psycho0 Posted January 2, 2003 just wondering i've been planting seeds from apples and stuff with alot of success but i was wondering would they produce fruit? thanx Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted January 2, 2003 Yes, but they will probably be substandard- the big, sweet, juicy apples are from grafted trees. One solution- grow those as the root stock, then 'obtain' some grafting stock from a apple orchard and read up on grafting techniques. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mandragora Posted January 2, 2003 If you grow from seeds you will not get the same apple, because the whole variety of the genetic mixture is in the seeds, so you can end with a better or a worse one. Grafting is also fastening the harvest time, so with an seedling you have to wait for apples in a good amount about 3-5 years, -I think this is the time for apples. grafted ones are faster. And it can happen that you end with an giant or mini tree, the grafting stock is also to influence the hight. And to make the tree restistent against some illnesses. But it is a nice experiment and who know maybe you have a great new variety, Called "psycho0" Actually also the rootstocks are selected for this purpurses, like resistence, growing hight and harvest time, so if you use one of your seedlings as a rootstock you can also get a giant apple with rootstock problems and who is throwing down the grafting stock.If you are more interested in the whole sedling selection let me know, I have to re read this things is a time ago as I have learnt about this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waterdragon Posted January 3, 2003 if you have plenty of space for experimentation then grow them to fruiting and taste test the results, you may create some great new varieties which you can then graft onto a dwarfing or vigorous rootstock depending on your needs. i have some very old varieties grafted onto dwarfing rootstock happily growing in my backyard, the reason i went for dwarfing was to keep the spread and yields under control. if you create a great strain you can bring the production forward by bark grafting onto established old trees ie granny smith and within four years you'll have a massive tree of fruit instead of having to wait about 9 years for full production. citrus too can be grown true from seed (not all types). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darklight Posted January 3, 2003 WD if yer interested I have a very old dwarf grafting stock for peach ( and mebbe nectarine )- to a max of 8ft tall- avail, I'll send you some in winter Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
psycho0 Posted January 3, 2003 thanx all i have been using 'pink lady' seed so i'll wait and see how they turn out. mandragora, i would like to learn about the seed selection stuff, thankyou. aaron Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phalenopsis Posted January 3, 2003 good on ya! anything you'll come up with will be better than what you can currently get from the shop... cheers Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
planthelper Posted January 3, 2003 hi, garcinia mangostana on the other hand produces seedlings true to type,its grafts are rejected, sometimes even after years.generaly polyembryotic seeds will reproduce a copy of the parents. once i had a lemontree seedling flowering after forming its third true leave!so early flowering can happen with seedlings! grafting trees is good they say because of selected disease resistance, fruit size and so on but, lets not forget that having acres over acres of the same clone is a feast for predators... only the 3 world people are doing it right thing- they are growing seedling trees! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
planthelper Posted January 3, 2003 why do you say its not ethnobotanical? an apple tree is ethno,"ethno" meaning its of use for mankind... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waterdragon Posted January 4, 2003 Originally posted by Darklight:WD if yer interested I have a very old dwarf grafting stock for peach ( and mebbe nectarine )- to a max of 8ft tall- avail, I'll send you some in winter indeed. this might make a good stock for some golden queen that i have at hand. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
psycho0 Posted January 5, 2003 Originally posted by planthelper:why do you say its not ethnobotanical? an apple tree is ethno,"ethno" meaning its of use for mankind... true you're right there, i was thinking more of the sacrament ethno, i forgot all the other uses it entails. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mandragora Posted January 6, 2003 Okay about seedlings for grafting, as long as I know and can remember it is only selections of seedlings how they grow, I think the most common ist M25-okay in Europe-, a low growing rootstock, hmmm was a time ago I have learnt this, and I always hated fruit growing in uni, but it seems I stick with it, pruning, grafting and selections. Yeah, I should have studied arts. So if you have some seedlings, search for the one who ist not the fastes, so you don't end with a 20m tree and then graft a nice fruit stock on it, I think we did it with tips after pruning and it is hard work. Some injuries with this, some cut thumbs. My mother has a tree with about 10 different varieties in her garden, really good also really old ones, so have fun. I am always afraid to prune that thing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
psycho0 Posted January 6, 2003 some are real fast growing while others aren't so the slow ones are best for rootstocks, thanx Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darklight Posted January 6, 2003 I thought it was the other way round. Why would you want fruit trees that grow slowly? The increased vigour of the rootstock adds a bit of energy to the scion... never mind, another misconception corrected Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mandragora Posted January 6, 2003 (edited) l Edited April 17, 2007 by mandragora Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gwydion Posted January 7, 2003 What´s wrong with apples? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mandragora Posted January 7, 2003 (edited) l Edited April 17, 2007 by mandragora Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted January 7, 2003 Originally posted by mandragora:And after that not hungry for ages, good for any diet Wish that would work for me... Does anyone else know anything that stops your appetite? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted January 7, 2003 "And after that not hungry for ages, good for any diet" Same thing happens with me and chocolate. I get sick and loose my apatite for about 6 hrs, I wonder why that happens. With a few pain killers mixed in it would make a great diet for me, unfortunatly I'm already about 30 pounds underweight so I had to stop eating chocolate all together (not as hard as you might think after a few gallons of chocolate flavored vomit and numerous hours of rolling around on the floor in a fits of pain induced delirium (I've inhaled tear gas and potentially lethal corrosive fumes that were far more bearable than chocolate). Anyway, back to apples. What is it that makes apple seeds toxic? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
licorice Posted January 8, 2003 so I had to stop eating chocolate all together (not as hard as you might think after a few gallons of chocolate flavored vomit and numerous hours of rolling around on the floor in a fits of pain induced delirium (I've inhaled tear gas and potentially lethal corrosive fumes that were far more bearable than chocolate). weirdo! [This message has been edited by licorice (edited 07 January 2003).] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted January 8, 2003 Whatever happened to the story of that african cactus that suppresses the appetite? A real appetite inhibitor...dream of my sleepless nights... NOTHING inhibits my appetite and that's a real bother.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mandragora Posted January 8, 2003 (edited) l Edited April 17, 2007 by mandragora Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted January 8, 2003 ""blausäure"." Cant find my english/german dictionary. Is that oxalic acid? There are many acids in apples, of the ones in there oxalic acid is the most toxic one I know of. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
licorice Posted January 8, 2003 i think blausaure (blue acid) is hydrogen cyanide, although the poison from name of the rose is arsenic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted January 8, 2003 Yup, your right licorice. blausäure = Cyanwasserstoff = hydrogen cyanide. Two of my organic chem books are in german so I can sometimes translate stuff like cyanwasserstoff, but with nicknames like blausäure I get lost. Theres cyanogenic compounds in apple seeds? Damn! Also, I still cant find my german/english dictionary- what does 'ohne Losungsmittel' mean? (it has two dots over the second o) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
