starting to use brahmi, a few questions

[stonewolf]

By that i mean bacopa monnieri. From other peoples experience, does the memory increase start only at 6 weeks or can it begin before. Also will it nessasarily be helpful at my age, 19, or is it one of those things at arent all that good till you get to the age where brain deteriation starts. Are there other benefits other than increasing memory retention? I did UTSE but didnt really get alot of helpful stuff. Are the increases when they kick in subtle or quite drastic? I've been wanting to try some of the chemical nootropics but they seem to be taboo in australia and even if somewhere does stock them they often turn me away given my age and the fact i dont suffer from drastic memory issues, as if trying to improve oneself is a crime. If anyone could summerise their own personal experiences with this herb that would be wonderful, i just wont to know, and perhaps be reasured that im spending my money wisely on something thats going to benefit my day to day life because with 50 gram bags going for $20 each ill spend $60 or so before i even notice any effects, given its supposed to take 6 weeks. How does it work exactly? Does it improve bloodflow to the brain? Increase the lifespan of brain cells..i wouldnt have a clue, so if anyone could fill ouit these blanks that would be great!

[Μορφέας]

nootropics , ultimatephysique.com.au have them. Iv posted it in nearly all the nootropic threads hehe. Get them there. I dont know anything about brahmi though

[stonewolf]

maybe we need a guide to "Using The Fucking Search Engine". I didnt see that ONCE >_<

[watertrade]

Hi stone wolf,

I have been taking brahmi for about 3 weeks (missing a few days) and I think it might be making a difference. I am finding myself remembering things that I normaly wouldn't - I am surprising myself. I wouldn't expect it make huge improvements but maybe help a little. I don't know why its supposed to work but it has been used for a long time.

I say just take it and see. I also think to make improvements in memory we have to put a bit more work in too. Like if your trying to study a certain topic, you have to actualy put the work in. !

Don't pay $20 for 50 grams , my herb place has it for $4 for 50 grams.

you could grow your own too,

Good luck

[sobriquet]

I have my own brahmi plant and it is prolific. Just put it in a self watering pot and it will go crazy with some dynamic lifeter or seamungus.

You only need to eat a 10cm sprig regularly. I only bother to eat some if I remember as I find it to be the bitterest and most long lasting astringent I know.

You'll have so much after a month you'll have to eat it by the handful to keep up with its growth. I've chosen sele giline over other nootropics because it has an instantly recognisable clean effect and has a clinically demonstrated neuroprotective effect (and in some animal studies prolongs life).

[XipeTotec]

You only need to eat a 10cm sprig regularly. I only bother to eat some if I remember as I find it to be the bitterest and most long lasting astringent I know.

It mustn't be working very well for you then

[sobriquet]

It mustn't be working very well for you then

I don't eat it often enough to really make a judgement on it, but your mileage may vary.

[faustus]

they often turn me away given my age and the fact i dont suffer from drastic memory issues, as if trying to improve oneself is a crime.

yes, i agree. in the academic environment i keep quiet about my nootropic consumption only because there's the implicit view that to take a substance to improve performance is "cheating" ... nootropics create an unfair playing field? so what? so does going to a private school or owning a computer.

re brahmi, there's good evidence to suggest it improves cognitive function in healthy subjects. maximal effects evident after 12 weeks.

a good paper is here: brahmi_chronic_effects.pdf

today i added brahmi to my nootropic stack. as far as cost effectiveness, it's meant to be much better than some of the more exotic ones.

brahmi_chronic_effects.pdf

brahmi_chronic_effects.pdf

[Stonehenge]

Brahmi is good stuff. I buy the powdered herb on Ebay for about $16 a pound usa. You can get the concentrated extract from a number of places. Other good nootropics are choline, piracetam, vinpocetine and others. Buy gelatin caps and cap up your own stuff. You'll need a machine but they aren't too expensive.

[Auxin]

maybe we need a guide to "Using The Fucking Search Engine". I didnt see that ONCE >_

Search is tricky with multiple search terms, easiest is through google by adding this after the search terms:

site:www.shaman-australis.com inurl:forum

[liftyourskinnyfists]

I have been taking brahmi for about 3 weeks (missing a few days) and I think it might be making a difference. I am finding myself remembering things that I normaly wouldn't - I am surprising myself. I wouldn't expect it make huge improvements but maybe help a little.

Have you been using any other nootropics besides brahmi? This question is actually extended to everyone. Id be interesting to get an update on which ones everyones used and there thoughts. I took piracetam and ginko during the fall semester but I didn't notice too many differences. The first time I took it though I did notice that certain "im awake and more aware of my environment" feeling that you get sometimes after meditation.

While on the subject of improving oneself, I read in a magazine (I forget which one) that doing your normal everyday tasks in a different way can improve your memory/other brain stuff. I think they mentioned showering with ones eyes closed and brushing your teeth with your secondary hand, etc.

I've been handling objects and writing with my left hand for about 2 weeks and have gotten quite good with it. As Im typing this I'm using the mouse to the left of the keyboard with my left hand. My left no longer feels like the retarded counterpart to my right hand like it use to. I've also been experimenting with doing tasks around my apartment while blindfolded like dialing my cellphone and avoiding furniture. If it does nothing else it is atleast a fun and interesting way to spend an hour or two.

Anyone else do shit like this?

Sorry, I guess I just broadened the topic beyond the perameters set by watertrade. Maybe I should of started a new topic.

Edited February 11, 2007 by liftyourskinnyfists

[faustus]

Anyone else do shit like this?

yeah, i've been working on becoming ambidextrous for the past 6 months or so. these days i do most things with my left hand, use the mouse, brush my teeth, pick up objects, etc. i also spend about 10 mins a day writing with my left hand and throwing a ball at a target on the wall. writing is the hardest, but i'm pretty decent with my left hand, just a little slow though.

there's conflicting evidence about the benefits of this, some studies have found an association between lack of lateralisation and decreased IQ... others have found an above average IQ in those who can use both hands with equal ability. obviously there's a difference between being "born" ambidextrous, as opposed to chosing to become ambidextrous later in life. i guess it's a little self-experiment in progress.

[liftyourskinnyfists]

there's conflicting evidence about the benefits of this, some studies have found an association between lack of lateralisation and decreased IQ... others have found an above average IQ in those who can use both hands with equal ability. obviously there's a difference between being "born" ambidextrous, as opposed to chosing to become ambidextrous later in life. i guess it's a little self-experiment in progress.

Yeah I've found similar ambivalence between studies concerning handedness and it's supposed association with brain lateralisation.

I think you might have been referring to some of these studies: http://www.anythingleft-handed.co.uk/lefty_research.html

The one article at the bottom entitled, "Ambidextrous: The worst of both worlds?" concerns itself with handedness at birth and intelligence. This paragraph kind of sums it up:

For his study, Crow analysed data taken from 12,770 1 year old children taken in 1969 as part of the UK National Child Development Study. The children had been tested for hand preference, verbal, reading and mathematical ability. The test immediately resolved the age-old argument over whether right or left-handers are more intelligent : the answer is that there is absolutely no difference between them. What was startling was how badly ambidextrous people performed in the study - they did dramatically worse in all 3 tests. Youngsters who were extremely right or left-handed also tended to do poorly, but not as badly as the ambidextrous children.

This is an area where there are few if any definitive answers, but one that intrigues me greatly. I also ran across an article that found that as we age we tend to become more ambidextrous. Of course lefties often are more ambidextrous that righties because they are often forced to use tools made to be used in the right hand. I don't know if choosing ambidextarity later on has many benefits as some suggest, but it doesn't take up any addiitional time and I cant see it doing any harm.

BTW, I've added a picture to my profile and it shows up there but it will not show up when I post. It's under 150x150 so I think it should work. can anyone help?

Edited February 11, 2007 by liftyourskinnyfists

[teonanacatl]

I use brahmi, i used to use it for 6months straight for the semester but no i start mid semester. It does help memory but has side effects like photosensitivity, after using it for 2 years however i dont think i get much out of it anymore.

[liftyourskinnyfists]

after using it for 2 years however i dont think i get much out of it anymore.

Perhaps its still working but you just don't notice it's contribution anymore. Some sort of cognitive tests that could be completed before, during, and after substance [X] would really come in handy. After would be key because doing various memory exercises up to that point would probably improve performance all its own. Everyone could do the same tests and then chart and analyse the resulting data individually and across the board. Perhaps various computer games freeware could work; something everyone would have access too. Crossword puzzles, memory games, sudoku, etc.

[teonanacatl]

Perhaps its still working but you just don't notice it's contribution anymore

I can go on and off it without gaining any appreciable effects besides side effects. I think there are other important things to address such a proper sleep, proper diet, drug use, study habits which play a more important role then taking somthing to boost your brain, Id adress these problems first then start to take the drug, this would vastly improove your performance.

[coin]

from http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0FD..._9/ai_114563492

Mechanisms of Action

Since Bacopa's primary therapeutic use is to enhance cognitive function, most research has focused on the mechanism behind these properties. The triterpenoid saponins and their bacosides are responsible for Bacopa's ability to enhance nerve impulse transmission. The bacosides aid in repair of damaged neurons by enhancing kinase activity, neuronal synthesis, and restoration of synaptic activity, and ultimately nerve impulse transmission. (10)

Loss of cholinergic neuronal activity in the hippocampus is the primary feature of Alzheimer's disease. (11) Based on animal study results, bacosides appear to have antioxidant activity in the hippocampus, frontal cortex, and striatum. (12) Animal research has shown Bacopa extracts modulate the expression of certain enzymes involved in generation and scavenging of reactive oxygen species in the brain. (13) In vitro research has shown Bacopa exerts a protective effect against DNA damage in astrocytes (14) and human fibroblasts. (15)

In animals Bacopa has a relaxant effect on pulmonary arteries, aorta, trachea, and ileal and bronchial tissue, possibly mediated by inhibition of calcium-ion influx into cell membranes. (16) Bacopa appears to stabilize mast cells in vitro, (17) and possesses anti-inflammatory activity via inhibition of prostaglandin synthesis and lysosomal membrane stabilization. (18) In vitro research suggests an anticancer effect for Bacopa extracts, possibly due to inhibition of DNA replication in cancer cell lines. (19)

[faustus]

yeah, IMHO most people interested in nootropics/life-extension seem to be more interested in taking more pills than making basic lifestyle changes, e.g. diet, sleep, exercise, drug use.

[Yeti101]

Recent paper on active saponins in Bacopa monniera interesting read (I thought it was interesting at least).

"Effect of Triterpenoid Saponins from Bacopa monniera on Scopolamine-Induced Memory Impairment in Mice" Yun Zhou, Ling Peng, Wei-Dong Zhang, De-Yun Kong, Planta Medica, 2009; 75: 568-574 .

Abstract

Three new saponins, bacopasides IX−XI (1-3), together with their known analogues bacopaside I (4), bacopaside II (5), bacopasaponsin C (6), and bacopasaponsin D (7), were isolated from the whole plant of Bacopa monniera. Compounds 3, 4, and 6 showed nootropic activity when tested in the Morris water maze test and step-down test of scopolamine-induced memory impairment in mice.

I find the results that it reduced the effect of Scopolamine very interesting.

Edit: Attachment weirdness - pm me if you want the whole article.

Edited May 29, 2009 by Yeti101

[momomoto]

I've grown a few brahmi plants - never let them dry out, it is impossible to overwater them!!! I've even grown them underwater for a period

Mine grows in a big old plastic tub, no drainage, just trim the overhang - give it a 'haircut' every few weeks, dry it under a warm lamp a little, grind it, cap it or just off the spoon. really easy. Tastes bitter, fresh, but sort of reminds me of sprouts, works in easy as part of a salad.

Also on the symmetrical/ambidextrous behaviour, I do it too! It's supposed to be great for stroke recovery - brain can relearn easier? I'm more into it for the benifits of symmetry, but it's really hard to do something for me like undo both shoelaces at once, without pausing to concentrate on one hand for a moment, or doing the whole thing in some wacky syncronistic manner...

just thoughts