Keeping Reptiles

[Psylo]

It has been an occasional consideration for a few years to buy my partner a reptile, and a recent post by a new member has rekindled the idea. For those in the know, can you answer some questions ? She has previously suggested a chameleon, but I would be more comfortable keeping an Australian reptile to avoid supporting illegal trade.

1. Is it cruel to keep a reptile in a big fishtank (6ft long) and indoors with the requisite heating &light spectrum? I promise i will empty the water out. We have a cat, so a free-willy lizard roaming around might create dramas. Probably for the cat.

2. Is a specific certification required, as I recall reading about a Herpetology licence for keeping/trading snakes & frogs.

3. Do I need to breed mice or insects to feed a reptile?

4. How do I ensure I get one bred legitimately and not poached from the wild ? Or, are many species not endangered? - if it's the norm to buy a caught wild reptile I'll try to trap one myself with a shoebox, tin whistle and a banana on a string.

5. Anything else ?

[Alice]

3. My cousin breeds mice to feed his pythons. We were all at his place for christmas a few years ago, I can clearly remember the drama that unfolded as my grandmother observed "The Feeding". We haven't had christmas there again.

[Amazonian]

Is it cruel to keep a reptile in a big fishtank (6ft long) and indoors with the requisite heating &light spectrum? I promise i will empty the water out. We have a cat, so a free-willy lizard roaming around might create dramas. Probably for the cat....

Depends on the reptile??, a tank like that would be suitable for something like bearded dragons, a small python( childrens python), geckos, dwarf monitors.... ( It can be cruel to confine some animals, but sometimes, if you provide plenty of food , water, correct temperature and lighting, they are getting an easy life.They can just sit back and eat, breed and sleep)

Is a specific certification required, as I recall reading about a Herpetology license for keeping/trading snakes & frogs.

Each state has a different license setup. You do need a permit to keep reptiles and frogs (and some other animals). http://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/wildlifelicences/applnformsandfees.htm

Do I need to breed mice or insects to feed a reptile?

Its cheaper to breed your own insects . 'Roaches ( cock roaches (woodies)) are the easiest to breed. Mice and rats are time consuming to breed . It is also illegal to feed live mice/rats to reptiles so you would have to knock them on the head or gas them ( not something i do or have done) . You can buy frozen rats/mice from breeders and pet shops.

How do I ensure I get one bred legitimately and not poached from the wild ? Or, are many species not endangered? - if it's the norm to buy a caught wild reptile I'll try to trap one myself with a shoebox, tin whistle and a banana on a string.

hmmm, never tried the tin whistle,lol, but you can buy herps from breeders that also have the permit. Everything is documented in a log book( although this can be doctored,i don't recommend it) http://www.herpshop.com.au/TraderMain.html

 

Anything else

You need to think about whether you travel often and who is going to look after what ever herp you choose. Vet bills for reptiles are over the top so you need to be able to pay for vet fees if anything major arises. Bearded dragons are dags and fun to watch. A python while lovely , spends most of its time curled up in a corner or hiding in its hide box. I suggest you see what reptiles you can keep in your state and research each one that tickles your fancy. You might want to go an aquatic/terrarium scene and go turtles?. Yeah , but definitely research.

Happy herping

[Psylo]

Thanks for the replies. I would probably look at the requirements for keeping a Lawsons Dragon (Pogona henrylawsoni). There's a herp shop out west where I often get supplies for my other hobby, so next time I might drop in and have a chat with the staff. I might start learning some of the ins & outs of reptile keeping first, which species are prone to infection (I just saw a horrible sick python video on APS forum).

So netting a dragon in the wild is not good form ? I have no idea of the endangered status.

Happy herping

 

That's almost the exact same last words an ex said to me years ago. She always did say she enjoyed a lot of snakes in the past.

[Amazonian]

So netting a dragon in the wild is not good form ? I have no idea of the endangered status.

That's almost the exact same last words an ex said to me years ago. She always did say she enjoyed a lot of snakes in the past.

 

Was your ex's name Medusa?.

Netting/catching a reptile from the wild usually has a sad ending. Reptiles that are caught from the wild, and then confined, usually keep trying to get out. By doing this, they rub their snout back and forth on the cage walls. The result is a snout that is rubbed back to expose bone. Wild caught animals stress easily and then get sick. Also wild caught herps carry pathogens that you wouldn't want to expose to existing herps.

The dwarf beardies are pretty neat and an ideal size for a 6' tank.

[Max Cady]

not a big fan of having pets or feeding wild creatures , if you find an injured one and build it back up to health cool but not into pet ownership myself.

[Magick81]

Reptiles rock! lols

Lawsons dragons are cool! They have the advantage of staying small and cute too, hehe

I have no experience with them myself, though have read that many have tendencies to being flighty and not tolerate being handled. Thee are of course exceptions to every rule, and each animal will have its own personality, regardless of what has been said about the species. Do some research and contact some breeders. APS is a great to start. If you want to avoid the ilegal dodgey poachers, only deal with people who will only deal with you if you have a license. NSW parks keep detailed records of how many animals they have, how many are born, and how many sold. It's not foolproof, but it makes it a little harder for poachers to pass off wild caught animals as captive bred.

I see you are in sydney. You can apply for your reptile license here: http://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/wildlifelicences/GettingAReptileKeepersLicence.htm

As for the chameleons, I absolutely love them, and if given the opportunity, I would find it hard to resist, hehe

Although, there are consequences of breaking that law. I've heard stories of keepers losing their whole collection to the authorities after being caught with "exotics". Not to mention you'll probably get fined.

Keeping them being cruel? I dont think it is, as long as you provide it with everything it needs and look after it. In nature the majority of reptiles hatched will never make it to adulthood. Our beardie is a "free range" beardie and pretty much has run of the house, lol, and I'm gonna aim to set my python up in a habitat as close as possible to the real thing.

With food, many petshops now stock reptile food so you dont have to breed your own. I buy mine bulk online and have it shipped to my house. Works out alot cheaper, and the quality of the food is better: http://personalpetservices.vpweb.com.au/

Theres a wealth of info out there, if you need any help just flick us a PM :D

Cheers

Magickz

Edited September 26, 2011 by Magick81

[Magick81]

Oh, and another thing, its not the best idea to keep retiles is glass tanks as they do not hold the heat well. If you must, the glass must be insulated. In most cases, a fake rock background and sand on the floor is enough. But a bare glass tank will lose its heat not long after the heat turns off. Most people in the hobby are using wood cages, preferably melamine because it is waterproof, with glass doors.

Edited September 26, 2011 by Magick81

[Moses]

A 6foot tank would be great for some painted dragons also, great colours not quite chameleon but some are quite eye catching.

http://black.net.nz/aus9040056.jpg

http://museumvictoria.com.au/bioinformatics/lizards/images/pictllive2.htm

[Amazonian]

True magick81, in glass tanks it is hard to maintain the heat. I personally wouldn't keep snakes in a glass tank for that reason. I prefer glass tanks for lizards though. I like to use a substrate that mimics the lizards natural habitat. Some lizards like to burrow, and to allow this , I like to keep some parts of the sand slightly damp so it doesn't keep caving in when the animal tries to dig a tunnel. ( a container of mosit sand could be added to a melamine box also )Some of the melamines on the market don't go too well with moisture. There is a moisture resistant grade( HMR) but it needs to be well sealed at the cage joins. Yeah, lots to consider.

Edited September 26, 2011 by Amazonian

[2meke]

Was your ex's name Medusa?.

Netting/catching a reptile from the wild usually has a sad ending. Reptiles that are caught from the wild, and then confined, usually keep trying to get out. By doing this, they rub their snout back and forth on the cage walls. The result is a snout that is rubbed back to expose bone. Wild caught animals stress easily and then get sick. Also wild caught herps carry pathogens that you wouldn't want to expose to existing herps.

The dwarf beardies are pretty neat and an ideal size for a 6' tank.

 

ive also heard of scarred snouts on water dragons in small glass inclosures as their fight or flight response is to bolt. for that reason beardys are the best choice here for tanks.

also a warning to NZ members, my friend is a reptile breeder here and he got a phone call from a lady saying she had a tuatara living in her tree and he could have a look if he wanted. he was pretty confused because the only tuataras in the area should be in captivity and theyre not known for their arborial skills. he went for a look and it was a mature bearded dragon. he works at a reptile park so luckily caught it and put it in with their ones. theyve got a awesome enclosure about 100m2 with a big palm tree in the middle and hes seen them coming down the tree with what were probably indian myna chicks. thats not so bad , i'm sure no one likes mynas but these guys would be one more predator our native birds dont need. geckos and skinks would probly be tasty snacks too.

so if you live in NZ please dont let them go, it would be cool if we had them wild here but not at the price of our birds. if they do escape dont just assume she'll be right.

the craziest thing is you dont even nead a permint to have beardys, water dragons and turtles here. theres already heaps of wild turtles here now. not sure if theyre breeding tho.

Edited September 26, 2011 by 2meke

[Magick81]

Good info, 2meke.

Introducing exotic species into another area is not a good idea. Man has already done this many times in the past, with disastrous results to the ecosystem. If you have an unwanted pet, it is better to find another home for them, or as a last result surrender it to an animal organization like the RSPA