uni sucks 2

[t st tantra]

been working through personal issues as a result of darklights comments in the original thread.

and now i'm at the q ,why in this age of internet access to information and learning do unis have a monopoly on teaching AND testing,at least in terms of recognised qualifications?

t s t .

[loaded]

That's exactly what I want to know. Not only that, but universities also are inflexable in the methods they appropiate to teaching. They are unopen to these new technologies (such as internet based discource communities) which are way more condusive to learning then the standardized write 3 papers and exam bullshit where infomation is in no way retained past the duration of the course.

Here's hoping we'll be able to revolutionize an outdated and ridiclulously dogmatic institution!

Edited September 30, 2006 by loaded

[Papa Somnia]

Once again I will start the crusade against machinery.

Of course using internet and computers has it's advantages, BUT I personally prefer using paper. So, it is a waste of natural resources, but will it cause cancer ? I don't think so.

But computers will. Perhaps it can't yet be fully proved scientificly, but someday it will be.

And, unlike the information inside in any information saving system, writings on bare paper cannot vanish in normal conditions.

New methods and new technology is not always better than the old one. Remember DDT ? Radium ? Early X - ray devices ? Then: Good, excellent. Now: venenious.

"In paper we trust"

"More than machinery, we need humanity"

Charlie Chaplin, "The Great Dictator", 1939.

[gomaos]

that reminds me:

I have to get a printer so things won't vanish when this thing crashes...sure it will one day...and I need a cd burner...and...and...and...

[Rev]

Unis are great as depositories of information - without them we wouldnt have access to the journals and papers. theyre also great for researchers

But yes for all but hons. and higher students they suck - definitely not enough interaction in research or emphasis on experiments - your own i mean not labs with 40 + students and labs that you do twice in separate subjects

The best module i ever did had less than 20 students in total and had 2 lecturers who are world class researchers in their field - fungi :D - one of the good guys (mycorrhizae) and the other the bad guys (Necrotrophic pathogens).

If it wasnt for that course my entire degree would have been a waste of time in my opinion.

Maybe that and statistics however much i hated it

not that im advocating ignoring your cousre but do try and seek out electives in other areas of interests especially applied ones, they can lead to work in research projects or just 'understandings' where you get to use uni hardware and labspace

and make good use of the library - especially journals like phytochemistry and things like that...

[t st tantra]

my main q's relate to the corruption possible in a system testing itself,and why i cant educate myself within a given framework and be tested by an independent party?

the monopoly of the proffesions seems the basis of much social inequality.

t s t .

[mescalito]

Agree...I'm a qualified Refrigeration/Air-conditioning mechanic-FAT lot of good that does when I love learning about plants of all types.

But I DO love it when I ask a question to a QUALIFIED horticulturalist and they go...wha?? :D

[loaded]

Ive had enough of it for a lifetime. It is, and I do not kid when I say this, a system of control and abuse in order to monopolize and and supress the viability of youth input and credentials, and well as their outlook and interest.

Furthermore, the institutionalization of university practices is established and maintained in a way to extort maximum capital and value out of young people.

The fact that their methods of teaching are innefficent and obsolete is moot, the more important fact is the suppression of young people through systematic regimes of suppression is persisting unhindered is reason enough.

You dont believe me? Consider this: My university runs a course called "youth and society". In this course, young people pay several hundred dollars to hear a bunch of "experts" of youth culture - a couple of lecturers over 50 years old. Wjhat kind of reverse logic is this??? Young people pay to go and listen to old people who get paid for lecturing them on the topic of youth in society today. What kind of doublethink, reverse logic is that?

[nabraxas]

totally agree w/on-lucid

there is a scheme where you can do a degree on-line, but it's much more expensive than going tou uni.

 

quote:

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why i cant educate myself within a given framework and be tested by an independent party?

 

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there are some trade qualifications done like this, but i guess the question is why are you getting educated in the first place?

if you want to improve your mind, then qualifications aren't important, if you're doing it for career goals, then the "independant party" has to be recognised by potential employers--in most cases this'll be a uni.

[Torsten]

I am amazed at the morons that Universities churn out. The vast majority have little to offer to any industry or society as a whole. There is such a nice term in german which I don't think exists in english. "Fachidioten" basically translates as 'specialist idiots' and describes people who have become so specialised in oen field that they have not kept up with even the rudimentary developments in other fields. Because of our universities developing more and more of these people less and less of todays advances are made by common logic or by paracticality, but simply by random evolution in a single field. And hence whenever we get an individual who can actually span his intellect over more than one specialised field, we think of them as outstanding rather than normal.

Uni kids have their heads in the clouds. They think they know everything about their field, but have in fact only learnt to ignore how little they know of everything else.

My ex girlfriend was a brilliant analytical chemist at Uni, but when it came to the simplest real life applications of her work she was totally lost. It would take her longer to map out an experiment that for me to actually finish it. She then went into teaching, which she was good at, but as a science teacher you also have to teach basic biology, which she was crap at.

University used to be for those people who wanted to learn, who strived for knowledge, free thought, revolutionary ideas, and to improve the world and our society. Many of the great social and scientific advances were made in Universities or at least catalysed by them. These days universities are extensions of high schools, dragging students along who would rather be out doing fun stuff. They have become (and promoted as such by our government) vocational trainers. Another institution that moulds drones into monotonous menial tasks. Just look at campus political organisations, the student union, nerd clubs, etc etc.... these used to be the powerhouses of our developing society and these days they play brainwashing computer games ad nauseam or drool over the opposite (or same) sex like high school jocks.

Don't get me wrong, it is quite possible to get something good out of your University, but this is not what they want you to do and hence make it very hard. It is also possible to get very bright and well rounded graduates, but this is quite rare. The really bright ones are usually fast tracked into a specialist field, and the almost bright ones think they are brighter than everyone else and spend the first few years of real life reinventing the wheel.

For some reason I find those students who can't decide what to study (and just study a bit of this and a bit of that) the most interesting and the most competent. And I think it is this genre of students that will save us from the commercially driven university graduate system.

[Agamemnon]

Yes, I would have to agree with you Torsten. In the middle ages universities were bastions of enlightenment, radicalism (relatively speaking), and creativity. Today they have been dumbed down to process factories, where ability has been subordinated to capability to fork out the dollars for courses. Very sad. What once was a barometer of the health of our society and a corrective, has been enslaved by multinational corporate manipulation to better suit the insatiable demands of globalisation and rampant capitalism.

[loaded]

One wonders how many "specialists" one can have with over 4000 MBA graduates being churned out each year. Theyre like drones, just culminating whereever the next high salary job is at.

I actually had a class that combined international relations with law (well, international law) and it is amazing how many of them blurt out the standard legal terminology like robots to solve a problem and just cant seem to understand that there can be more to an issue or a solution then what exists in the legal framework. The course is international relations and international law but they treated the subject as "international relations codified by international law". Since when has international law been cohesive? May be a bad example I know but i really must emphasize the value in a diversification of feilds and disiplines. It helps to think outside of the box.

[mescalito]

From Lees' Tao of Jeet Kune Do:

"If you follow the classical pattern,you are understanding the routine,the tradition,the shadow-you are not understanding yourself."

never been to uni, but I understand what you say