MORG Posted October 15, 2007 99% sure she's obtusi but I don't know the flora of region (and don't have a guide), hence there could be a look-alike I'm unaware of. I've never seen A. obtusifolia in the bark before either. I turn to the community for confirmation. Central tablelands of NSW. Growing at altitude in heathy scrub. Very sandy soil. Common, trees at times up to approx 4-5 m Erect phyllodes with withered margins, blunt ends. No consistently prominent venation. Corrugated bark. Cylindrical inflorescences at axils Long, thin pods tending to linear. A mature tree. (Damn it's hard to take a satisfactory photo of a whole tree) And a question: how can they have green pods on them as they are just coming into flower? I didn't see a single one of these in flower, just the young inflorescences forming and green pods. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonic Posted October 15, 2007 Lookin' good to me MORG . I can only assume that now you know where they are that you will look but not touch? Nice photos. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
apothecary Posted October 15, 2007 I believe that is obtusi, the prolific inter-vein anastomisation is a good giveaway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MORG Posted October 15, 2007 I can only assume that now you know where they are that you will look but not touch? Of course dude. I couldn't kill a tree. Especially not one in such an amazing area as this. I'll take more photos throughout the season and make an ID-guide out of them. Hopefully gather some seed too when and if it is set. And World Wide Wattle answered my question in part: "Usually flowers Nov.–Jan. but fruits irregularly." http://www.worldwidewattle.com/speciesgall...ia.php?id=23759 So that begs the question: If this species doesn't require flowers to fruit, are the fruits that aren't the product of fertilised embryos set with fertile seed? i.e. Does this tree produce clonal seed outside of flowering season? Could be that there's some wacky trait of legume biology I'm not privvy to... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted October 15, 2007 [/url]So that begs the question: If this species doesn't require flowers to fruit, are the fruits that aren't the product of fertilised embryos set with fertile seed? i.e. Does this tree produce clonal seed outside of flowering season? Could be that there's some wacky trait of legume biology I'm not privvy to... all speculation here but I'd say most likely the fruit are formed from last years fertilised embryos no point putting all that energy into flowering if you're not going to use it for reproduction... why, that'd be like having sex just for the fun of it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MORG Posted October 15, 2007 all speculation herebut I'd say most likely the fruit are formed from last years fertilised embryos no point putting all that energy into flowering if you're not going to use it for reproduction... why, that'd be like having sex just for the fun of it I agree. The plant would naturally prefer to put out fruit from fertilised ovaries. But is it common for plants to set fruit from flowers pollinated a complete season ago? It just seems remarkable that these green pods have taken at least 10 months from flower to proto-seed (they're not even near dehiscence). I'm thinking maybe they're able to set fruit with clonal seed out of season. But of course that's all my own wild speculation. I'll ask an expert and report back Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted October 15, 2007 I sense a PhD coming on... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
paradox Posted October 15, 2007 I agree. The plant would naturally prefer to put out fruit from fertilised ovaries. But is it common for plants to set fruit from flowers pollinated a complete season ago?It just seems remarkable that these green pods have taken at least 10 months from flower to proto-seed (they're not even near dehiscence). I'm thinking maybe they're able to set fruit with clonal seed out of season. But of course that's all my own wild speculation. I'll ask an expert and report back IME obtusifolia fruits can take a very long time to mature. i've been keeping an eye on a particular population regularly for the last year or so. first noticed pods forming after the last flowering about 1 year ago & last time i checked (about 6 weeks ago) they are still not ripe & seemed to have not even reached their full size. interesting & strange. also a little frustrating as i don't know when i will next get there & hope i don't miss them. & yeah Morg i reckon it's pretty likely they're obtusi's you've got there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MORG Posted October 15, 2007 (edited) "I sense a PhD coming on.." Not even! Collect pods, sample the population including parent plants (wouldn't be more than 200 mature individuals), extract, genotype (I'm sure there must be markers out there), parentage analysis, write paper. Easy. Want me to start collecting for you Creach? ;) Edited October 15, 2007 by MORG Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tonic Posted October 15, 2007 Would love a few seeds if you are planning on harvesting a small amount MORG. Looks like a lovely specimen/s. Leave many for GAIA though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted October 15, 2007 Want me to start collecting for you Creach? man don't encourage me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MORG Posted October 15, 2007 (edited) mandon't encourage me Just think! You could expand the genetic sample to include the species' complete range! You could include GC-MS work for alkaloid content and look for correlations with environmental variables. You could do classical breeding experiments in addition to looking at differential gene expression between this and the closely related A. longifolia in order to locate the genetic pathway for biosynthesis of DMT... and then you could create transgenic plants turning potentially any plant you ever dreamed of into an active one. Anyone want to kick some money in for Creach's research fund? Oh... and now that you've read that I'm a co-author on any publications Edited October 15, 2007 by MORG Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
occidentalis Posted October 15, 2007 Now that would be the phd ;) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_e_ Posted October 15, 2007 its regular to find plants pre flowering covered inimmature pods, and also plants in full flower and full seed release.. id conclude that it is oftenthe cas ethat pod form irregularly due to environmental factors... and perhaps genetic in some areas (theres another phd) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ENtiTY Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) Maybe the pods stay at that stage for an extended period to enable the species to survive bush fires, eventually maturing and dropping seed to maintain the population. However, if a bush fire roars through the pods are cooked, ripening the seeds where they drop to and ideal place for germination and thereby fascilitate rapid re-establishment of the species. Hows that theory? Edited November 13, 2007 by Harry Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
