platypii Posted July 11, 2007 I've had a search, and can't come up with a lot of goods. Any info on this acacia species would be highly appreciated. Thanking you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonic Posted July 11, 2007 (edited) _ Edited July 12, 2007 by Phosphene_Dream Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hebrew Posted July 11, 2007 that nuts i dont reckon there is mescaline in that acacia or amphetamines but i dont know anything about this plant Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted July 11, 2007 I have to agree with Yowie The reference given was to a google cached page in german My almost non-existant german combined with a babelfish translation showed that the page was written without references. This is a completely uninformative document and should not have been linked as a citation from the wikipedia page. An "Ask Dr Shulgin" page on a similar topic stated that he is questions the results of other research where amphetamines where found in Acacias. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonic Posted July 11, 2007 (edited) _ Edited July 12, 2007 by Phosphene_Dream Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonic Posted July 11, 2007 (edited) _ Edited July 12, 2007 by Phosphene_Dream Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
XipeTotec Posted July 11, 2007 ask torsten, he's german!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted July 11, 2007 Yes. We know Torsten is german. The point was, one does not need to be or know how to read german particularly well in order to decipher the fact that the reference was a dud. Or perhaps no one actually followed the citation given in the wikipedia page? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PD. Posted July 12, 2007 Wasnt this proven to be a stuff up some time back? A case like the DMT that was supposedly found in T. terscheckii i think it was. I cant be arsed lookin for a link or more info though, helpful arent i . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
XipeTotec Posted July 12, 2007 Yes. We know Torsten is german. The point was, one does not need to be or know how to read german particularly well in order to decipher the fact that the reference was a dud. Or perhaps no one actually followed the citation given in the wikipedia page? It was a bit of a joke...never mind, maybe it wasnt funny Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
platypii Posted July 14, 2007 Damn, I missed all this german stuff.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torsten Posted July 14, 2007 Happy to have a look, but no idea what link anyone is talking about. PEAs in acacias has not been disproven as such, but several attempts by researchers [incl shulgin] to contact the the authors of that paper were ignored. which has given most poeple the sense that the authors do not want to defend their paper and their findings. One of these species is being grown where I will have access to it and I intend to analyse it as soon as there is enough material. As for the funky stuff in terscheckii, I presume this was an error in translation or transscription. A common constituent in these cacti is hordenine, which also goes by the name dimethyltyramine. Easy mistake to make. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
platypii Posted July 14, 2007 Well keep us updated as to where your analysis leads you... by what boinsynthetic route would phenethylamine be produced by certain psilocybe mushrooms; actually before I ask that one, does it occurr, as I've heard it does? Sorry to go off topic Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted July 15, 2007 (edited) For some reason Phosphene Dream has seen fit to remove their posts which makes this thread quite difficult to understand. So just to fill everyone in, here are all the links in question: The information behind the original question seems to have been obtained from the wikipedia Acacia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acacia Searching within the page for amphetamine, the second result is Acacia farnesiana. "Amphetamines and mescaline also found in tree.[11]". The reference given ([11]) is a link to a page in the google cache http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:XL1yXM...cd=10&gl=us On this page you will see in a table: "Acacia farnesiana (L.) WILLD. Amphetamine, Meskalin, Alkaloide, Cumarine u.v.a" As far as I can tell this is the only reference to A. fanesiana and amphetamine and comes with no citation. There is no reference list at the bottom of the page, only a 'recommended reading' list which consists of familiar pages which we have all seen before, some books, and some German ones which I don't recognise. So while it is possible that the source of the A. farnesiana amphetamine story is in one of those, I highly doubt it. Edited July 15, 2007 by creach Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torsten Posted July 15, 2007 Interesting page. They must be fairly well connected to have access to Michael Bock's manuscript! I think the entry in the table is confused though. They cite the known references in the text above, but then attribute the PEAs to farnesiana, which was not mentioned in the text. However, smallii, which is mentioned in the text is then described as a synonym for farnesiana. So, the one to search for to uncover this would be smallii. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted July 15, 2007 (edited) Yes, I also considered that. Torsten, did you have a look at the homepage of the author of that article? It was beyond my translatory abilities but looked good. http://www.entheogene.de/markusberger/ A google for "Acacia smallii amphetamine" revealed this pdf: http://uvalde.tamu.edu/pdf/chemtdaf.pdf It's by Forbes and Clement who are the authors behind the papers discussed by Shulgin in the Ask Dr Shulgin page mentioned above (Which is here http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/shulgin/ad...ive/acacia.htm) That pdf doesn't contain any references and doesn't look like it was peer reviewed, but mentions Acacia smallii, although without any connection to amphetamine or other compounds. It is focussed on the species A. berlandieri and A. rigidula which are the ones featured in the papers Shulgin discusses and also A. greggii and A. schaffneri. If anyone wants to see those papers pm me. A google scholar search for "Acacia smallii amphetamine" came up with nothing. I would be really surprised if this is anything other than circular referencing based on an original speculative mention, if it's even that. Edited July 15, 2007 by creach Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
