Splitting Loph Graft - Help Needed

[Bread Filter]

Hey guys.

I just recently bought this Loph graft and potted it up a couple of weeks ago. I had a look at it yesterday and was horrified to find this huge split. Of course it was at the back of where I look at the cactus so I never actually saw it coming.

Does anyone have any ideas as to what I should do? The cactus is the size of a tennis ball. It had only been watered once on the day that I potted it.

Edited September 9, 2010 by Bread Filter

[planthelper]

nice pic, that fellow will survive, i will transfer this topic though to the cacti specialists!

you have to realy keep any moisture off that gash, otherwise that orange rot will settle in.

just keep the water low for a while.

[Bread Filter]

nice pic, that fellow will survive, i will transfer this topic though to the cacti specialists!

you have to realy keep any moisture off that gash, otherwise that orange rot will settle in.

just keep the water low for a while.

 

Excellent. Thanks for the help. I was worried I'd stuffed it up.

[blangschpeer]

If you're worried sprinkle some sulfur dust in the split to help prevent any fungal infection.

If infection does set in get some mancozeb and mix it into a paste then paint the wound and any other areas that show signs of infection. It may be a bit heavy handed but it has saved some of mine in the past

[.dg]

really good thread about this recently...

likely a tad too much water, made er pop

like PH said, keep dry, dont water soil.

if in humid climate, dusting with sulfur would/might be a good idea

should recover and be Fine

[Bread Filter]

Thanks for all the ideas guys.

I didn't realise there was a similar thread here. I am more than happy to have this merged with that thread.

[incognito]

i would stop watering and put in a dry area. the injury should heal fine at the stage that it is at.

hopefully after it has healed it may pup.

[kindness]

Ouch, the one of mine that that happened to never recovered - well not the grafted version of it. It was a game of wait and see what happens or take all the buttons/pups off and see if I could save them that way. Thisis the link to the thread, there was some excellent advice, but yeah I lost a few of the pups to rot but saved a few as well.

If this were to happen to me again I would not water the plant at all and have it in a very stable non humid environment

[.dg]

Ouch, the one of mine that that happened to never recovered - well not the grafted version of it. It was a game of wait and see what happens or take all the buttons/pups off and see if I could save them that way. Thisis the link to the thread, there was some excellent advice, but yeah I lost a few of the pups to rot but saved a few as well.

If this were to happen to me again I would not water the plant at all and have it in a very stable non humid environment

 

thats the thread..

did you ever hit it with sulfur?

[kindness]

yes i did use a sprayable form of sulfur on it... The rot developed on the inside of the cactus and I thought things were kinda okay until I touched the bits that I was worried about... they were papery thin and if pushed through there was just mush behind it.... I can't remember exactly but it wasn't too long after discovering this that I de-grafted the loph and broke em up into individual buttons. In doing so I got to see that the original button that I had grafted, (which was subsequently covered by all the new pups) had almost entirely been consumed with the mongy orange sort of rot.

I lost a couple of the buttons to the rot during the process of trying to get them to produce roots. I think I may have sprayed them again with the sulfur during this time.

I actually repotted those surviving buttons today. Troublingly their seems to be that papery sort of shit still going on for them beneath the soil :/ I think they will be alright now though, (I hope!) I gave em another whack of sulphur and will continue their no water winter period through for some time now just to let them tighten up and dry out a bit... maybe that will help.

Moral of the story for me was: Allow cacti to settle into new position / environment for a while before watering!

peace

[.dg]

yes i did use a sprayable form of sulfur on it...peace

 

technically wetable sulphur is a fungicide, but the water cant help with drying out the split much i'd think...

my humid climate frinds swear by dry applied sulphur powder

got a pic of this papery stuff meanie?

[planthelper]

i would rather try to, "re graft" in that instance kindness describes, as rooting segments of lophs which have orange rot would be a tricky business.

i have regrafted segments of lophs where i could not cut out all the rot, because otherwise i would not have had anything left for grafting, but, "the graft took off" like a rocket.

r

[mac]

im in a semi arid zone had one split not long ago i just tend to leave them to their own devices & they heal naturally as im in a dry semi arid zone

[ENtiTY]

Good advice by all. Paint cut with Mancozeb and keep cut dry, stop watering immediately, if not already move to a full sun position, once soil is dry re-pot to original smaller pot, start slowly watering once the turgency of the scion has reduced.

At the time of the split the graft will be rock hard to the touch, when this has subsided and the scion feels slightly soft with ever so slight sagging of the skin you will be right to star slowly watering again. Look for signs of growth and check the turgency of the scion before each water. Check the split to make sure its not expanding, slow watering back down to zero and let the graft rest for a couple of weeks if it is. If the stock starts to pup with a split scion DO NOT cut the pups off. This is a god send as the pups will draw energy away from the scion which is what you want and are try to do by forcing drought.

A scion splits because the stock plant is trying to force feed the scion faster than it can use it. A stock grows faster than its scion generally, thats why the graft is done. This means the stock is capable of delivering a much greater volumes of food, nutrient and fluid to its growing points than a loph is not only used to on its own roots, but capable of handling.

One needs to "throttle" the rate at which the good stuff is being pumped into the scion. There are several strategies to help this.

1. Use shorter stocks.

2. Limit the size of the stocks root ball.

3. Monitor the turgency of the graft and water accordingly.

Another contributing factor may be differing dormancy cycles between the graft and the stock. Also genetic traits of the graft play a big part I suspect. I once had a particular specimen that was more prone to split than any of the other individuals in my collection. I theorise that its genetic traits made it naturally a slower grower than the average individual and as such it did not handle life as a graft very well at all.

Something to keep in mind.

Oh and never EVER leaver your grafts out in the rain for extended periods.

Edited November 12, 2010 by Harry

[mutant]

Grafts, even the best and most hard of them can easily be destroyed wet seasons, as inco says. So leave them unprotected only to check their limits. Some WILL be killed, you know...

I usually don't treat splits too. If it is wet weather of the cactus is wet, I bring inside and dry the split/injury part with a fan and some heat

IME and according on other people's reports too, some lophos are orange rot prone.

In mac pic we can see this rot's infection [orange spots]. So far I see this as a scarring infection even though when multiple factors co-exist f.e. burn --> orange rot or mite + orange rot or split + rot + wet weather in a single plant, so an orange rot infection might eventually lead to lossing top or all of a plant, but it's not the rot itself that it's deadly IMO. Nor is a split by that matter

hey, I just though up something....

well carry along. Ok, I have treated one very heavy orange rot infection with a combo of mancozeb and some other fungicide. I found out this particular Lopho strain I have propagated a lot is orange rot prone. Now, this strain is more or less caespitosa, not the extreme caespitosa form , but on fasts stock it will pup a lot. I don't treat those infections, I only protect from wet enviroment when it appears and the infection in general seems to vanish for long periods of time and only comes back for a while, then leaves again. I will be protecting from wetness more from now on.

What I thought was that maybe caespitosa growth and intense pupping on grafts produces softer skins, maybe more prone to this rot. I noticed the orange rot infections might come periodically after each new burst of growth on the scions.

So my point-thought, and let me know what you think, is that some grafted lophophoras might be more prone to orange rot due to unatural growth resulting in thinner / more sensitive skins... I thought of this because the very rot prone strain grafted on slow echinopsis stock in the same conditions, and even left longer in the rain have never showed orange rot proneness.

here's the ones on the echinopsis

For what it's worth, another strain of no-caespitosa single headed lopho I got grafted on pere has never got orange rot and it has been left in the same and maybe wetter conditions than others.

here the rot prone strain on act [cereus] stock

little infection, barely visible

and oh

since its a splitting loph thread

here's a happyn eding to a similar ordeal. but the scion is always orange rot prone

PS: hadnt seen harry's post

I once had a particular specimen that was more prone to split than any of the other individuals in my collection. I theorise that its genetic traits made it naturally a slower grower than the average individual and as such it did not handle life as a graft very well at all.

sounds very similar to my experience. nice food for thought

great comments every body

Edited November 13, 2010 by mutant