future drugs

[nabraxas]

http://www.a1b2c3.com/drugs/desi02.htm

interesting & informative piece from the US DEA

[gomaos]

the dea jeez how i hate those murderous m...fuckers, making it their business to meddle into every person's life bout what substnces they take...what sort of people would they be, working there...control freaks, every single one a little hitler...the whole dea is like one big poisonous man-eating plant with long sharp tentacles...you can chop away at the the tentacles as much as you want, for every one that get's chopped off two new ones regrow...the only way to get rid of them is to pull them out at the root...abolish them, change of government...but since the world's popultaion consists mainly of idiots, faschists, and rednecks, no hope in sight...quite the contrary...

drug use...drug abuse...there's approximtely 10 % of users who"abuse" mainly those who re young and stupid...the rest use wisely...

Why don't they take care of them real problems in life: "people abusers"those fucking capitalists who brainwash and force people into submission to work for them in meaningless jobs, in the process destroying our environment and even more so they environment of our children and children's children

Murdoch, Gates etc, the whole top, those evil bloodsuckers...they are the true evil who need to be got rid off, not harmless drugtakers

[ 14. May 2003, 10:23: Message edited by: gomaos ]

[peas-pipe]

haha, Drug Enforcement Administration can be read two ways.

[Thelema]

or see what DR.SHULGIN thinks about future drugs:

www.cognitiveliberty.org/Shulgin/adsarchive/future_psychedelic.htm

[Yeti101]

I think the trick is to find new psychodelics that do not require a great deal of preparation.

[Rev]

Or just new ways of taking the old ones, or different doses.

Take LSD as an example - the resurgence in popularity and drop in average dose goes hand in hand. LSD now probably wont give you a trip anuthing lik ethe doses that once did - but it makes a great Party drug, the stimulation, the colour enhancement, the body mind fusion.

I have seen people let go with awesome fluidity and energy on a dancefloor aided by the new acid - its beautiful

Or finding new way to make the old

I think the tryptamines will be with us for a long time.

The seedring and involvement in the search hav opened my eyes to the marvel of just how much is out there right in front of us.

Looking around in the subtropics here you see whole suites of psychoactive plant and animal life as an integral part of the ecosystem.

The Rainforest trees and their mycorrhizae, the colonisers of disturbance, Psychoactive pondlife, Tryptamine containing grasses and the grazers that eat them thereby making room for the psilocybin containing genera on their dung

And its just the beginning i bet theres heaps more JUST THERE right in front of us we just havent seen it yet even though we see it everyday

The Tropics and subtropics are obvious places to look but more and more arid and cold climate plants are being researched as analogues for the species we know, and the reverse with compounds in arid plants turning up in wet climate weeds (Sida for example) or temperate species with tropical plant alkaloid profiles

For example some land races of Turkish and armenian wild poppies (not somniferum) contain the same chemicals as the Lotus and water lillies (nuciferine, aporphine and related structures)

So theres no need to think of the entheogarden of the future as looking anything like that of today.

[ 19. May 2003, 00:25: Message edited by: reville ]

[Tryptameanie]

Ha ha. He claims that DET, DPT and all C5 substituted indolealkylamines(eg 5MeoDIPT) are not orally active. Wrong, wrong, wrong. *Smug smirk* There's other mistakes in there too. And all his references are from the 60s and 70s. I'm happy for all busy bees that the DEA are so ignorant.

[Auxin]

"I'm happy for all busy bees that the DEA are so ignorant."

Yeah, they definatly dont do their homework. They always say methamphetamine is a synthetic drug not found in nature- WRONG!!! It is in at least one acacia (12.4 ppm in the late season harvest of Acacia rigidula. That acacia has at least 44 alkalods including tryptamines (inc. DMT), phenethylamines (inc. mescaline), amphetamines (inc. amphetamine and methamphetamine), nicotine, etc... For proof see TOXIC AMINES AND ALKALOIDS FROM ACACIA RIGIDULA, Phytochemistry Vol 49 No 5 pp 1377-1380 1998)

One prediction I have for designer drugs of the future are new neo-clerodane diterpenoids. These are found in several genus of plants (including salvia) and include anxiolitic, sedative, euphoric, and hallucinogenic properties depending on structure and dosage. Figure out the structural relationships, find a readily available plant with a high conc. of a precursor to a potentially really good hallucinogenic one or whatever and their could be a new drug on the streets. Unfortunatly it will be misused and banned

One thing I never understood about designer drugs is where do you find a human guiny pig brave/stupid enough to try it?

Maby they simply arent told 'it could kill ya, it could mame ya, or it could give you a few hours of fun'.

[Slarty Fart Blaster]

 

quote:

---

Yeah, they definatly dont do their homework. They always say methamphetamine is a synthetic drug not found in nature- WRONG!!!

---

Do you do your homework ?.

Have you ever tried to contact the author, Dr Clement, to verify this to be true and not take it as PROOF at face value ?. An article in the "Network feedback" section of The Entheogen Review, states it knows of nobody who has recived a reply in a year from the author.

[Auxin]

I dont take it as absolute proof, no (when was the last time you saw absolute proof of any phytochemical analysis?) But I do trust scientists with GC/MS data more than I trust DEA propagandists.

If they cant get an answer from Clement did they try Goff or Forbes?

The species itself is not a big deal anyway, sure it has some cool constituents but the concentration is very low and the problem of seperation of the good ones from eachother and ALL the undesierables makes it useless as an entheogen- but its still a cool oddity to study

[Rev]

Hey auxin - being on the nth american continent maybe you could source some seed for us to grow here? then when the GC/MS becomes available we could test it and publish in response

Best thing about having fresh material is that we could test it at different times of year and all parts

I think that with this whole war on drugs thing we need to state first that with the viewpoint we have we are being actively PERSECUTED.They dont want us confined they want us GONE

It goes beyond rebelling against existing unfair laws - like those that were in place with cannabis the attck is pre-emptive - they have been prohibiting substances with no public use for ages - look at PIKHAL and the analogue acts, and look at the ridciculous farce surrounding Mitragyna up for review now

Those who believe as we do that drug induced states of conciousness are valid and natural human endeavours run contrary to the establishment

They dont want to simply restrict us from things already outlawed - they want to eliminate the viewpoint and practice entirely. The UN itself has a body committed to the elimination of narcotic drugs and the plants they come from.

Were up against massive opposition in collusion. Right and left wing governments, organised religion and pharmaceutical multinationals who want the trade kept in house. The powerful factions of the ruling classes which constitute politicians, bureaucrats, lawyers, priests and physicians want to retain their monopoly on political and economic power. think of chess if youre not one of the backrow and want to guess what your role in society is - pawn

In Australia the TGA works to limit the use of all natural medicines to that sanctioned by them and the costs involved economically exclude grass roots use. Unless you pay the large fees involved you cant even market a chamomile tea bag as being a useful relaxant. This has nothing to do with safety because the herbs included as having culinary uses which fall under testing by the food guidelines by the health dept. can be sold freely.

Theres value in the TGA - but its the table of user pays COSTS instituted after its formation that make it a tool of persectution

so whats the moral? well i have no idea. i dont think we can have a revolution as theres no support - the public beleives what it is told and few are willing to stick their neck out as martyrs.

all i can prescribe is civil disobedience in private. And preserve the germplasm until the political climate is right.

Were not going to win a conventional democratic struggle if the war were winnable by that method then cannabis would have been decriminalised ages ago with the number of 'normal' people that use regularly.

[Thelema]

ncd's i agree with-an acquaintance of mine tried 8mg of splendidin (~92% purity) smoked, however, with no effect. There's truely a great deal of research needs be done on these chemicals....we need a shulgin.

[waterdragon]

you made some good points there rev, i feel as long as a person can educate themselves - can garden - can wildcraft - can show others - then there will always be those who self medicate.

widespread public acceptance of entheogens is a looooong way off but so is widespread public political responsibility. seems to me that the interest in herbal medicines is on the increase constantly, especially preventative and tonic remedies (sars related). many suppliers of chinese medicinals are facing a shortfall in some lines because of overharvesting due to increased demand.

i do believe the gardeners are winning! yesterday we were witches, today we're all just druggies, tomorrow they'll call us terrorists but we shall prevail.

[Auxin]

"yesterday we were witches, today we're all just druggies, tomorrow they'll call us terrorists"

You sure didnt grow up in america!

Over here we are 'educated' that:

Witches = druggies

peace lovers = druggies

drug users = druggies (drug addicts) = depraved violent criminals

druggies = terrorists (this wasnt truly emphasised until Bush II took control, the idiot says using drugs is treason via its alleged support of terrorism )

And much of the population actually BELEIVES this crap (I've often heard people say 'smoking pot makes you a communist baby raper with no ambition- the government told me so' and they BELEIVED IT!!!)

-------------------

"Save me from the tryanny of the majority"

Oh, I'll keep a eye out for those seeds.

[ 21. May 2003, 08:18: Message edited by: Auxin ]

[MrBumpy]

'smoking pot makes you a communist baby raper with no ambition- the government told me so'

HAHA....I love it

-bumpy

[waterdragon]

Auxin:

You sure didnt grow up in america!

thank the creative force for that! problem is that australia is now america, my son is bombarded with u.s shit - t.v, food, fashion, music, attitude, etc. maybe it's a transitional phase that the big island must go through, all that shite used to be british, sad that as a nation we must be so culturally bankrupt to happily take this crap on board.

[theobromos]

My theory is that the Acacia was growing on a drugs stash from someone with a broad taste in pharmaceuticals and a bad memory. It would be interesting to see further testing of the species.

The Canterbury Bell contains an interesting alkaloid in its seed, but the report does not say how much. Perhaps breeding could produce some very interesting precursor compounds.

[nabraxas]

waterdragon- i know exactly what you mean. i work w/a cross section of aussi/lebenese/italian youfs & -though their sense ov cultural identity seems strong- when they go out, they look like they've stepped straight out ov a rap-music video. but then whadda you want? them going out like they just come off the beach or the farm?

what would you define as australian metropolitan culture?

not being argumentative, just wondering.

[waterdragon]

i'm not suggesting that we all conform to a national dress standard. i'd like to think people could just step out dressed sharp or dressed comfy or whatever they fancy as long as it's THEIR thing. this mtv fashion thing has to go, i mean a short while ago it was all east17 (to illustrate my point - cringe). mimicry is the sincerest form of flattery, but it just serves to detail the ease at which many people are dictated to (many willingly) by their television.

as to your query "what would you define as australian metropolitan culture?" well - AUSTRALIAN, not fuckin american. the american system is now so morally deficient that any attempt at mimcry makes me want to attack some mtv wannabe and give them an update on where they are in the world.