his interpersonal style is very similar, he's quality but just doesn't tend to either pick up on or respond "appropriately" to cues from others in the convo. Not saying Teotz is autistic, just that we all have different styles and sometimes its for more of areason than just... style.

I said to someone the other week, Teotz, that you'll have a lovely collection by the time you're 30... wish I had started mine at 19 rather than a few years later! I think you could get on real well esp with that whole passion thing (we love a good piece of performance art as much as the next bunch) if only you'd maybe use your ears a lil more..eyes...whatever. Actually stop and read responses to what you say, and consider what they have to offer... its 99 percent sound advice despite how unhelpful you mentioned some people may or may not be, ppl are really trying with you matie, more than they would with a lot of other newbs because they can see the potential there too... they just want you to find your knobs and turn it all DOWN a little bit.

WE need YOUR help Teotz... please, chill out a little? You know a heap of shit for your age, hell most ppl twice your age don't know half as much about plants... you don't have to learn it all TODAY and noone expects you to be an authority on anything other than what you know about which is already more than many will EVER know.BUt you can't just regurgitate the wrong thing, or a completely irrelevant thing, just go matching up keywords you read with your mental bookmarks and spit out whatever lines up... that's what it's all about, really. Your tobacco especially looks lovely, maybe talk more about that and less about... things you don't seem to know anything about? You can get yourself and a lot of other ppl into all kinds of strife carrying on like that. Please help us out? We can all benefit in the long run that way.

Or you can eat a bunch of weird plants, trip balls, get a message... which might well be much the same as the above anyway... so think of this as a free taste without having to dig into your stash.

VM

[Ace]

Sina, I'm not having a go at you. I am merely standing up for someone who is trying to help. We have all been there at some stage. Your way of pulling him up for posting false information came across as an attack on him which I felt was a little excessive. I shouldnt have bothered jumping in to back him up - I dont think anything has been gained apart from Sina getting the shits and me getting defensive.

I think the thing that really gave me the shits (hence my previous response which probably came across rude - wasnt meant to) was the 'did you even read it ace?'. You often make remarks like that which (whether they are meant to be or not) come across insulting. It's probably just your writing style, but some comments often read more insulting than they are meant (I hope).

I dunno, I'm just trying to cut Teotz a little slack since he was only trying to help (IMO). I give up - its not my fight.

[Teotzlcoatl]

Unless he gets all jaded n bitter in the meantime.Ends up married with 4 kids to some crazy lady and has to spend his days in an office somewhere instead of playing with his tobacco patch.

Don't worry, I won't...

If I gave more of a poo I'd be irked that almost any common ethno keyword now gives you a big googlebag of Teotz dodgy threads... but I choose to take it as a good thing.

I noticed that too... It's seems I have my bases covered...

I have a friend who is a moderately high function autistic, and when communicating online his interpersonal style is very similar, he's quality but just doesn't tend to either pick up on or respond "appropriately" to cues from others in the convo. Not saying Teotz is autistic, just that we all have different styles and sometimes its for more of areason than just... style.

Ahahahaahhahahahahaha!!!!! Now I'm autistic!

Or you can eat a bunch of weird plants, trip balls, get a message...

I'd like to talk a bit about this... Since my horrible Panaeolus trip, over a year ago, I have no ingested any sort of plant medicine... I have now collected the "Holy Three", and will begin my healing sessions.... maybe it will help?

You gave me some great advice Vertmorpheus and said some very nice things, thank you.

Ace I also apperciate your help, but I won't see you dragged down with me...

~Teotzlcoatl~

*Notes*-

Holy Three = Mushrooms, Cactus, Aya'.

Edited July 14, 2008 by Teotz'

[George]

Someone gave me a word that describes it well. Being "Manic".

I tried to understand it and tuned down a bit. I realised it was part boredome wich is cool but part a certain manic desperation. The iintentions are good and you enjoy what you do but you are wreckless and manic.

Quoting anything I can find even if it was the only thing I read, etc, etc...

Displaying your own stock at every opportune(see peruvianus thread post I made about brown spines, that was a bit ballsy mixed with boredome and some real concern).

I think jumping on the modesty of the noob was maybe a bit narc,.. Prolly scared him away. It sounds like your that clown form the movie: IT. Wanna balloon noob?

As for my own crap. I am glad the strailis are the way they are. They just deleted my weirdo posts instead of busting my chops about it.

Sometimes we all need someone to be nasty and spit in your eyes so that they might open just a bit.

[Teotzlcoatl]

Why are the dramatic threads always the most popular?

That's what I find most disturbing...

Edited July 14, 2008 by Teotz'

[George]

Impatient to be right about everything.

First day on the golf course and already....

Not to say that neither of us can't contribute anything usefull.. It just has to come from the right place

If you would chunk back on what you do to a more granular level, raise earnest non elusive questions etc...

The brob for me also it that the whole world don't neccecarily want to do what you want to do or the way you want them to. It's better leaving them with the raw stuff and letting each make their own conclusions instead of being "masterminded"(oops hehehe!!)

[Auxin]

Why are the dramatic threads always the most popular?

Ever heard someone say 'Hey BillieJoe look at this paint dry! HoooooooooooooooooDawgies!' Nope, cause its action and drama that get peoples rocks off.

I think there is some confusion here between Trichocereus cordobensis, a fast growing columnar, and Echinopsis leucantha, syn. E. cordobensis. A little small hedgehogy cactus. And I think the guy in question got the columnar one.

[Teotzlcoatl]

Whoops... I was talking about Echinopsis leucantha.

[markcond]

Hey guys, I didn't mean to start WW3! I really appreciated the help I was given. We all have to start somewhere and I've only just started! I've never used a forum before (which should be obvious!). I found it hard to work out where to post my questions, so I sort of guessed. If there is a thread I should use for general beginners questions on grafting, species characteristics such as the questions that started all this bickering, can someone tell me or give me a link to it. As I said I've never used forums before and I couldn't see any tutorials, FAQs'. The help menu was a bit general. Should Teotz have directed me to a particular thread/topic? I tried the search and that's what led me to Teotz in the first place. Anyway I appreciate the efforts of Teotz and George. It makes a real difference when people are nice and polite!