mutant Posted July 3, 2012 BabaBudh you're doing it wrong.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
opiumfreak Posted July 3, 2012 you can die of mandrake SUCKER!!!!!!!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BabaBudh Posted July 4, 2012 BabaBudh you're doing it wrong.... Appeal to personal authority Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ayjay101 Posted July 4, 2012 Last I heard nobody has ever deliberately ingested anthrax (or metallica) I've deliberately ingested metallica in the past I will NEVER do it again. promise. same goes for tropane containing plants, unless they're a minor component of a smoke mix. My 2 cents: read more about the tropanes and tropane experiences - as many as you can. Perhaps on Erowid. Then if you still must have the experience for yourself, do it safely at a mild dose with a sitter watching over you and then move on. The deliriant nature of the experience makes it hard to have meaningful and useful experiences when using these plants alone IMO. It's the sort of thing you'll easily be able to get out of your system in just one or two mild experiences, before moving on to bigger and better things. When you've danced with some of the other plant teachers and had but a glimpse of the other miraculous possibilities, you'll feel foolish for having been so desparate to have even gone there in the first place - at least that's how I feel. All the best 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goneski Posted July 4, 2012 (edited) I don't have the facts and figures but I can safely assume it was no great jump to improve upon the middle ages, and was achievable with better nutrition and hygiene and abundance. There are many cultures ancient and modern which live longer lives than the average westerner, and many 3rd world countries with very low life spans. Many new diseases are arising, atom bombs and wars, environmental disasters etc. I am not opposed to science I am opposed to scientism. Besides the issue of dosage, is there a single claim I have made, which either of you has a link to peer reviewed study, which disproves a single thing I have said? Scientism? wtf? And if you don't have the facts or figures, then don't post wild conjecture. Simple. Sorry, but I can't find a peer reviewed study refuting the existence of Russell's Celestial Teapot or other unfalsifiable entities / beliefs. Take a basic course in Epistemology. Again, if you're going to make positive claims, provide evidence. Don't just say "I don't have the facts or figures.. Buuuuut....", and then expect people to dig up peer-reviewed scholarly articles attacking your position. You'll find with the advent of western medicine, food / nutritional science and various other sciences and health sciences, life expectancy has increased. You'll also find that violence has actually been on a decrease for centuries now. Modernity has overall drastically improved the lives of people. To state otherwise is extremely disingenuous in the face of overwhelming evidence. New diseases are arising because they evolve like all other living organisms. They mutate / respond to vaccines. Simple, really. Just think about how worse off we'd be WITHOUT immunology. http://pac.iupac.org...f/7410x1957.pdf From the Abstract: ". A comparison of the characteristics of natural and synthetic substances within these categories shows a similar range of favorable and unfavorable effects. It is apparent that molecular structure and dose determine the effect of substances on human health, not whether they are of natural or synthetic origin." http://www.nejm.org/...199808063390606 http://www.newscient...-than-ever.html If I had the time and motivation, I could practically spend all day trawling through medical journals pulling out study after study. I'd almost suggest checking out the References in Pinker's works.. All peer reviewed, scholarly journal articles. Edited July 4, 2012 by SYNeR 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mutant Posted July 10, 2012 I am all for bashing scientifism / scientism, but this is the perfectly wrong thread to make such claims. buba, if you are claiming your own experiences to support , having only 30+ posts then we dont really if you are really knowing what you are talking about, so your own appeal is less strong, sorry. I am not an authority but I have smoked several times datura and henbane leaf [D.inoxia, D.stramonium, D.niger, D.alba] and I have smoked once belladona, which I have said is pretty SAFE, if you dont overdo it. Not having an underlying psychotic disorder would also help to be safer... But saying ingesting [any amount] is not such a big matter is clearly wrong man, sorry and making all these claims about scientific authority, starting from this thread is clearly DOING IT WRONG IMO cheers 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BabaBudh Posted July 29, 2012 (edited) ... and LOVING IT! experience being the qualifier, I am sorry if you do not consider me qualified to comment upon my own experience, however, though not quanifiable, I assure I am the foremost authority upon my own experience. Which is the only argument I am making from authority. Respect my.... I never proposed that any one should believe in my experiences over their own, I only defended my right to express my experiences and beliefs. First I am told I should not make reference to a dream, then I am told I should not retort exposing scientism. I reserve the right to speak freely from general common knowledge, experience or reason. --------------------------------- In relation to brugmansia, ancedotally speaking, I and some of my friends have a fair pool of experience to draw from. It is a traditional method to make a tea. If I and other experienced friends, had misused the plant our experiences would have reflected that, in that it would have been clearly unpleasant, and yet we have had experiences which were not disagreeable as opposed to the many ‘jump in the deep end’ experiences reported. A more methodical approach to standardisation could have been used. None the less a happy medium was still found. We have not noticed any obvious effect from smoking leaves. ---------------- D.Stramonium species, (seeds seem to be considered the most potent/toxic part, should not be eaten) "the alkaloid concentration in samples obtained from different parts of the United States varied by as much as 50%: 1.69-2.71 mg/g for atropine and 0.36-0.69 mg/g for scopolamine." - http://pubs.acs.org/...021/jf00088a040 D.Stramonium seeds contains about 2.7 mg/g atropine, and 0.66 mg/g scopolamine - Poisonous plants and animals of Florida and the Caribbean Each D. stramonium seeds contains about 0.05 - 0.1 mg of atropine (D/L-hyoscyamine). - Critical care toxicology; diagnosis and management of the critically poisoned patient. http://content.herba....ew.asp?i=41959 The pharmacologically active compounds in the plant are tropane alkaloids: atropine, scopolamine, and hyoscyamine. The concentration of these compounds varies according to plant part and condition of the plant, but typically ranges from 0.25 percent to 0.70 percent. On analysis angel's trumpet contains an average of 0.20 mg of atropine and 0.65 mg of scopolamine per blossom. These substances have many legitimate medicinal uses. The recommended therapeutic dose of scopolamine or atropine is 0.5 mg for an adult. Although survival of much larger doses is common, fatalities have occurred with as little as 10 mg of scopolamine. http://cms.herbalgram.org/herbclip/pdfs/010183-128.pdf "….a total ingested dose of 435 mg. No atropine was detected. The scopolamine was confirmed by TLC. An oral dose of 50 mg of atropine sulfate in humans has been reported fatal, but there is no reported fatal dose for scopolamine" – http://jat.oxfordjou.../4/216.abstract http://www.ces.ncsu....son/Brugmsp.htm http://scienceblogs....t-will-fyou-up/ http://www.indiankan...org/doc/845354/ http://www.thepoison..._suaveolens.htm http://www.thepoison.../blog220212.htm http://152.111.1.87/.../TB/19k/01.html http://www.facebook....338633289483444 -------------------------------------- If all intagibles were Celestial Teapots, we should have a tea party. I think therefore I am a celestial teapot. I'm a teapot, I'm a teapot... have a cuppa tea, have another one... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell's_teapot#Counterarguments ‘Philosopher Paul Chamberlain says it is logically erroneous to assert that positive truth claims bear a burden of proof while negative truth claims do not. He says that all truth claims bear a burden of proof, and that like Mother Goose and the tooth fairy, the teapot bears the greater burden not because of its negativity but because of its triviality, arguing that "When we substitute normal, serious characters such as Plato, Nero, Winston Churchill, or George Washington in place of these fictional characters, it becomes clear that anyone denying the existence of these figures has a burden of proof equal to, or in some cases greater than, the person claiming they do exist."’ ----------------------- ‘Carl Sagan explains in his book The Demon-Haunted World: Appeal to ignorance: the claim that whatever has not been proved false must be true, and vice versa. (e.g., There is no compelling evidence that UFOs are not visiting the Earth; therefore, UFOs exist, and there is intelligent life elsewhere in the Universe. Or: There may be seventy kazillion other worlds, but not one is known to have the moral advancement of the Earth, so we're still central to the Universe.) This impatience with ambiguity can be criticized in the phrase: absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. For instance, absence of evidence that it rained (i.e. water is the evidence) may be considered as positive evidence that it did not rain. Again, in science, such inferences are always made to some limited (sometimes extremely high) degree of probability and in this case absence of evidence is evidence of absence when the positive evidence should have been there but is not. Arguments from ignorance can easily find their way into debates over the existence of God. It is a fallacy to draw conclusions based precisely on ignorance, since this does not satisfactorily address issues of philosophic burden of proof. But null results are not ignorance and can be used as evidence to achieve a given burden of proof.’ ----------------------- The dream police are running around in my head. The Jeffers Corporation does not support combustible activities or the belief in dreams ‘Einstein once said that he thought in a stream of pictures. He used mental imagery to help him think and create new ideas. He liked to play with what he called "thought experiments" where he would imagine all sorts of wild and unusual ideas. The idea of relativity came to him after he imagined what it would be like to ride on a beam of light.’ http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_was_Einstein's_way_of_studying_and_thinking#ixzz218WKWAC6 --------------------------------- Natural vitamins may be superior to synthetic ones http://www.sciencedi...306987700910909 Abstract There appears to be a tendency to label those who profess that natural vitamins are better than synthetic ones as quacks. This broad brush label may be stifling legitimate nutrition research. This paper describes physiochemical differences between certain natural and synthetic vitamins, proven clinical advantages of natural vitamins, and some of the effects this labeling may lead to. It concludes that lessons of history as well as modern science support the view that natural vitamins are nutritionally superior to synthetic ones. http://www.notdoctor...innate_book.pdf http://www.nutrition...ts/vitamins.pdf http://pac.iupac.org...f/7410x1957.pdf From the Abstract: ". A comparison of the characteristics of natural and synthetic substances within these categories shows a similar range of favorable and unfavorable effects. It is apparent that molecular structure and dose determine the effect of substances on human health, not whether they are of natural or synthetic origin." Is an erroneous conclusion. http://en.wikipedia...._of_peer_review 'Peer review failures occur when a peer-reviewed article contains obvious fundamental errors that undermine at least one of its main conclusions' Even an infant can tell the difference. ‘Infants discriminate between natural and synthetic vitamin E’ http://www.ajcn.org/.../4/899.abstract I suspect a conspiracy of rogue mafia underpants gnomes on drugs. Step 1 – Collect drugs. Step 2 - ??? Step 3 - Profit (Drugs Goooooood!) Asserted statements or assumptions are made about the benefits of various drugs presented, with very few side by side comparisons, and little internal logic leading to the conclusion. Not a single instance offered, of a substance being improved by making it synthetic. The purported improvements are only cited when the substance has been modified from the original molecular structure, almost wholly skipping potential complications. Apple and orange comparisons. It also says there has not been enough research done into natural medicines to evaluate their effectiveness for comparison. It presents examples which it cites as being 'nature identical', yet presents no clear cut side by side studies showing their effects to be identical, only presenting examples, mainly of benefits, without side by side comparison. As well as managing to conveniently bypass the abundance of studies showing otherwise (the old 'there is no evidence... see') Claims are made that Marinol is as effective as THC extracts. There aren't a lot of studies on the comparisons and differences of Marinol and medical marijuana. Yet we all know what everyone prefers. http://norml.org/lib...m/part-2#prefer 47 Ibid; National Academy of Sciences, Institute of Medicine. 1999. Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base. ”The poor solubility of Marinol in aqueous solutions and its high first-pass metabolism in the liver account for its poor bioavailability; only 10-20% of an oral dose reaches the systemic circulation. The onset of action is slow; peak concentrations are not attained until two to four hours after dosing. In contrast, inhaled marijuana is rapidly absorbed. … Variations in individual responses is highest for oral THC and bioavailability is lowest.” http://www.biomedcen.../1471-244X/5/17 http://66.116.176.65...55-marinol.html http://www.canna-cen...com/Cancer.html http://www.drugtext....lar-culture.pdf http://www.marijuana...rinol_0794.html http://www.cbsnews.c...62-5209380.html http://valetudocafe....t-to-long-life/ -------------------------------- Nature Identical http://ask.metafilte...tical-identical http://fedup.com.au/...l-or-artificial http://www.cosmetics...ry/4949087.html http://www.facebook....150337140824922 ---------------------------------- ‘ Sidebar: Deadly Reactions by Joel Albers Adverse reactions to legally-prescribed drugs is the fourth leading cause of death in the United States. According to the American Medical Association, legally prescribed pharmaceuticals kill approximately 106,000 hospitalized patients annually, are responsible for an estimated 198,000 related annual deaths and necessitate 23% of all hospitalizations. Deaths from herbals occurs to much lesser extent; the FDA has received over 2,900 adverse event reports (including 104 deaths) about thousands of herbal supplements. The FDA estimates that for every report that at least ten adverse events go unreported. Interactions between prescribed and herbal drugs also lead to many deaths each year, and are quickly becoming a major public health concern.’ ----------------------------- muscle balm http://essentialoils....com/blog/?p=81 ---------------------------------- Vitamins A • On November 23, 1995, the following was reported in The New England Journal of Medicine. 22,748 pregnant women were given synthetic Vitamin A. After four years the study was halted because of a 240% increase in birth defects in babies of women taking 10,000 IU daily, and a 400% increase in birth defects in babies of women taking 20,000 IU a day. Women eating natural food sources of Vitamin A showed no increase in birth defects. B http://www.drheise.com/bvitamin.htm (101 references) C • Reported in Reuters Health, March 3, 2000 was a study of men who took 500 mg of synthetic Vitamin C daily. It was found that over an 18-month period, these men had a 250% increase of the intima-media lining (inner lining) of the carotid artery. This thickening is an accurate measurement for the progression of atherosclerosis. That is, synthetic Vitamin C induced atherosclerosis, even at 500 mg dose. Whole food Vitamin C protects and repairs the inner lining of blood vessels, and is preventative against atherosclerosis. https://raubenheimer...inea%20Pigs.pdf http://www.thedoctor...-not-vitamin-c/ E http://cnc.cj.uc.pt/~sandramr/Curso_PD/alpha-ttp.pdf http://journals.camb...line&aid=434605 http://www.febslette...e/S0014-5793(98)01210-1/abstract http://onlinelibrary...1880.x/abstract ‘Natural vitamin E was tumorigenic in both strains of female mice only when injected with soya oil. In contrast, dl-α-tocopheryl acetate alone was capable of inducing tumors in Fischer 344 rats’ • Reported on April 14, 1994 in the The New England Journal of Medicine was a study in which 29,000 male smokers were given synthetic beta-carotene and synthetic Vitamin E to evaluate the cancer-protective effect of the “vitamins”. After 10 years, the men taking the synthetic beta carotene had an 18% higher rate of lung cancer, more heart attacks, and an 8% higher overall death rate. Those taking Synthetic Vitamin E had more strokes. Food sources of these same nutrients, such as fruits, and vegetables, consistently demonstrate protection against cancer, heart attacks and stroke. K http://bloodjournal....040709.full.pdf Edited July 29, 2012 by BabaBudh 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ballzac Posted July 29, 2012 Baba, your post would be more compelling if you made an attempt to phrase it in a coherent paragraph or two. Make your points and provide the references that you believe support your points, rather than just posting a whole heap of disjointed thoughts accompanied by links. When you have so much you want to say, it makes for difficult reading, and while the general gist of your post is fairly clear, it's difficult to actually isolate individual points from your post in order to evaluate their validity. You can't justify using non-peer reviewed articles as evidence by posting a wikipedia link about valid concerns over the peer-review process. Besides, if you follow the references back to the source, the article is actually about the flaws of the reply process and suggests ways of improving the letter publication process. It does not suggest abandoning the peer-review process and instead using what amounts to the opinion of individuals to support scientific claims. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whitewind Posted July 30, 2012 (edited) The very first shamans, the very first curious people will have tried things the very first time; this was the only way to discover is something is toxic or not; whether it has any effect at all, or whether it was a food. This would have been the only way to trial something at the dawn of time. Some people will have died from ingesting very toxic plants. If we didn't learn from this, more people would have died, and would still do so to this day - it actually still does, when people surprisingly frequently eat something like Destroying Angel mushrooms thinking they are food. It is a dangerous business. It should not be taken lightly. If you must bio-assay (ingest) your substance, the best thing to do would be to see what other people have done before you, where there is that information. Where there is not, you would try very tiny amounts, and see what it tastes like - bitter, almonds, sweet, cloying? I have heard of many occasions where people have gone off the rails by ingesting too much Datura. It's horrifyingly common. But we are not talking about something new, we are talking about an ancient plant used almost exclusively by shamans, witch-doctors and herbalists - BUT ONLY EVER IN TINY AMOUNTS. There is a huge knowledge database about these substances compared to many others. Anyone considering trying ingesting something new should read up on it first. Not only that, it is very common for people to use a substance for years and then suddenly and unexpectedly get an intolerance - even something like pot can have this effect, it is well documented. It has happened to me. It is not sensible to go around doing stuff based purely on dreams - if we did stuff like that I would be going around killing people or letting my child run into oncoming traffic. You need to INTERPRET the dream, not follow it blindly. Drugs have a bad name, and there may be some underlying reasons for it which have caused the crazy war on drugs - and one of them is that large amounts of most medicines are very toxic and can kill or cause serious mental illness. Edited July 30, 2012 by whitewind 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mutant Posted July 30, 2012 Baba>> ... and LOVING IT! well after this last answer I am now positive you are an idiot how do you like that? you got no point, get over it your messed up 'opinion' is dangerous 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BabaBudh Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) how do you like that? you press the 'Like This' Button you got no point, get over it Teapots are admittedly somewhat spherical, but I do have a spout. Tip me, ....over it. your messed up 'opinion' is dangerous I'd offer my opinion but I wouldn't want to hurt anybody. …..this was the only way to discover is something is toxic or not; whether it has any effect at all, or whether it was a food. I am sure there were also other ways of making observations. Cosmological assumptions are also being made, most notably that empirical knowledge is the only form of knowledge. It is not sensible to go around doing stuff based purely on dreams - if we did stuff like that I would be going around killing people or letting my child run into oncoming traffic. You need to INTERPRET the dream, not follow it blindly. These are some strange dreams that would compel you in such a manner. Following almost anything blindly is dangerous. The implied accusation is not contextually complete. A dream is not purely an isolate, it is a part of a stream of consciousness, which is self evaluating, within particular circumstances and experience. Interpretation is open to interpretation As is the word TINY. or half a handful ***** Not a dosage recommendation hand·ful 1 A quantity that fills the hand. 2 A small number or amount: "one of a handful of attorneys" A handful in cooking refers to 1 and half tablespoons half a handful/ Tbsp equates to about 1 gram of dried parsley If we look at the various reports of alkaloid content and toxicity, (speculatively 1 gram of) dried brugmansia leaf is even by worst case calculations 1/3 of the way to the minimum lethal alkoloids for an adult. take the highest recorded alkaloids 2.7 mg/g atropine, and 0.69 mg/g scopolamine from seeds And the lowest quoted fatal dose (greater than)10 mg atropine or (greater than);2–4 mg scopolamine (source/form of alkaloid unknown) http://en.wikipedia....monium#Toxicity ‘The amount of toxins varies widely from plant to plant. There can be as much as a 5:1 variation across plants, and a given plant's toxicity depends on its age, where it is growing, and the local weather conditions.[7] Additionally, within a given datura plant, concentrations of toxins are higher in certain parts of the plant than others, and can vary from leaf to leaf. When the plant is younger, the ratio of scopolamine to atropine is approximately 3:1; after flowering, this ratio is reversed, with the amount of scopolamine continuing to decrease as the plant gets older.[10] This variation makes Datura exceptionally hazardous as a drug. In traditional cultures, a great deal of experience with and detailed knowledge of Datura was critical in order to minimize harm.[7] An individual datura seed contains about 0.1 mg of atropine, and the approximate fatal dose for adult humans is (greater than)10 mg atropine or (greater than)2–4 mg scopolamine.’ Not to say it couldn’t do some serious mind fucking . For me in context of my prior experience was not really such a death defying amount. Rumors of my death have been greatly exaggerated. The leaf or seed seem to have the highest scopolamine ratio Scopolamine is (from memory) 8 times stronger Anticholinergic than atropine More alkaloid content Information by parts of plant http://www.ib.uj.edu.../iranbakhsh.pdf http://www.inflibnet...iewFile/516/487 69ron says https://www.dmt-nexu...=posts&m=118889 ‘Scopolamine is more hallucinogenic than either hyoscyamine or atropine, and of the three it’s the only one that would absorb through the skin, so the effect you get from the oil should be just the effects of scopolamine.’ Do you have a reference for the tiny dosages traditionally used? Certainly when used as an admixture the dosage was relatively low, though I don’t know if you would call this amount TINY (@ 49:30) http://video.google....97210003271509# However when used as the main ally enough was used to induce visons. Traditional Usage http://escholarship....37r1g44r#page-4 ‘Datura was ingested for as many as 5 days to develop their power’ http://books.google....ngested&f=false The legitimate source of Castanada’s Datura information http://the-wanderlin...960s_paper.html "The man whose ally is the weed never intakes the flowers, nor does he intake the stem and leaves, for that matter, except in cases of his own illness; but the roots and the seeds are always intaken; especially the seeds; they are the fourth head of the devil's weed and the most powerful of the four. My benefactor used to say the seeds are the 'sober head'; the only part that could fortify the heart of man. http://www.angelfire...es1/datura.html Some Related Stuff Activating lower safer doses of datura using cramp bark http://www.drugs-for...ad.php?t=153204 Antidote http://en.wikipedia....Anticholinergic http://herbs.maxforu...tura-poisoning/ http://misc.medscape...7-business.html A Botanical http://www.botanical...t/thorna12.html Stramonium was Smoked to Treat Asthma http://www.drugstore...l=4&level_id=79 Anticholinergic Smoking Cessation Therapy http://www.erowid.or..._article1.shtml Edited August 1, 2012 by BabaBudh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theuserformallyknownasd00d Posted August 2, 2012 (edited) this link that you posted baba is great http://escholarship....37r1g44r#page-7 it shows just how important it was to certain cultures as a true medicinal healer. it also points out at various times even the datura cult were scared of its power to "not return spirits to earth" and such... it also pointed out they were aware of the seasonal strength differences and the strength differences between parts of the datura plants. maybe its just your posting style that i find hard to read, but i havent read once you write to take a super duper long time to research this plant and its effects. id personally recommend they thoroughly read all the links that you are posting, they contain some amazing information... i also recommend they get specific weights of plants at certain seasons also, weights that have been tried and tested. this thread is turning into an advertisement for tropanes, with you as its head honcho (i fully understand this comment may offend but im talking about how its perceived, by many of our SAB members and the whole friggin google cache..) the other thing i wanted to point out that in the above link i reposted, nobody ever prepared datura for themselves... i believe their to be great reason for this.... :-) d00d Edited August 2, 2012 by thed00dabides Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BabaBudh Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) Fair enough, it is not my goal to be in promotions of tropanes. All of the warnings concerning tropanes are well founded. If you think you're experienced enough to try it, it could be like the tarot fool stepping off a cliff.. Look very, very carefully before leaping, in most cases don't even leap. If you do take baby steps, in a child proof environment with a baby sitter. Smoking is considered much safer and less enduring. Smelling could be safer but don't take my word for it, I think there may be some species at certain times of the season where this is also dangerous. There are no redeeming features of taking too much, and few at all from any use. My original comment was too candid for a forum and was more suited to a private conversation. There are some points I have avoided making, in case misunderstanding leads to misuse. Do your own research and as said do lot's of it. Traditional usage had many observances that needed to be followed (fasting and not eating meat, that's a good one mentioned), and even traditionally it is misused by the nefarious, or the naive, and is rarely recommended even to the initiated, Even then many who use it are considered mad or power mad (the origin of the word thug refers to a sect of Kali worshipers who would make daily sacrifices of intoxicated and robbed victims, a common theme). Do not go to India seeking an authentic Datura experience. It is not my entheogen of choice, not even close (though I have respect), and should be the last one to even consider. 9 out of 10 reports on erowid have reported negative to traumatic results, delerients have the highest level of all drugs to receive negative reports. It is not psychedelic or euphoric, and as Ganesh Baba said 'Beware the non psychedelic' Edited August 3, 2012 by BabaBudh 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mutant Posted August 3, 2012 That last post is good, and some of your links are good too Didn't know the Thugs were using datura to intoxicate their victims. I still have great memories of a book about india and thugs and all that I read young Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WoodDragon Posted August 3, 2012 I still have great memories of a book about india and thugs and all that I read young Biff Brewster? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mutant Posted August 3, 2012 Nope its this one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mystery_of_the_Black_Jungle and what do you know? its been shot as a film!!! cool! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darklight Posted August 4, 2012 Didn't know the Thugs were using datura to intoxicate their victims. I still have great memories of a book about india and thugs and all that I read young I've recommended it before, but there is a seriously good book outlining that the plague of murdering dervishes may not be the case, and that this myth was begun and perpetrated by an English soldier during colonial times with a definite interest in having his pet projects government funded to try to vanquish the 'threat' It's really good reading, and a great travelogue, no matter your previous beliefs about the Kali cults, he also wrote an excellent book on khat The Kali book is: http://www.amazon.com/Children-Kali-Through-Bandits-British/dp/0802714188?tag=duckduckgo-d-20 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CβL Posted August 5, 2012 Look guys, none of you have answered the question: How to prepare Mandrake. I will answer the question. 1) Take your mandrake root and put it into a sealed container. 2) Put the container into a backpack, or some bag that you can carry with you. 3) Take a walk to the local river, pond or entry to hell (whichever is easiest). 4) Sit down once you're there, take a few deep breaths and relax 5) Open the container and bring out the mandrake root. 6) Throw the mandrake root into the river/pond/entry to hell and run back home and never look back. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whitewind Posted August 5, 2012 Whatever you do don't cut it up first as it will scream at you and send you mad! (I saw that in a dream, or was it a movie?) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BabaBudh Posted August 6, 2012 (edited) I saw that dream too. (Harry Potter & the chamber of secrets) we should do that.. (sorry about unedited comment, was just kidding but in bad taste) Edited August 18, 2012 by BabaBudh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FancyPants Posted August 16, 2012 (edited) Have noticed effects off as little as matchhead size of mandrake root! Highly recommend starting VERY tiny! Edited August 16, 2012 by FancyPants Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BabaBudh Posted August 18, 2012 smoked it I assume? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mutant Posted August 21, 2012 if everything works out, I will have a couple of live plants at the end of this automn. To look at of course and to get proud about... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WoodDragon Posted August 23, 2012 You shouldn't have too much trouble mutant. They're pretty forgiving as long as you give them deep soil (at least a metre, and give it to them basically from the get-go - the roots rocket down like crazy), and keep them dry once they start to brown off to dormancy. And if they appear to rot away from excessive wetness, don't give up hope; you might find them resprouting again 6 months later from a little bit of healthy side-root, as I did after a wet winter. Their germination, if you're going down that road, is a little more tricky. I've described that in detail elsewhere, but essentially you need cold stratification mimicking snow cover/melt, and a lot of patience. Use biodegradable pots, and transplant them into their final home as early as you can, because they really do sulk if you disturb their roots, especially if they're not in dormancy. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mutant Posted August 24, 2012 wow thanks for that. actually I was hoping to find a couple live plants, they are native in greece, perhaps if I am lucky at flowering size and eventually , with the years try to create a batch from seed. You're saying the seed doesn't germinate well? snow?? I doubt that it is so necessary, in various places it grows in greece it never snows... did you have a particular species in your mind? my first target is M.automnalis. I should know by end of november... it flowers in automn Share this post Link to post Share on other sites