Salviador Posted May 25, 2004 Do you ever think that maybe we are the ones who don't get it? Is it possible that we are just high sensation seekers, controlled by neural impulses to seek new and novel experiences. Is it that meaningless? Do you ever think that maybe we are just damaging our brains and one day we will regret it? Are the higher rates of anxiety and depression present in this population due to our lifestyles, or people with these issues drawn to this lifestyle? These are genuine questions, i hope some sort of discussion might arise out of this, I'd love to hear some opinions... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bloodbob Posted May 25, 2004 Are we really any different from any other thrill seekers? people who do things like racing formula 1 obivously are partially doing it for the thrill and I think their are some real dangers in it. I think ultimate we are all flawed and because of it we do illogical things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darklight Posted May 25, 2004 Brentor/Salviador: Do you ever think that maybe we are the ones who don't get it? Yeah, sometimes. I ultimately decide that no-one really 'gets it' ever anyhow, and having an interest in neurochemical augmentation is just as valid as having an interest in anything else. How its carried out is another matter- and an even more subjective point- when does a healthy interest in 'how things work' and 'pure recreation' cross the boundaries of social and personal productivity or destruction. But that's not the fault of one's interest in drugs- the problem there is with the indivudual- IMO What seriously bores me though, is when people in this ( or any ) field behave as though they are the only ones who full on believe that only people involved in such an interest are capable of understanding The Whole Thing. Thankfully I haven't seen any vocal types like that here, though I did spot one at a party last week before I made for the door Its just as easy to get stuck in one rut as another, I suppose... Is it possible that we are just high sensation seekers, controlled by neural impulses to seek new and novel experiences. Entirely. But that doesn't have to be a bad thing. For example, I personally reckon it beats an unhealthy interest in local soap operas. There's plenty of ways to kill off brain cells and not using them may just be one of them. Is it that meaningless? No, IMO. Personally the things I haver learned directly and indirectly around these topics have added a lot of knowledge, depth and experiences to my life I otherwise would not have. My Federal representative may choose to disregard such attainments as 'meaningless' because of a perceived link to practices that are often seen as undesirable ( as opposed to say, owning a pub and getting obnoxiously pissed at the footy on Sundays ). Others too may judge my work and interests as meaningless- fortunately their opinion isn't important to me at this time. I like my job, and the lifestyle that surrounds it, and believe that forums such as these have good social value. Do you ever think that maybe we are just damaging our brains and one day we will regret it? Maybe. I'll tell you in 20 years or so ;)I reckon lots of things damage brains- boredom, anxiety, bad relationships, aluminium saucepans ( especially when forcefully applied ) Drugs can also damage brains, but that damage can be augmented or entirely overshadowed by other lifestyle factors while still being perceived and/or treated as drug related- and often is IMO. Are the higher rates of anxiety and depression present in this population due to our lifestyles, or people with these issues drawn to this lifestyle? IMO neither. Anxiety and depression are represented at a high level throughout the general population. We just talk about it here more because people here have an interest in their minds, their experiences, and how these mesh with the outside world. These are genuine questions I like them, and hope they spark debate too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ramon Posted May 25, 2004 Do you ever think that maybe we are the ones who don't get it? Is it possible that we are just high sensation seekers, controlled by neural impulses to seek new and novel experiences. Is it that meaningless? Don't see that this would necessarilly mean that it was meaningless. I think that if one was to go from experience to experience without learning anything or not incorporating any aspects of it into their lifes then this could be seen as meaningless. But from my experience most of the people I have met throught this site are generally less greedy and more accepting the people I meet via other avenues Do you ever think that maybe we are just damaging our brains and one day we will regret it? Are the higher rates of anxiety and depression present in this population due to our lifestyles, or people with these issues drawn to this lifestyle? The drug of choice amongst the general community would have to be alcohol and this has to be much more neurotoxic. I think that seemingly higher rates of anxiety and depression can to attributed to a number of causes. 1.Some people who do suffer from anxiety and depression might start a search for more knowledge or natural alternatives to pharmaceuticals and their search might lead them here 2.Due to the anominity of the internet people might be more willing to disclose these aspects more openly , this is enhanced by the accepting nature of these forums 3.It seems that some people have atypical reactions to some drugs ( MJ and anxiety ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted May 26, 2004 I find myself quite often thinking along the same lines... it depends on your attitude towards life. the normal thing to do in society Is have a job, go work make money go home have sex raise children... society says that most drugs are bad and illegal and people should live their lives drug-free within the limits of the law... most people probably drink alc every now and then smoke tobacco but never touch any other drugs... except for the ever growing force of cannabis users... I suppose it depends if one accepts the laws and rulings and traditions of society and feels comfortable with it, or else, you say I don't care what society wants, it's my brain and body and i can do what i like... the health factor has been explained very well by darklight (many things can give you brain damage, most of all conditioning by society) as far me, being a long-term example, I can still type and spell words, so the braindamage can't be that bad... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
strangebrew Posted May 27, 2004 First of all, get what? Life? Is there anything to get anyway? I think some people make it all to complicated for themselves. We can tie our little pea-brains into knots and where does it get us? If you mean conforming, we're not all cut from the same cloth, hard as modern life, globalization and rulers try. To say "we" are just "high sensation seekers" is making a fairly huge assumption. People get high for a whole bunch of reasons. Of course there is a group of people that fall into that category but beneath the surface there are often other issues. Personally, I think a lot of it is self medication, people don't feel as good as they think they should and it doesn't have to be as serious as anxiety and depression either. Modern pharmacology has few answers at this point in time so people look to other means. Whether getting high is meaningless or not depends very much on the individual. If you don't enjoy it or don't learn anything from it, then yes, it probably is meaningless. But does it always have to mean something anyway? New sensations are what make life interesting, the spice of life as they say, whether substance induced or otherwise. Modern life is full of meaningless behaviour, it depends on your own perspective. Personally, I think buying and reading Woman's Day is meaningless but I'm sure a lot of women would beg to differ and Darklight, the "Bold and Beautiful" gave my grandma a lot of enjoyment in her old age before she died at the grand old age of 92 last year, thankyou very much. It was the only thing slow enough for her to follow! As far as doing brain damage to ourselves goes, the human body is remarkable in it's ability to recover from abuse of all kinds and is there hard evidence that such behaviour in moderation causes much damage anyway? Having a wild guess, I would imagine most people on this forum and interested in these topics are freedom lovers and probably don't plan too far ahead, myself included, so we'll cross that bridge if and when we come to it hey. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mescalito Posted May 27, 2004 "...it's like a finger pointing at the moon.....don't watch the finger....or you'll miss all that heavenly glory" Bruce Lee Enter the Dragon.(great flick) The most meaningless things you can do are watching TV,believing what you're told,buying things you don't need,hurting others,polluting your environment and hassling me when I said NO already.......sorry Now The Matrix movies are suggesting to break away from the 'norm' or conformity in a way that psychonauts may be seen to do today.And these movie makers have never taken shrooms or acid or at least a few tokes? It's the obvious next step in evolution :D I see a lot of inter-woven ideas that have sprung from and been passed from one to another through these forums already. I second guess my decisions as much as anyone and I have bullet-proof days and absolute shockers. I still question the reason for this whole game and more often then not get a laugh out of the "looking back" part,so long as I pull through. I guess we're all helping each other along our individual quests for a meaning to the very question you asked Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
friendly Posted May 27, 2004 Huh? Brain work good still. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gomaos Posted May 27, 2004 And these movie makers have never taken shrooms or acid or at least a few tokes? From Matrix 1 near the beginning: "Mescaline, it's the only way to be..." I think some of these movie makers must be on something or other ALL THE TIME... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theobromos Posted May 28, 2004 Witching and magic is for everybody and damn the opinions of the normals. Obviously we have to look after the poor things, they seem reluctant to think or dream for themselves so we must always try to be nice to them. Though metaphorical, I am being serious. The world needs its crazies, our imaginations hold the world psyche firm against the pressure of death, torture, pain and despair which threaten to turn us back into ravening animals. Our dreams of laughter, friendship, love and peace give us the ability to hope and work for laughter, friendship, love and peace. Without the Emperor Norton I of the United States and Protector of Mexico our world would have been so much poorer. The Japanese choose certain artists as "Living Treasures". For me, we are all semi-precious stoners The Simpsons are probably our best Trojan horses at the Gates of Babylon. Guatemalan Insanity Chili, anyone? Perhaps Harry Potter and Terry Pratchett will be changing the hearts of future generations as mine was by the books Midway and the Kingdom of Carbonel. When I was younger I had a dream that I was a part of a demi-monde of almost-vampires/ghosts living unrecognised amongst the humans. We are the Dead. Our objectives so different that the pitchforks and torches would be coming up the drive the moment they knew. Then I went back to sleep. I had to get up early to get to the dole on time Not thinking is beginning to be proved to be bad for the mind. Everyone knows that it is the old ones who have worked and thought all their lives who live long and prosper. How do you think so many of the Rolling Stones are still alive? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darklight Posted May 28, 2004 How do you think so many of the Rolling Stones are still alive? Stem cells transfusions from the Blood of the Lamb? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rev Posted May 29, 2004 If you were just like them you wouldnt have come If you were just like us youd never leave But youre somewhere inbetween and youve got a whole lifetime to learn to be happy with that I used to think that we could make revolution by turning people on with plants, that it might radically alter society. that someone taking mushrooms would somehow wake them from their slumber to again become curious, challenging active people I no longer think this or pursue it with any evangelical fervour. Now i sit back and watch as we get a steady stream of newbs trickling in and really getting into it and contributing to it all people come to us - out there there are a limited number of people who for some reason have a spark of curiosity and a need for it And drug taking isnt the definition either though most get around to it. Ive seen people take mushrooms as just another party drug, E without personal insight and other powerful entheogens 'just for to get wasted'. Take a look over at the shroomery if you dont believe me that mushrooms dont MAKE you enlightened You cant give someone a drug and expect it to open them up, in fact it may do the opposite The person has to want to, has to already be curious and interested in changing the way they look at the world. The drugs are just catalysts to further development within a mindset where the journey take precedence over destination. I dont think in 20 years well have more damaged brain cells than the norm , though some of us may skew the statistics unfavourably, but what we will have done is moved on from the first phase to a more mature phase on an individual level probably less energetically curious and less outwardly enthuiastic but probably ultimately more productive at achieving real influence we may have brought a new species to the community, discovered the mechanism of action, changed a law in favour, published literarture or artwork that make a fork in the pathway of social discourse on consciousness and reality or we may have just convinced some friends or raised some children to think more for themselves and demand cognitive liberty. For those in proffessional or political training among us in 20 years you may find yourself in positions of real power in society and therefore have the opportunity to alleviate some problems All the names we know (and dont) in the field today may have been us 20, 40 or 60 years back. Though much has been done, ultimately nothing has been completed. what we are doing isnt a waste because its just one facet of expression of who we were born to be. And you cant get depressed about what might have been had you turned away earlier but really we need to concentrate on what we will be doing in future Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
