vapour

west australiens may have noticed a shrub with red bean-style flowers blooming at the moment along the limestone cliffs in east fremantle and also in nature reserves along the coast near perth. According to Florabase it is locally known as 'cockies tongue' and there is an article about it in the Australian Journal of Chemistry (vol 44, 1991). Details are given of an extraction from 68 kilos of dried leaves yielding 0.9% cytisine and 0.65% quinolizidines including templetine, anagyrine, lupinine, piptanthine and ormosanine. There were a few interesting things in the article, such as the extraction technique, which used different solvents to separate the alkaloids - the cytosine was removed with chloroform and the rest with benzene. The focus of the study was templetine, which was 0.14% of the original dry weight (or 27% of the benzene extraction). The structure of templetine contains trans-quinolizidine/piperidine moiety (dunno what that is, but thought I would mention it for the science heads). From this it was concluded that templetine was a diasteroisomer of the ormosia alkaloids piptanthine and ormosanine. :confused: Anyway, there must be something special about templetine if they are willing to kill 68 kilos of cockies tongues and write an article about it... They don't just do this stuff for fun, do they? (the extraction was carried out at the CSIRO chemical research laboratories and funded by the Network for the Chemistry of Biologically Important Natural Products as well as Temple University in Pennsylvania - hence the name templetine?) Our friendly chemists also did an extraction from the seeds, which yielded about 2.2% nearly straight cytisine. No mention was made of extractions from bark, flowers or roots. I don't know if this was an omission or just that initial tests proved that these parts were low in templetine. I'd be inclined to think the latter, given the agenda of the research, not to mention that professional scientists are supposed to be methodical, but you never know... Anyway, just thought I would post this for anybody interested in native legumes and unusual quinolizidines.

there are 2 podocarpus trees fruiting right now at the japanese garden of murdoch uni campus. But I don't think they are p. drouynianus. They look a bit out of place and I think they are p. elatus. I like them, the sweetness is subtle

wow, thank you greendreams, everything you have shared is amazing - and much respect for the gracious way you have dealt with the negative and suspicious posts. a lot of the descendants of colonists are only just waking up to what has happened (myself included) and we are expressing our grief (or denial) in different ways - some less eloquently than others - but this is really difficult territory and black or white or whatever we're in this together and have to work out a way forward... When I first became interested in southwest ethnobotany I was just greedy for some bush tucker, some noongar plant medicine or cool dreamtime stories. Typical wadjala, trying to grab some indig treasures to serve myself and run back to my own people. But of course the more you get into this stuff the less you're able to tell - and the less you want to tell. And I haven't gone very deep. So far I've only met a few local elders and was amazed at what they were willing to share. I know it's only the tip of the iceberg. in some families the knowledge is alive and well, especially among women. In some ways the generosity and almost incomprehensible forgiveness of some aboriginal people just knocks me down. I've noticed that there is a tendency for west australians not to publish stuff about our most interesting psychoactive plants - and I'm sure it is because they are still used in noongar ceremonies. I won't mention species but a potent tryptamine plant is central to creation stories and is regarded as the most sacred plant in the region. My advice for anybody interested in aboriginal plant medicines is to seek out your local elders, swallow your pride, forget your prejudices, be patient and miracles will happen...

"What would the ants do if I started cruising around their home?" We are cruising around their homes! Ants were here long before us and they also have a greater moral justification in that they perform a more valuable service to the biosphere than humans. Maybe the reason why urban "developed" people refuse to share their space with "pests", "weeds" and other "invaders" is because we identify with them and feel uneasy. They provide a mirror for us - and we don't like what we see! Love the ant! In indigenous cultures the ant is often considered sacred. For noongars in the southwest, minga the ant spirit is entrusted with looking after the dead and traditionally they are left to do their work unmolested. Interestingly noongars regard european settlers as "janga", which loosely translated means "the restless undead". Maybe that's why ants are so attracted to our houses? That and the fact that we have excess food which we leave lying around as an open invitation... Sorry to go about it Onz, I know this isn't really helping you with your problem. But as you say, the lycium is looking happy. I just thought it raised some interesting issues - the kind of stuff I get when communing with entheogenic plants. Acacia in particular has a deep and ancient partnership with ants. Or maybe this post belongs in the 'spirituality and philosophy' section...

Why do you have to kill the ants? I used to live in an apartment with a balcony garden and after a while I noticed all kinds of other life being attracted to my plants, especially insects and fungi. I soon learned that it was pointless trying to fight them. Probably the most useful verse in the bible is proverbs 6:6 which says "go to the ant, thou sluggard; consider her ways, and be wise". there might be a reason why the ants are attracted to your lycium. Often ants are busy farming other insects like sap suckers - aphids or mealy bugs. Have a close look at your plant or the plants around it to see what the ants are interested in. If you remove the things the ants are interested in then the ants will go elsewhere for food. Maybe the last plant that the pot contained was stressed by a detrimental fungus and was therefore attractive to earwigs. if the pot wasn't properly sterilised the lycium might now be suffering from the same fungal problem, particularly if it is overwatered, and could be vulnerable to other insect attack. My experience with ants is that they have lots of time and a collective sentience with immense processing power and inventiveness. They will always win. They won't harm your plants - but their forms of agriculture might. Maybe you could water the plants less or give them some sulphur and seasol to help fight the fungus. If you find the sap suckers you could manually remove them. pesticides should never be used if you plan to eat the fruits from the plant! No disrespect intended, and good luck

I love thomasia - it's a beautiful genus and an important part of the jarrah and karri understory in southwest wa. Some have a similar appearance to solanaceae but they don't contain any of the alkaloids associated with that family. It comes from the Sterculiaceae family, which is famous for alkaloids, such as theobromine (from the chocolate plant) and caffeine from kola nuts and also native kurrajongs. But according to the academic surveys (like aplin and cannon 1971) this genus is devoid of alkaloids. I'm sure it does have ethnobotanical importance but unfortunately (or fortunately!) that knowledge is safe with noongar people for the time being. according to CALM the conservation status of this species is priority 3: "poorly known taxa". I think it's one of those plants that will take time in divulging it's secrets to white folk - if it survives long enough... Definitely worth looking after!

This may be irrelevant but in some Perth wetlands this summer I've noticed a fungus growing on the flowers of Carex appressa - the spores are a purplish brown colour. Could it be possible that the psychoactivity of Carex has something to do with a fungal relationship, ie, ergot?

Shellite extractions of hbwr can be wasteful because the alkaloids are unstable and much is lost in the process. Also, the nauseating principle is still present after the extraction anyway. If your motivation for doing the extraction is reducing nausea then a good method is to fast beforehand and chew each seed at 15 minute intervals - and follow each seed with a ginger tablet. stretching exercises and something to help you burp - like sips of beer - is also good. smoking small amounts of brug helps greatly, but this is only recommended if you have a good existing relationship with an individual plant. Another alternative is to just get into the spirit of plant magic and have a good cathartic chuck If reducing nausea isn't the motivation, please disregard and good luck with the extractions

Centella asiatica is described as a narcotic in lassak & mccarthy's 'Australian Medicinal Plants' (p 185). This in turn is probably a reference to Mrs Grieve's 'A Modern Herbal' which says "In small doses it acts as a stimulant, in large doses as a narcotic, causing stupor and headache and with some people vertigo and coma" (p 425). The chemical constituents of Centella growing in temperate zones may differ from the kind growing in northern Australia.

hi creach the genus is definitely anthocercis. there are 2 main possibilities growing in the area you described - littorea and ilicifolia. ilicifolia has broader corollas and relatively short lobes compared to littorea. there are a few variations, subspecies and tweaks in the design. this species is ilicifolia - possibly the caldariola subspecies (see http://florabase.calm.wa.gov.au/browse/flo...s&id=11537). it depends on whether the habit of the plant was a shrub or a central stalk (ilicifolias often have a weedy annual appearance, even though they aren't annuals or weeds - they are an endemic perennial with a tendency to quickly colonise disturbed, limey and burnt land). Anthocercis are known to test strongly for tropane alkaloids (see Aplin and Canon, Economic Botany 1971 vol 25), mainly hyoscyamine at around .15% in flowers and leaves (phytochemistry 1973 vol 12 pp 2505-7). There is a tasmanian species that contains nicotine, and since they are closely related to duboisia the alkaloid content may vary with temperature (apparently both tropane and pyridine alkaloid biosynthetic pathways share a common polyamine metabolism - which is interesting in that they work in opposite directions on acetylcholine).

the yellow boletes that don't stain are supposed to be delicious. i came across a polish family last weekend collecting them in a pine plantation near perth - they wash off all the portugese milipedes, boil them, bake them and then string them up to dry and use them as stock and flavouring.

i brewed some brugmansia mead a while ago - it also had a mixture of european herbs like mugwort and dandelion root, sarsparilla and burdock, calamus, licorice and juniper berries. It was an interesting flavour but I kept forgetting about the brugmansia. There's a week or two where I can't remember very much at all. i think you need to have a lot of discipline when you decide to combine tropanes with alcohol - or devise some system to keep reminding you of what's going on (like the movie 'memento'). beer on it's own kills acetylcholine and therefore the ability to make new memories - tropanes compound this and weed multiplies it. also, you get very thirsty. it seems to have some kind of cumulative effect over time, so you end up in a kind of walking dream that can last for weeks and leave you with nothing to show for it... not necessarily a bad thing, but you ought to be prepared. next time i make herbal beer i might leave out the tropanes. also maybe ditch the european herbs. there are so many bitter flavours and interesting medicines in native plants - things like saffrole and indoles and god knows what else lurking in the bush.

i hope it's ok if i drop in on this conversation... my experience with heimia involved a 10g infusion of dried leaf from a trusted source. the effect was strongly purgative. could it have something to do with acetylcholine? could people who are naturally deficient in this kind of neurotransmitter (mainly forgetful self-medicating tobacco smokers) have a strong almost nicotinic reaction to this plant? i wish i'd paid more attention to my pulse and salivation and mood. all i can remember is feeling very sick.

can someone please help id this mushroom? it was found in a hilly jarrah forest, near a creek at the base of a tree. I'm guessing it's a bolete? the yellow pores turned blue when handled. i don't know whether a blue stain means anything but the taste was not bitter. also there were a few dozen larvae within the flesh, maybe some kind of small beetle or gnat. the closest match i can find is boletellus emodensis in fuhrer's field guide but all the pictures of emodensis on the web are pink. has anybody else seen a white emodensis? Or could it be something else entirely?

i found something called the 'bolete rule' (http://www.mushroomexpert.com/rules_for_boletes.html) which states that "you can safely eat any bolete EXCEPT ones that turn blue when bruised and/or have a red or orange pore surface." but there are exceptions to the rule - see tom volk's fungus of the month website (http://botit.botany.wisc.edu/toms_fungi/jul2003.html) where he talks about eating a delicious blue staining bolete and says "Remember the Bolete Rule, but also remember the limitations of the rule". I can see why ur advising to leave this one alone... tom volk also had some stuff about blueing: "A compound called variegatic acid remains colorless unless it is exposed to oxygen. The cell walls of Gyroporus cyanescens are easily broken, exposing the variegatic acid to the air. The oxygenase enzyme converts the variegatic acid to its quinone methide, which is blue. The possible functions of the variegatic acid and its color shifts are unknown." is the blueing in boletes more vivid and rapid than psilos? is it a totally unrelated chemical reaction that just looks a bit similar?

i thought there was no harm taste-testing - if you chew a little bit and spit it out it can give you useful information. the bluing is such a mysterious thing - there's very little consensus about these boletes on discussion boards and websites. people are claiming everything from edible and inactive to deadly poisonous. it would be weird if it was active, but due to something other than psilocin. alternately, could the staining reaction in psilos be due to some unknown compound shared with some boletes? i thought it tasted quite nice - although the maggots weren't too appetising.

stupidly I didn't think to take any of the vomit home with me. I'll have to make my own ...from cribb and cribb (wild medicine in australia): "this plant has been well known in western australia as a bush cure for dysentery, and has been investigated for other medicinal uses. In the latter part of the nineteenth century it was patented in nsw as a source of austral marine bitters". The annoying thing with this book is there's no footnotes. the impression i get is that the word "bitters" indicated a medicinal tonic rather than a recreational drink? - although colonial medicines were often highly alcoholic (I read about a popular remedy for alcoholism that had alcohol as the main ingredient :saufen2:). another name for buxifolia was hop bush, so maybe the marine bitters was a kind of remote coastal beer? judging by the character of the plant it would have proabably made a sweet smelling but bitter tasting brew. with all the diarrhea and parasites that plagued europeans in those days it may have seemed like a good idea... but how common is it for plants to have simultaneously emetic and astringent actions? wouldn't australia's pharmacopia be more about astringents than emetics - given the need to conserve water?

Still no sign of germination. Here's some pictures in case anybody is wondering what this plant is: I've tried soaking, cracking, heating, etc... maybe they need to pass through an animal? I recently found this vomit (see below) on the edge of a salt lake at yalgorup it looks like a combination of alyxia seeds and hibbertia calyxes even though it was a few kilometres from either of those plants. Like a large animal gorged itself, travelled a while and then threw up. What can it mean? Is alyxia toxic? Are there any vomitomancers on this forum? Has anybody ever noticed animals eating alyxia berries?

littorea, ilicifolia? i never noticed these plants before this year and now i'm seeing them all over the place (funny how that happens). they're pretty common along coastal roads in the south west - i've seen them at the pinnacles, down near mandurah and even in some parks in perth (like all solanaceae they seems to be attracted to humans). there are a few variations or species, from fine lobed flowers, smooth stems & fleshy leaves, to thorny stems and holly leaves with shorter petals - most are attended by small black ants and the purple fruits of the non-spiny kind had gall worms in them. littorea has 0.15 % alkaloid (hyoscyamine and atropine related, see phytochemistry 1973 vol 12) although this probably varies a lot. it might make an interesting entheogenic garden plant for those living in sandy dry places - although i wouldn't ingest from an unfamiliar plant before doing careful research, not many people like tropane overdoses. remember, they make you forgetful, so less is always more. there's actually a primary school down in rockingham that uses anthocercis flowers for a logo, kind of a statement about learning and forgetfulness... i guess plants have a sense of humour sometimes, although sometimes it's a bit dark, like john howard wearing a sprig of wattle as an emblem of war and nationalism. there's lots of seeds out at the moment, I might sprinkle some in suburban gardens.

A friend has tested 3 carex grasses: morrowii, brevicollis and albula. 3 cones of dried morrowii roots were smoked before slowly chewing and swallowing 3 hbwr seeds. There was no nausea (she had fasted beforehand and chewed a ginger tablet after each seed) but no visual or closed eye effects. There was a strong sense of unreality, a slow faint pulse and sedation lasting about 5 hours. The euphoria normally associated with full dose hbwr was not present but there was a sense of dissociation and weirdness similar to syrian rue, but without increased blood pressure. Overall, inconclusive. The effects could be attributed to the woodrose seeds alone. each grass was also ground, soaked in vinegar and viewed under a uv light (as per the posting on harmaline fluorescence). There was no fluorescence for any of the above grasses. It's possible the grasses used were inactive, wrongly identified or the wrong species. I agree with t st tantra that maois are potentially all over the place. I read that the roots of introduced weeds like arabidopsis and phytolacca roots are fluorescent yellow under uv lights. but the idea of maois in native grasses is very appealing. That theoretically, people thousands of years ago could have collected some sedge and some acacia and boiled them up in a bailer shell with acidic water from a melaleuca swamp... My friend also tells me that chewing 3 hbwr seeds before eating a half-dose of fungi made for an intense, almost overwhelming experience/lesson. I'm sure that predosing the lsa with maoi would mean that even smaller quantities of mushroom would need to be used.

did you ever work out a germination prep for this? I'm trying to grow some alyxia buxifolia from seed at the moment. nothing happening yet. Has anybody learned much about these plants? There's nothing much on the net. All I can find in books is that buxifolia was called dysentery bush and was once used as a hops substitute. In 'Plants for Medicines' it rated 0.05% alkaloid in leaf and stem. They have an interesting smell in summer and the red berries, white sap and twisted flowers seem to say something. I haven't found them growing in large numbers, just a few in a reserve. It's a special aboriginal women's place so I can't really justify taking anything but a few seeds. I wonder if the root bark has ever had any medicinal or religious use.

hello, I wonder if anybody can help with an ID? http://www.shaman-australis.com.au/gallery...lastupby&uid=87 It was a small tree with orange fruit growing on the side of the road a few hundred ks west of port augusta. At first I thought it was a kangaroo apple but it lacks the star shaped bit where the stem meets the fruit. And as it dried, the fruit opened up like a hinge and there were some weird red seeds in there like pearls in a clam. Also, I think roo apples have jagged leaves instead of straight ones. The other possibility was quandong - the leaves and shape of the tree fit with the santalum description, but this might be ruled out because quondongs are supposed to have a single seed in a stone. I'd be grateful for any help.

cool, thanks heaps - I've never heard of this one before. after some searching, have learnt that the ngiyampaa people call it "tharii" - they grind the red seed to powder for use as an aphrodisiac. It has apparently also demonstrated anti-viral properties. Couldn't find any list of chemical constituents, though. Sounds like an interesting medicine plant, worth trying to germinate the seeds.