Dature & HBWR Germ

[MindExpansion]

Ok, I got a bunch of datura seeds I'm trying to germ.

I've read that they can take ages, which isn't a problem, but I want to make sure I maximise their chances.

At current, there are 6 seeds spaced out in a 15 or so cm pot.

I watered them in with some miracle gro, let them drain, then put them in a cupboard on top of the water heater. The soil is likely at around 30 degrees, maybe even a little higher.

The soil has dried a fair bit over the last week.

Now my questions.

a) do they need sun (yes, I have UTSE, along with lots of googling, and found lots of mixed responses, on even said that sun upped the germ rate from 0-25% to 25-100%) and if so how much/how often?

should I put cling wrap over the pots to up the humidity. I read that they are humidity sensitive, but again, also read that they should be put in a humid environment.

Any help would be much appreciated

Oh and also, HBWR seeds don't take bottom heat well when germing do they?

And it's right to say they don't need light to germ yeh? And they do like humidity so I should cling wrap the pots?

Peace,

Mind

[PhantomTurkey]

Ok, I got a bunch of datura seeds I'm trying to germ.

I've read that they can take ages, which isn't a problem, but I want to make sure I maximise their chances.

At current, there are 6 seeds spaced out in a 15 or so cm pot.

I watered them in with some miracle gro, let them drain, then put them in a cupboard on top of the water heater. The soil is likely at around 30 degrees, maybe even a little higher.

The soil has dried a fair bit over the last week.

Now my questions.

a) do they need sun (yes, I have UTSE, along with lots of googling, and found lots of mixed responses, on even said that sun upped the germ rate from 0-25% to 25-100%) and if so how much/how often?

should I put cling wrap over the pots to up the humidity. I read that they are humidity sensitive, but again, also read that they should be put in a humid environment.

Any help would be much appreciated

Oh and also, HBWR seeds don't take bottom heat well when germing do they?

And it's right to say they don't need light to germ yeh? And they do like humidity so I should cling wrap the pots?

Peace,

Mind

In my personal growing experience for HBWR, I scratched each individual seed the soaked them in water for a bit before potting them in seed raising mix. I left them in full sunlight till germination. Success rate for germination was 4/6. Once sprouted I repotted in potting mix then took them to a more forgiving area (partial shade) untill they got established. Now they are quite hardy in full sun. My biggest mistake with the grow was trying to grow them to maturity in big buckets. I believe this has stunted their growth. I should have planted them directly into the ground.

Edited September 12, 2008 by PhantomTurkey

[Re-Grifter]

This plant is a "climber", correct?

Do ya reckon if one germinated a few seeds, then just threw them near a wall in a sunny spot they would take off or am i hoping for too much?

[PhantomTurkey]

Where I live (Nth QLD) HBWR thrive. They tend to do well in tropical climates. I don't know how well growing will work south of QLD though I've heard they still go in the northern part of NSW. Maybe someone more knowledgable can confirm?

[PhantomTurkey]

They may go Re Gifter. I know from my HBWR grow that nicking and soaking the seeds does help the process along.

[MindExpansion]

I did a nick and soak on 4 out of the 5 that i planted.

I'm hoping they grow down here :S

It might be too much to hope but it's starting to warm up now so they might be ok, if they get strong enough over the warmer months then I can bring them in over the cooler months and even pop them on a heat mat if need be.

So no cling wrap for humidity on the HBWR?

Peace

[Fenris]

Hey ME re the Datura, when I tried to grow it I had some difficulty but once the ground has seeds in it they pop up all the time like weeds. Try throwing some seeds in a pot that already has something growing in it that gets watered a couple of time a week and just wait until they start growing. I don't think they really need pampering. They seem to like plenty of watering to get up though.

If your worried about quantity I could send you a golf ball sized pod which would have 100+ seeds in it.

I found a Datura seedling at the local park a km or 2 from my house, I can only assume it was an escapee.

[MindExpansion]

Hey Fenris thanks for the advice...

Might PM you re that pod, the really important thing you have said is to water regularly so I'll make sure I keep that up.

Peace

[Re-Grifter]

They may go Re Gifter. I know from my HBWR grow that nicking and soaking the seeds does help the process along.

Ok cheers, i'll do that and just throw a bunch along the wall, if summink happens, it happens!

[indigo264nm]

What type of datura are you trying to germinate??? Some species are different to others, for example with strammonium once a seed pod breaks open onto the soil there is no way that you won't get a heap of seedlings popping up all over the place. Weedy as hell.

My basic seed technique seems to do the trick with most. I use those little trays or punnets that you generally get when you buy seedlings of herbs and such in at a nursery. Just fill it with a mixture of 50:50 peat moss:perlite or coarse sand, pack it to 1 cm under and make it as level as possible. Sprinkle seeds on top and then cover with a layer of vermiculite. Water through heavily with a can and then mist everyday. The annual daturas should sprout in no time, but D. metel will probably take up to a month.

Sunlight is good once germinated for daturas by memory but unneccesary until it sprouts, unlike poppies etc. I reckon just leaving outside in partial or filtered sunlight should be fine.

Don't cling wrap the pots IMHO - I generally only use cling wrap when I've used punnet trays, and then I just put the punnets\trays inside a plastic container and then cling wrapping the top tightly and putting in maybe 8-10 holes and then taking the wrap off for half a day or so every couple of days to avoid fungal infection.

I'd definately recommend not using any type of fertiliser for seedlings. A seed comes with everything the plant needs to get established and adding fertilisers at such a young age can do more harm than good.

For HBWR do the same things but maybe consider cling wrapping the pot with holes for maybe one day out of three. Don't bother with bottom heat - leave in sun and don't let the soil dry out.

P.S. Also offering more Datura seeds if you need em - I've got a few different varieties... D strammonium, D stramm var. tatula, D. ferox (I think still got some anyway), a variety of inoxia, and two different varities of D. metel.

[MindExpansion]

I have metel (1 variety), inoxia (3 varieties), stramonium (1 variety) and wrightii (1 variety).

Thanks for the advice indigo, really useful for developing a good germing technique all round.

Peace

[PhantomTurkey]

I'd forgotten about this, but I actually documented the early stages of my HBWR grow in my blog here. Perhaps it might be useful as an interesting referral point for someone growing HBWR for the first time. Everyone was telling me when I started that HBWR are easy to grow and I personally didnt have too many problems getting started. What I should have done as I said before was plant them into the ground. Instead I opted to grow them in large pots which probably stunted them. The downside of rental accommodation.

Edited September 15, 2008 by PhantomTurkey

[MindExpansion]

Mmmm, I too am unfortunately afflicted with rental accom, and even worse...in a city apartment

So in pots they will be for at least a few years.

Will check out your blog though

Peace

[PhantomTurkey]

I've got mine in plastic rubbish bins with holes punctured in the bottom. You can tell it wants more rootspace.

[MindExpansion]

Even in the rubbish bin? Jeez they must have some serious roots! I was thinking that would be the way I'd go too, get a few plastic rubbish bins. Just waiting for the germ now (5 days and counting)! Hope them and the datura's sprout soonish...

Peace

[Geebus]

Hi there, I'm currently growing D. Stramonium (a month or two ago sprinkled 20-30 seeds in a medium sized pot) they are growing fine, seem very healthy and are about 2-3cm in height. I was just wondering how well stramonium takes to transplanting, as I know they can get fairly large and wish to move them directly into the ground. Anf if they do take well to transplanting, when would be the right time to transplant (eg. what height, etc. should they be at). Any help would be much appreciated.

[planthelper]

Hi there, I'm currently growing D. Stramonium (a month or two ago sprinkled 20-30 seeds in a medium sized pot) they are growing fine, seem very healthy and are about 2-3cm in height. I was just wondering how well stramonium takes to transplanting, as I know they can get fairly large and wish to move them directly into the ground. Anf if they do take well to transplanting, when would be the right time to transplant (eg. what height, etc. should they be at). Any help would be much appreciated.

wellcome, to the forums, geebus.

stramonium are tough as boots, you don't have to worry about, transplanting shock.

at your location, the danger of frosts ought to be over (if, there was ever any) and that would mean you can plant them out.

2-3cm in height, is though still very small and i would wait till they are a bit bigger, before planting out.

however, it sounds like you got all those seedlings comming up in one single pot, which means the roots of the individual plants will get entangled and the longer you leave them like this the worse it will get. thats what i would do, make sure the soil is neither to wet or too dry, and if ok, transplant each plant or a small group of them (if the roots are very tangled up) into individual small pots, using good potting mix. if thats too much effort you can plant out the whole contents of you seedlings pot in one piece into your garden. or divide the lump, put one halve already in the garden the other back into a bigger pot (if needed) and find out which one doe's grow faster!!

you will not need, many stramonium plants anyway, as a fact they are a weed which easely re seeds itselfe, so watch out you don't end up with a garden full of datura weeds, lol.

[incognito]

Just waiting for the germ now (5 days and counting)! Hope them and the datura's sprout soonish...

Peace

cute

[Geebus]

wellcome, to the forums, geebus.

stramonium are tough as boots, you don't have to worry about, transplanting shock.

at your location, the danger of frosts ought to be over (if, there was ever any) and that would mean you can plant them out.

2-3cm in height, is though still very small and i would wait till they are a bit bigger, before planting out.

however, it sounds like you got all those seedlings comming up in one single pot, which means the roots of the individual plants will get entangled and the longer you leave them like this the worse it will get. thats what i would do, make sure the soil is neither to wet or too dry, and if ok, transplant each plant or a small group of them (if the roots are very tangled up) into individual small pots, using good potting mix. if thats too much effort you can plant out the whole contents of you seedlings pot in one piece into your garden. or divide the lump, put one halve already in the garden the other back into a bigger pot (if needed) and find out which one doe's grow faster!!

you will not need, many stramonium plants anyway, as a fact they are a weed which easely re seeds itselfe, so watch out you don't end up with a garden full of datura weeds, lol.

Thank you very much, yes i had worried about the plants proximity from eachother, but i will try your advice.

[MindExpansion]

No love as yet...with either the datura or the HBWR... starting to fret.

Dug up one or two HBWR seeds, they are sort of cracked just long a line below the eye (on the concave aspect of the seed).. is that what is meant to be going on?

Also dug up some datura seeds...none of them have changed at all since putting them in (not even the stramonium which I thought were meant to germ fairly quickly)...am I not keeping the soil wet enough? Should I pull them out of the dirt and put them in a 50/50 mix of verm/potting mix and try bottom watering so they are always damp?

Peace,

Mind

Oh, and it has been just over 2 weeks if anyone was wondering.

[MindExpansion]

Just realised how impatient I am being after checking the web a bit more...found this link:

Datura germ experiment

Which did a bunch of experimentation on a particular variety of stramonium. I think I will just endevour to keep it a bit damper, and keep waiting, if by next week there is still no love, I might try a second turn using some of the techniques they use: float test for viability, scarification, germ on paper at 30-32 degrees then plant little seedlings in a nice loose rich potting mix.

Still would appreciate any advice, particularly on the HBWR.

Peace,

Mind

[indigo264nm]

Any idea how old the seeds are???

[MindExpansion]

Ummm... no I have no idea... got them probably 3 or 4 months ago, and they have been kept in saddie bags in a drawer since.

Not sure how old they were prior to that.

Any idea how long they can stay viable?

Peace

[herbologist]

If they were fresh when you got them they will definitely still be viable. I have some super freshies I can send you if your worried about viability. I just sprouted some of them last week, nicked and soaked some on tissue paper in a saddy, sitting on the window sill. 3 days and they had started to germ.

No idea on Datura, as I've only ever grown it from cuttings.

Edited September 23, 2008 by salem13

[MindExpansion]

Many thanks Salem, before I start scouting for more I think I'll try doing what you did for germ, I've had success that way with other seeds (the wet paper sort of way).

Peace and thanks for the offer.

Mind