True secrets of psychedelics: Are they everything they’re cracked up to be?

[CLICKHEREx]

http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads/725444-True-secrets-of-psychedelics-Are-they-everything-theyre-cracked-up-to-be?p=12400053#post12400053

slimvictor

Moderator
Drugs in the Media

Today 11:03
Mind-altering drugs can open us up to the amazing possibilities of the universe — but true self-discovery is harder

The cactus skin arrived in the mail in a packet marked “for botanical examination only.” We whizzed it up in a blender. Two truant teenagers in an empty kitchen. We tried mixing the resulting green powder with water and drinking it. The taste was so foul it was all we could do to stop ourselves vomiting. In the end we mixed it with Cherry Coke to ameliorate the flavor and then we drank it all up.

The skin contained a naturally occurring psychedelic drug called mescaline. Soon, everything seemed to vibrate. It was as if the walls, windows, even the chairs were humming a low, beautiful melody. Then I noticed that we were speaking in colors. My friend’s words were blue swirls and mine were green. Our conversation curled and twisted in front of my eyes like smoke in a vacuum chamber. Later I held a glass of water, gazing at it for what seemed like an immensely long time, its utility swallowed up in its beauty and it seemed that the whole Earth existed within that glass and the thought occurred to me: “I’m in the presence of God.”

Ten years later I was staying in a tiny monastery deep in a Thai forest. I had been living and meditating there for close to a month. My mind was still — still in the way a tuning fork rests after being struck for a long time. I sat outside watching the fading light graze the trees, feeling egoless and empty of thought. Butterflies erupted from the green foliage in a movement that seemed so excessively beautiful I was thunderstruck and as I looked, I thought: “Damn, this is exactly like mescaline.”

It’s not just me who has made the link between psychedelic drugs and meditation. Indeed, the link between psychedelics and spiritual experience was the first line of inquiry Timothy Leary and his cohorts pursued in their 1960s Harvard experiments. In the 1990s, Dr. Rick Strassman ran a series of experiments using a powerful psychedelic known as DMT, and he too noticed the similarity: “[The effect of] DMT has a similarity with experiences that are possible with a lot of meditation,” he said.

Scientists are currently conducting separate studies on psychedelics and meditation — both are being trialed to treat the same conditions. A review study by the Journal of the American Medical Association, released in March this year, found that meditation may be as effective as medication in treating conditions such as depression and anxiety. Hot on the heels of this study was the Psilocybin Cancer Anxiety Study at NYU’s Bluestone Center for Clinical Research, which found that Psilocybin (the active drug in “magic mushrooms”) was effective in treating anxiety and depression in terminal cancer patients. There are now dozens of studies that document how both meditation and psychedelics can treat depression, addiction, anxiety and PTSD.

So if psychedelics produce similar effects to long periods of meditation and other austere religious practices, could we have stumbled upon what Strassman calls “the spirit molecule”? Are psychedelics an alternative to spiritual practices?

Hardly, say the Buddhists. The second noble truth of the Buddha is that “the origin of suffering is the attachment to desire.” Psychedelics are by their nature an experience, a strange and beautiful one but often elusive. This creates a craving to have the experience again. It is this craving that is the Buddhist definition of discontent. Rather than freeing the mind from attachment, psychedelics create more.


cont at
http://www.salon.com/2014/06/08/true...cked_up_to_be/

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Clocktower

Bluelighter

Today 11:59
It's very cool to see psychedelics being discussed in the context of medicine and spirituality like this. On the other hand I think the article's premise is a bit straw-manish, AFAIK nobody has argued that a psychedelic experience is equivalent to meditation. It seems a bit pretentious of the author to claim that there is one true path to self-discovery and it happens to be the one he took.

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Crankinit

Bluelighter

Today 12:04
Excellent article, and I agree with his conclusions. I would love to see more scientific exploration of both psychedelics and meditation, but the former isn't a subtitute for the latter.

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CLICKHEREx

Bluelighter

Today 12:26
I have tripped many times on LSD and magic mushrooms ("Goldtops", in Darwin, Australia) and never experienced any craving for them, nor do I now, but I do/did for cannabis, alcohol, amphetamines, synthetic cannabis and tobacco. I think it's because the former don't engender any actual euphoria in me, and aren't physiologically addictive.
It's true, though, at least in my experience, that meditation is an excellent treatment for anxiety (as is EFT - Google it, and there is a YouTube video) and with depression it keeps activity out of undesired locations in the brain, and provides a welcome break, in which there is no depression, although not everyone is capable of meditating in the usual manner, but nearly everyone who can follow simple instructions from their own voice recording can use Yoga Nidra, (actually a meditative form - no physical flexibility, or asanas/special bodily positions is involved) so I include it for others to try:

"The mind can be like a naughty child: what we tell it to do; it won't! So sit, or recline comfortably in a room, which is neither cold nor too warm, in dim light, but not in pitch darkness, with fingertips pointed upwards, not touching anything. Take plenty of time with each section: to hurry in this exercise is to completely miss the point. If others are involved, take even longer (ask later whether they felt hurried, and adjust). You may prefer to make a voice recording with the following instructions: Focus all your awareness on your right big toe .... .... then the other toes of the right foot ... .... then that foot ... .... the ankle............. the calf.............. the knee... .... the thigh ... .... Then left big toe...........then other left toes..........then that foot...........the ankle.............the calf.............the knee............the thigh...........

Then the right thumb...........then other fingers of the right hand............then the right wrist............the forearm...........the elbow............the upper arm............the right shoulder. Then the left thumb..............then the other fingers of the left hand............then the wrist..............the forearm..............the elbow..............the upper arm................then the left shoulder................then the head................then the chest.................then the abdomen.... ....Then, focus your attention on any sounds you can hear; aeroplanes, traffic noise, children, or dogs barking in the distance................. Then refocus your awareness on your right big toe....................the other toes, and repeat that sequence exactly as before. Next, focus your awareness on the thoughts which come into your mind. Now is not the time to follow those thoughts; just be aware of, and note them.

Then refocus your attention on your right big toe, and go through that sequence again..................... Next, refocus on anything you can hear.................. Then, once again, on your right big toe, and repeat that sequence. Then refocus on the thoughts coming into your mind..................... Keep repeating this process for around 20 minutes, at least. Eventually, the mind will tire of this, and reach a state of calm. If you are tired, or physically fatigued, you may find yourself falling asleep. You may then go through the process again. If it occurs regularly, however, ensure you are getting adequate sleep, and not running a "sleep deficit", like so many people in modern Western society, who are materially rich, but time poor. Try practising it earlier in the day, when you are alert, and rested. Otherwise, it should be regarded as an attempt by the negative part of your mind to resist change, which it regards as moving into unknown territory: a frightening prospect, for some people. Exercise determination, and persevere with the process".

Last edited by CLICKHEREx; Today at 13:02.

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herbavore

Moderator

Today 12:48

I like to think of psychedelic drugs as opening perception, erasing the usual borders and limitations so that we are able to experience, if briefly, the true nature of being; being part of this gloriously complex web of all life. Trips do end and hopefully there is time to sit with the depth of what you experienced for a good long time before the responsibility of daily living knocks at your door. But is that an attachment? That has not been my experience. The author, like so many other seekers I read, fails to see that he is attached to his practice, to a set of beliefs and traditions (in this case Buddhism), to the idea (and it is after all only an idea) that attachment is the cause of suffering.

The author's experience with psychedelics was during his adolescence; so was mine, and I can relate to what he said about craving more and more experiences like that at that time in my life. But eventually I did not crave most of what I craved (and was attached to) back then. I haven't done a psychedelic drug in over 40 years. I certainly don't think of it anywhere near as much as I think about my meditation practice. Using words like crave and attachment amp up the conversation unnecessarily. I don't crave meditation, but I do want to do it every day.

Why do people feel the need to quantify and qualify everything so much? When I heard John Coltrane for the first time, my world expanded. I carry that experience, appreciate what it gave me and have continued to listen to his music, along with all the other music that touches me, throughout my life. I have an attachment to music. I don't crave it every moment of my life I simply love the places it takes me. The same way the author loved sitting in the forest and seeing those butterflies--through his stillness he was able to perceive the beauty around him and to open deeply to it.

I think his article would have made more sense to me if it was comparing the addiction some people develop to having to constantly be in an altered state using psychedelics, but to simply compare their use to a spiritual practice and then to come to the conclusion that they are simply another "need" or desire is way off the mark. If a person chooses to trip once a month with the intention of exploration into their creativity or their spirituality, how is that different from fasting once a month or taking part in a sweat lodge? It never ceases to amaze me how people can become so blinded by dogma that is purportedly aimed at transcending judgment. I once heard a (western) friend that is Buddhist say, "Buddhists hate all drugs". I told her that was like saying "Buddhists hate flowers."

And just one last point, although it is a minor one:terminally ill cancer patients experiencing anxiety don't have a lot of time to become accustomed to a "practice". While mindfulness techniques and guided meditations are no doubt profoundly helpful, why in the world would anyone want to deny them the immediate benefits demonstrated by the NYU study?

Edited June 9, 2014 by CLICKHEREx

[DiscoStu]

please keep this shit out of the cactus forum.

[myco]

agreed maybe a lil harsh bot hahaha

then again i do that myself sometimes

this should just be in the chill space or something i think not the cacti forum

we dont need posts about mescaline here even if its just a reposted article

Edited June 9, 2014 by myco

[hostilis]

I agree with bot. This has absolutely nothing to do with growing cacti.

[Sallubrious]

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CLICKHEREx

Bluelighter

Today 12:26

I have tripped many times on LSD and magic mushrooms ("Goldtops", in Darwin, Australia) and never experienced any craving for them, nor do I now, but I do/did for cannabis, alcohol, amphetamines, synthetic cannabis and tobacco. I think it's because the former don't engender any actual euphoria in me, and aren't physiologically addictive.

It's true, though, at least in my experience, that meditation is an excellent treatment for anxiety (as is EFT - Google it, and there is a YouTube video) and with depression it keeps activity out of undesired locations in the brain, and provides a welcome break, in which there is no depression, although not everyone is capable of meditating in the usual manner, but nearly everyone who can follow simple instructions from their own voice recording can use Yoga Nidra, (actually a meditative form - no physical flexibility, or asanas/special bodily positions is involved) so I include it for others to try:

"The mind can be like a naughty child: what we tell it to do; it won't! So sit, or recline comfortably in a room, which is neither cold nor too warm, in dim light, but not in pitch darkness, with fingertips pointed upwards, not touching anything. Take plenty of time with each section: to hurry in this exercise is to completely miss the point. If others are involved, take even longer (ask later whether they felt hurried, and adjust). You may prefer to make a voice recording with the following instructions: Focus all your awareness on your right big toe .... .... then the other toes of the right foot ... .... then that foot ... .... the ankle............. the calf.............. the knee... .... the thigh ... .... Then left big toe...........then other left toes..........then that foot...........the ankle.............the calf.............the knee............the thigh...........

Then the right thumb...........then other fingers of the right hand............then the right wrist............the forearm...........the elbow............the upper arm............the right shoulder. Then the left thumb..............then the other fingers of the left hand............then the wrist..............the forearm..............the elbow..............the upper arm................then the left shoulder................then the head................then the chest.................then the abdomen.... ....Then, focus your attention on any sounds you can hear; aeroplanes, traffic noise, children, or dogs barking in the distance................. Then refocus your awareness on your right big toe....................the other toes, and repeat that sequence exactly as before. Next, focus your awareness on the thoughts which come into your mind. Now is not the time to follow those thoughts; just be aware of, and note them.

Then refocus your attention on your right big toe, and go through that sequence again..................... Next, refocus on anything you can hear.................. Then, once again, on your right big toe, and repeat that sequence. Then refocus on the thoughts coming into your mind..................... Keep repeating this process for around 20 minutes, at least. Eventually, the mind will tire of this, and reach a state of calm. If you are tired, or physically fatigued, you may find yourself falling asleep. You may then go through the process again. If it occurs regularly, however, ensure you are getting adequate sleep, and not running a "sleep deficit", like so many people in modern Western society, who are materially rich, but time poor. Try practising it earlier in the day, when you are alert, and rested. Otherwise, it should be regarded as an attempt by the negative part of your mind to resist change, which it regards as moving into unknown territory: a frightening prospect, for some people. Exercise determination, and persevere with the process".

Last edited by CLICKHEREx; Today at 13:02.

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You're not dreamwalkers alter ego by any chance ?

[Dreamwalker.]

You're not dreamwalkers alter ego by any chance ?

I'm not sure how to take that?

I do my best to keep my ego on a leash alter or otherwise, that said I only skim read this post.

Maybe you could explain what you mean?

and it appears it would be more appropriate for the chill space...........

Edited June 9, 2014 by Dreamwalker

[Sallubrious]

It was just an observation................pertaining to..................the punctuation..............of the text.

Sorry I couldn't resist that.

That type of punctuation could be considered as a signature style that is quite rare, to see two different members using that style seemed like both authors have something in common.

Sorry if it's not you mate, no offence intended.

[Dreamwalker.]

Hi Sally

Your totally right, I never noticed that..........its actually just a keyboard thing, with traditional hand writing you'd use comers, cause your doing it by hand, but with key boards you can drift from one idea to the next by.........which creates a space, a moment.........it bothered another community member, who seemed to be reading every full stop, which seemed a bit odd to me, so I try to avoid doing it now (cramped my style )................give it another decade or so and everyone one will be doing it.........................seems like a natural thing to do....what can I say...........as for my actual hand writing, I can't even read it now, its just an impatient/frustrated scribble.

I would add however if my alter ego "CLICKHEREx" is reading this (WHO is from OZ, which would kinda make me omnipresent or a kickass hacker), I'd be curious if you..................are doing the same for the same reasoning?

Edited June 14, 2014 by Dreamwalker

[CLICKHEREx]

Point taken about the difference between cactus cultivation and use / experience.

......................... represents the time allowed for people to shift their awareness from one area to another and focus on it for a matter of seconds.