Lophophorae in Australia

[Guest Mexicali]

Many people keep asking about all the different forms of Lophophora and whether there are any differences among them in cultivation.

Lophophora is a VERY VARIABLE genus, and the appearence of plants is largely dependent on the environment they grow, i.e. minerals, sun exposure and slope. So what happens when you grow all these different seeds in the SAME environment??????? Are there still differences? well...you can tell me yourselves:

We start off with THE most variable of them all: the Paila. Because of the lengthof the valley it grows in, there are immense differences in plants...different rib structure, length of tufts and so on:

Then we have the Cardona. Very large plant (not THE largest) with protruding ribs:

And here's one of people's favourites, the Texana:

Beautiful dark green epidermis, with long tufts, developing the spiral shape that so many of us are in love with.

The Huizache form is MY favourite of all williamsii...look at it:

Absolutely gorgeous! Sucha definitive rib structure (spiral)! The daughter at the far right has only just split up from her mum a few weeks ago. What does that mean? The daughter was a separate seed that was lodge in the mother's roots...so it seemed that she was part of the plant as she was growing. A knock on the pot set her free from her mum without leaving any marks on the original plant or herself...so I suppose....once a daughter matures, she leaves the comfort of her mother (so long as she is not too...attacged to her)

And here we have the Cedral. many people are asking me for this plant but I was only able to part with two of them and only young. Grey epidermis a distinct rib structure to the other lophies (very short tufts). The plant becomes depressed when older:

We move on to the area of El Coyote, where the plants grow slowly (very little water there). Short tufts, 13 ribs and up to 10 cm (NOTE: The Kaktusy book does not report such big ElCoyote plants, but here is a double header, each head 10 cm):

Moving on yet again, we come to the El Oso area...My plants are not as big as they can get (14cm), but their different character is visible from a young age:

On to a couple of clumps, 1Mazapil and 2, the Quatrocienegas.

Before we talk clumps, let's discuss (AGAIN) the concept of Caespitosa....I was having a chat with a friend not long ago about Caespitosas. And as we were talking, we agreed (as is the common knowledge), that caespitosas develop heads on top of their heads (according to Latin, this behaviour coincides with the term CAESPITOSA)....and then my friend asked me if I had lophophora monstrose...and it struck me that monstrose plants develop heads on top of their heads...furthermore, monstrose seed has very high probability for producing monstrose plants (similar to seed from crested plants)...it's in the genes. Could what we call Caespitosa actually be Monstrose Lophophoras? Anyway, the plant below is from Mazapil and is a clump. The seed it produces grows into caespitose/monstrose plants that develop new heads from as young as 1.5 years old. Some of them take way longer to offset, but they do eventually (from this plant at least):

Another clump is from Quatrocienegas:

Different behaviour again, with the main head growing rather tall and flowering at quite a young age (whereas the Mazapil plant only flowered two years ago for the first time, despite its sitting in a 20cm pot!). The ribs are more pronounced than the Mazapil and the epidermis colour is slightly lighter (despite their being grown in the same conditions).

And we come to what people call the Jourdaniana, a lophophora with thorns and an almost red flower. This is one of the rarest specimens in this country and created by hybridising Lophies with Turbinis:

Moving on to the Fricii (pronounced FRIKSIAI and NOT 'freaky') with its absent ribs and bright pink flower. Very light epoidermis, since its a close descendant of the diffusa. It's a stunning plant and not self-fertile:

And we come to the Diffusa 'Echinata'. Different to most diffusas because it actually develops really long tufts. Flower is white and very small. She too is not self-fertile:

So what's the conclusion? Will seed from different locations produce different looking plants in cultivation? The answer is:

YES!

Thank you for looking at some of my plants

[Torsten]

excellent!! I've been waitign for something like this for ages!

[whisperz]

Great information...

Input like this really does help a person gain that invaluable insight that is not necessarily obvious to the newcomer... once again, great work Mexicali...

whisperz,...

PS: great specimens... and I'm envious...

[Prophet]

Nice plants indeed

[planthelper]

nice post!

but i can't agree with your fricii pronounciation, latin is latin, it doesn't get ruled by the way you pronounce letters in english at all, lol.

when i speak english, i have a strong accent, what you say is like i would claim to speak english the correct way...

Edited June 21, 2006 by planthelper

[Guest Mexicali]

nice post!

but i can't agree with your fricii pronounciation, latin is latin, it doesn't get ruled by the way you pronounce letters in english at all, lol.

when i speak english, i have a strong accent, what you say is like i would claim to speak english the correct way...

The plant is named after Fric (german name, pronounced as FRIKS). once you add the "ii" (which is the ending for all plants named after a person), the name is pronounced FRIKSIAI. Many people cancel the last 'i' in their prononciation of the plant, making it sound like "FRIKSI", but in fact, horticular nomenclature forces the name to be called FRIKSII

Glad you liked the post

[Torsten]

Moving on to the Fricii (pronounced FRIKSIAI and NOT 'freaky')

Sorry, didn't see this until PH pointed it out.

There are two ways to pronounce this. One is the horticultural latin way, which is in effect anglicised latin and hence results in frik-i-ai. (short e then short ai)

The other is botanical latin, which strictly follows latin rules and would result in frik-i-ee (one short & one long e).

However, as there is only one 'c' n the name there is no justification for doubling up on that sound by turnign it into 'k-s'. To make the pronunciation friksiai the spelling would have to be friccii or frixii.

[Torsten]

Fric (german name, pronounced as FRIKS).

Ummm, not where I grew up..... in high german it would be pronounced 'frick'.

His name might have been Frič though (french? check?), in which case it would be pronounced Fritsh, not Friks. I can't think of any euro language that would result in a 'ks' sound, however a few could result in a 'ts' or 'tsh' sound. In any case, these would only have an impact on horticultural latin which tends to adhere to the pronunciation of the source word/name (generally only where it suits the english speakers), but would not have any impact on the botanical latin, which ALWAYS follows strict latin rules and does not give a toss about where the word/name originated.

[Guest Mexicali]

Ummm, not where I grew up..... in high german it would be pronounced 'frick'.

His name might have been Frič though (french? check?), in which case it would be pronounced Fritsh, not Friks. I can't think of any euro language that would result in a 'ks' sound, however a few could result in a 'ts' or 'tsh' sound. In any case, these would only have an impact on horticultural latin which tends to adhere to the pronunciation of the source word/name (generally only where it suits the english speakers), but would not have any impact on the botanical latin, which ALWAYS follows strict latin rules and does not give a toss about where the word/name originated.

Aloe there,

It's kinda hard to be able to write Fric's name in german because it has a little ^ on top of the letter (making it a 'ks')

[occidentalis]

The Kaktusy loph special uses the name Alberto Vojtĕch Frič. Apparently he was Czech.

[Guest Mexicali]

The Kaktusy loph special uses the name Alberto Vojtĕch Frič. Apparently he was Czech.

ooops, my bad...THAT's why he's called friks

[Jack]

nice plants mate.

[Torsten]

Aloe there,

It's kinda hard to be able to write Fric's name in german because it has a little ^ on top of the letter (making it a 'ks')

German doesn't have a ^

But yeah, he is Czech. I am rather certain that even in czech this would end up as Fritsh not Friks. Do we know any Czechs here?

Regardless, international botanical latin does not look at the source of the name. Horticultural latin kinda takes the middle road. This is an ethnobotany forum, not an ethnohorticultural one

That means in botanical latin it will always be frik-i-ee regardless of where the author came from or how his name is pronounced. That's the whole purpose of using latin!!

[Guest Mexicali]

German doesn't have a ^

But yeah, he is Czech. I am rather certain that even in czech this would end up as Fritsh not Friks. Do we know any Czechs here?

Regardless, international botanical latin does not look at the source of the name. Horticultural latin kinda takes the middle road. This is an ethnobotany forum, not an ethnohorticultural one

That means in botanical latin it will always be frik-i-ee regardless of where the author came from or how his name is pronounced. That's the whole purpose of using latin!!

:D

Well said, corrected I stand, LISTEN TO THE MAN!

[teonanacatl]

There have been discussions about the monstrose caespitose connection, the conclusion drawn there was there are two types of caesp ones which pup really early and ones which produce a carpet but much later, I cant comment on this because ive never seen them but the guy provided a lot of pictorial stuff with it. I think it was at the shroomery. Anyway i think that one which pups heaps was said most likely to be monstrose. Interesting Often cristate plants throw off monstrose bits, not sure this is the case with lophs though. Definetly fits the description of monstrose.

[Guest Mexicali]

There have been discussions about the monstrose caespitose connection, the conclusion drawn there was there are two types of caesp ones which pup really early and ones which produce a carpet but much later, I cant comment on this because ive never seen them but the guy provided a lot of pictorial stuff with it. I think it was at the shroomery. Anyway i think that one which pups heaps was said most likely to be monstrose. Interesting Often cristate plants throw off monstrose bits, not sure this is the case with lophs though. Definetly fits the description of monstrose.

WICKED!

That's what all my information points to as well...the monstrose forma! I have seen plants in the wild and true enough, you only see CARPETS, no heads on top of heads. These clumps I have posted photos of are carpets, but other plants are the 'caespitosa'. The seed from the CARPETS may take up to 8 years to pup (but it does eventually), whereas the seed from the MONSTROSE develops pups from as young as 1.5 years (1cm wide). So far as the cristate lophs, nah, they do not throw pups...they just revert back to normal single heads It truly is sad to have a 'snake' that is a few hundred years old only to watch it revert back to normal sized heads The trippy thing was that the one crest reverted back to FIVE big single heads! I have no idea how the crest developed cos it was before the time of computers and technology, but I saw it revert to a CARPET of 5 heads (within a period of almost a decade). A reputable friend in germany has sent me photos of his crested loph behaving in exactly the same way and an old man I know here said he had similar experiences with his crests....started off with 5 and now only has one left because they all reverted back to carpets Truly bizarre plants....that's why we love them ....but it's a shit when you watch a crest revert

[teonanacatl]

i had that happen and it turned into a double at 1 year old. I got told thats how that kinda stuff forms. I would prolly agree that they are monstrose, but that doesnt mean much as they are hardly rare so kinda a downer lol

[Osprey]

Wow!!Amazing!!

Thank you for that post.I have a bunch of questions.

Were those plants grown from seed(not ever grafted)

How old are they?

How old do they get before flowering?

What is a good soil mix for lophs on their own roots?

How often do you water them.

Do you use any pesticides?

I know these questions have been asked to death,but you seem to know what your doing,loph/wise

[Guest Mexicali]

Wow!!Amazing!!

Thank you for that post.I have a bunch of questions.

Were those plants grown from seed(not ever grafted)

Yes, never been on a graft

How old are they?

O L D

How old do they get before flowering?

JUsually takes about 4-5 years

What is a good soil mix for lophs on their own roots?

Soil, Sand, Perlite, Vermiculite, Nutrients & Minerals, Dynamic lifter, Limestone, Gypsum, Scoria

How often do you water them.

Once a week in summer, once every 3 weeks in winter

Do you use any pesticides?

Sometimes...when there is a pest...like spider mite....

I know these questions have been asked to death,but you seem to know what your doing,loph/wise

Thank you for the compliment, I just try...there are better growers than me

[Torsten]

my biggest problem on arid cacti is root mealy bugs. how do you prevent or deal with them?

[Guest Mexicali]

my biggest problem on arid cacti is root mealy bugs. how do you prevent or deal with them?

Only thing that works down in Melbourne is Confidor, and only if you spray three times at three day intervals (in order to kill all the eggs). I do this twice every year to all my plants. Confidor is not really toxic...it is the safest of all products in the market and ALMOST drinkable

[occidentalis]

my biggest problem on arid cacti is root mealy bugs. how do you prevent or deal with them?

I was recently informed by an 'old man' grower that there is an organic option which is to water the plants with a weak detergent solution. The surfactant breaks the water repellancy of the mealy bugs' carapace and they drown.

Haven't tried it myself.

BTW, do mealy bugs on the aerial parts of the plant indicate the presence of root mealy or are they entirely different things?

[M S Smith]

Thanks for the photos Mexicali! You might find me either arguing against, or laughing about, the suggestion that fricii is a form of L. diffusa. Is all that could be offered to support this view is the single test by Habermann of a plant claimed to be L. fricii and which showed pellotine to mescaline concentrations similar to L. diffusa. Everything (location, flower, morphology) about L. fricii shows a closer relationship to L. williamsii than L. diffusa, with the exception of course being the Habermann test results. A new test certainly would be in order. It should be of interest though to know that L. decipiens, a plant that that comes from the same immediate region and is pretty much the same as L. fricii with some minor variability from their particular niches, has been shown to have pellotine to mescaline concentrations similar to L. williamsii.

Mexicali. Torsten mentioned "root mealies" not the normal mealies. You don't spray for these do you? If so do you pull the plant up and spray the roots or let it sink into the soil through the root ball?

I just used neem oil to what appears to be good effect. Plants that suffered for years from root mealies zapping away all growth are starting to plump and grow again. I'll be giving another application in a week or two. The oil hasn't caused any sort of problems even when dumped on the whole plant.

~Michael~

[Alice]

thanks for the great info & pics mexicali,

much appreciated that you share this sort of info,

really helps those less experienced folk to gain a better understanding.

champion :D

[Torsten]

I don't like using toxins, so I will try to find a different way. There are a few.

I am intrigued just like michael about how the confidor gets to the roots though. I know a commercial grower who soaks all his plant in a confidor solution once a year to make sure it gets to the protected domes under the rootball.

Detergent sounds like a great idea, however I doubt they would drown before the cactus does. So maybe a combo of pyrethrum AND detergent?

For some reason we haven't had any problems with them this year, so maybe we already have them nailed. But then again with such wildly fluctuating climate we can't tell what it will be like next year.