Help me with tattoo design :)

[ballzac]

So, I've been planning on getting a DXM based tattoo for over 5 years now. I'm absolutely positive I want it based on the old-school robitussin image:

The trouble is, I'm not sure how to implement it. I could just literally have that image as is, but that seems a little boring. I could do something basic like give it a shadow or put it on the front face of a cube, but again, it's not that exciting.

I already have this:

which represents LSD to me. I could possibly have the two tattoos connected in some way. Eventually, perhaps, I will have a whole heap of entheogenic symbols. Maybe with an ipomoea vine entwining the whole thing or something.

Anyway, it's a struggle to think of how to incorporate these two designs. They are quite contrasting in their form. In addition to this, most psychedelic imagery which may be appropriate with future entheogenic symbols is not appropriate for me with rob (the robitussin guy). For example, it would possibly fit in better with the 'organic' curves of the Aum if Rob was rippling or broken in the mosaic shards or something, but this doesn't fit that well with the DXM symbolism.

This makes me question whether there is actually a way to combine the two separate ideas, while being faithful to the full meaning of each symbol. Perhaps I need to consider either combining them aesthetically, or staying true to their individual symbolisms.

For me, DXM imagery is mostly to do with neo-classical architecture. I don't know how one would go about incorporating that into a design that is congruent with the Aum and the psychedelic symbolism that may come in later tattoos. I don't think it's possible, so I will avoid that I believe.

There is a great deal of other symbolism that I associate with DXM, but it would be difficult to pick one or two things to include and they would seem, I believe, bizzarely juxtaposed. I could write a thesis on DXM imagery, and picking one specific thing seems a bit weird, with the exception of neo-classical elements of design.

Anyway, it's probably going to be a while, maybe a year or so, before I actually get around to getting the tattoo, but I want to work out designs as soon as possible. I know there are a lot of good artists on these boards, many of whom are interested in tattoo art. In addition to this, a lot of people here are going to understand my reasons for getting a tattoo and perhaps empathise with some of the issues I'm having with design more that a tattoo artist who isn't into ethnobotany will. So if anyone has any ideas or advice on how I might tackle this, let me know. Even if you have some ideas that are simply aesthetic and ignore my problems of the contrasting symbolism, I'd love to hear them as it might come down to aesthetics in the end if I can't reconcile those problems. Cheers people

[Khala]

Cool plan for a tattoo man. I reckon keep it as is.

It won't fit the style of theme you may eventually go for but doesn't really matter. However, you could probably tribalise the image into a style similar to your Om/Aum to fit.

In the end its up to you, but I'd stay true to the image.

Peace.

[Marcel]

I personally think there's too much emphasis placed on unifying multiple tattoos. I like a multitude of tatts because they can be markers of many specific moments in time. They should reflect this patchwork-like nature of life. For example, one might have the stupid tattoo they got as a 16 year old, then the name of the girl they loved in uni, then a mushroom tatt to mark the time in their late 20s when they discovered entheogens, then a Buddhist wheel to mark their spiritual re-birth in middle age... To try to cover them up, or meld them together, is to try to mask the impulse of the moment in which the tattoo was acquired. All moments in life are valid; mistakes are as important as successes.

Think of a tattooed body not as an art gallery, but as an old tree in a park, etched with the initials of hundreds of lovers over several generations.

Or an old travel suitcase, covered in stickers of various destinations.

Or the way a 19th century sailor marks each new port with a new tattoo.

I like the Rob design, actually. And your thoughts on DXM have intrigued me; I've never been interested in the stuff until now

[ballzac]

Hey, thanks to your input, both of you. I like your view on this, Marcel, but whether you like it or not, tattooing it an artform. You can make a statement in a work of art by avoiding aesthetics and focusing on the process itself or the meaning behind the work. But I also like aesthetics. One way or another, I hope to make it work aesthetically. That doesn't necessarily mean it has to combine with the Aum, but I don't know if the rob image without any modification (even something as simple as the shadow would improve it I think) would work for me.

The whole box would be cool I reckon:

Three dimensional and everything, maybe from an oblique angle. The writing's kind of cool "Pharmacy Medicine" etc. Though I'm worried it starts to look too much like an advertisement for a specific brand, especially as it has the name on it. The reason I like the image of Rob is the fact that he actually looks like he's having a dissociative experience, and even though it's a brand logo, it has personal meaning to me.

Edited November 8, 2011 by ballzac

[FancyPants]

What about Rob spewing forth light/wave colour patterns? I don't know what YOU see, but I don't tend to see block colours/patterns, rather more fluid gradations of colours, like mottling with faint background geometrices. Even spewing out from the third eye instead?Still with keeping the basic shape of the head on the box. Just ideas

[Max Cady]

 

speaking of stickers Max cady comes to mind

[ballzac]

What about Rob spewing forth light/wave colour patterns? I don't know what YOU see, but I don't tend to see block colours/patterns, rather more fluid gradations of colours, like mottling with faint background geometrices. Even spewing out from the third eye instead?Still with keeping the basic shape of the head on the box. Just ideas

 

Actually, I very rarely see stuff like that. I tend to see hyperrealistic scenes. I will be floating through a mansion and I can see every little detail in the wallpaper and the brickwork. Everything is in perfect proportion. Sometime it is a plant, and I can and entire plant, but at the same time I can see every detail in every leaf. It is like infinite resolution and everything is in focus.

The closest I get to what you're talking about is puffs of smoke similar to those in this ad

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkTFrwnL5eA

The might be a nicer colour like a rich purple but would always be a single colour. And in those puffs of smoke I could see every individual 'grain' that it is made up of and every detail of the texture of that smoke. I've also seen silk scarves appear from nowhere in the middle of a room, as though they are being ejected by an invisible source. Again, I see every detail of the texture of the silk.

One reason I'm not sure about including specific DXM imagery is that I could never replicate that 'infinite resolution' effect.

Thanks for your input. Much appreciated

[Marklar]

@ marcel loved that explination you gave, got me thinking (ive got a shit forearm tattoo i got when i was 16 ) . ill have to show my mate whos coved in shit tattoos! maybe it will make him feel better haha

im looking at getting more tattos in the near future just looking for designs aswell ive got this topic watched to what comes up

good luck with getting nice a design ballzac

ps oms remind me of acid too ahah

[ballzac]

I'm thinking something along these lines. It incorporates the cube idea and the shadow to give it some three-dimensionality and presence. The transparent parts give it an 'empty shell' feeling which is another major theme with DXM for me. I always sense that there is an emptiness, a void, beneath the intricate imagery.

[solomon]

Wow, great design! +1 I like that you kept straight lines in the tat.

Your tussin experiences sound very familar, Ballzac

I was going to suggest something involving robocop..

[Alice]

That is a good design Ballzac. +1 from me too.

[ballzac]

Wow, great design! +1

 

That is a good design Ballzac. +1 from me too.

 

Thanks guys. I thought it looked a bit flat, so I added some edges to bring it out a bit. Still thinking about it as I'm sure there's more that could be done with it.

I was going to suggest something involving robocop..

 

Like this?

[Foo]

how about taking away the shadow and have the inside of the box showing through the transparent regions.

[ballzac]

Hmmm, I think I like having the shadow to give it depth, but I like the idea of seeing the inside of the box. Do you think it should have Rob on the inside faces too? Or should it be a flat colour or something?

I've been thinking of where to put it on my body, and I'm thinking something like this would be kind of cool:

But I also have to consider finances and I'm not sure how much that would cost. Notice I also put a shadow under the Aum. I think that would be an improvement. I'm thinking if the Aum shadow is closer and not as blurred as the cube shadows it will make the cubes look somewhat on a different plane.

EDIT: The Aum takes up the full width of my upper arm, so you have to imagine the cube going around the side next to it.

Edited November 8, 2011 by ballzac

[faustus]

@ballzac, out of curiosity, have you ever tried ketamine IM?

why not have the chemical structure of DXM in a conformation that superimposes into the ॐ?

[ballzac]

@ballzac, out of curiosity, have you ever tried ketamine IM?

 

Nah, I'd love to, but I'd want to make sure a) that I had medical grade stuff, and that I had a good enough supply of it that I could experiment a bit rather than just going for one or two big doses. Oh...wait...ketamine is illegal, right? I wouldn't do anything like that

why not have the chemical structure of DXM in a conformation that superimposes into the ॐ?

 

I've thought about doing the whole chemical structure thing, and I think maybe it's too cliche for such a non-cliche drug. I actually would love one of those glass molecules from Erowid in the shape of DXM, though it's not one of their standard ones. Anyway, I might never get something like that as a tattoo, but if I do I may save it for a mescaline one...a nitrous oxide one would be cool too, nice and simple.

[FancyPants]

I love the shadowed cubes. That's more like what I see actually.

[Psylo]

This is only my opinion, but I'm uncomfortable with the idea of a corporate image as a tattoo. You don't need it to be recognisable as "Rob" in the eyes of others, as long as it has that meaning to you.

That said, I would take the original, and "Alex Grey-ify" it. That of course may be meaningless, as I have no first hand experience with DXM.

Maybe I should try it this weekend, so I can better understand the design potential. (I'm not kidding !)

Have you considered getting your Dad to draw something for you?

All that aside, I do like the face outline in the cube, a lot, and in different sized multiples.

[Psylo]

[ballzac]

This is only my opinion, but I'm uncomfortable with the idea of a corporate image as a tattoo. You don't need it to be recognisable as "Rob" in the eyes of others, as long as it has that meaning to you.

 

I would normally be uncomfortable with a corporate image too, but for some reason I feel very comfortable with having the image of Rob as a tattoo, and I guess that's all that matters. Also, I think taking that image and doing something with it (like the cubes) is a bit different to, say, getting a tattoo of the coca cola logo or something. There's also a subversive element to it, because my interest in their product is outside its indicated usage, hence using their image doesn't seem like being branded to me.

That said, I would take the original, and "Alex Grey-ify" it. That of course may be meaningless, as I have no first hand experience with DXM.

 

Yeah. This is the dilemma I have. My future stuff probably WILL have more of that alex grey feel, because most psychedelics have that to some extent. Mescaline, LSAs, LSD, mushrooms, DMT all have that feel. But DXM has none of it. Doing anything like that would be a purely aesthetic endeavour.

Have you considered getting your Dad to draw something for you?

 

Like Alex Grey, I think his style is much more suited to the conventional psychedelic stuff, so I'm not sure how much help he would be, but it's probably a good idea, even just from a design/composition point of view, to bounce ideas off him.

[ballzac]

Oh, also, Rob changed his appearance a few years ago, so the image I'm using isn't even their current image. It's a nostalgic, retro thing, and this adds to my willingness to use the image.

[Foo]

Hmmm, I think I like having the shadow to give it depth, but I like the idea of seeing the inside of the box. Do you think it should have Rob on the inside faces too? Or should it be a flat colour or something?

 

Taking the Robo off the inside sounds like an awesome idea, just a flat white. Maybe keep the shadow of the box, but with the "inside" being filled it would only be visable around the edges.

Just my take.

[ballzac]

I like the sound of that. In fact, with the inside of the box white, I could have the shadow inside the box as well. The only thing I'm worried about is it might lose that empty shell kind of effect. I'm going to draw it and see how it looks.

[ballzac]

I had a bit of a brainwave, and I've come up with another little idea, though I don't think it's perfect yet. This 'paper jam' effect is something that I see often on dxm, though I think it's usually vertical or slightly diagonal, but for the purposes of a tat I think it looks good horizontal for some reason. Still working all that stuff out, but here's a quick idea of what I want it to look like:

[Psylo]

You may wish to reconsider using white ink. Sun damage can often alter the colour so it becomes a pus-like yellow. Also if too much blood is mixed with the pigment it can appear slighty pink.