which P. cubensis strains grow wild in oz

[paradox]

the thread about all the different cube strains got me thinking about which of these strains might be growing wild in oz (other than the wild aussie strain).

do many of these strains require conditions much different from the next in order to survive and therefore have trouble taking off in oz?

i've been thinking about the possibilty of spreading strains and species around the country by perhaps, making up a big batch of spore culture in a barrel or something and travel from area to area and farm to farm spraying it in feed troff's and on hay bales.

whadda ya reckon?

[XipeTotec]

the thread about all the different cube strains got me thinking about which of these strains might be growing wild in oz (other than the wild aussie strain).

do many of these strains require conditions much different from the next in order to survive and therefore have trouble taking off in oz?

i've been thinking about the possibilty of spreading strains and species around the country by perhaps, making up a big batch of spore culture in a barrel or something and travel from area to area and farm to farm spraying it in feed troff's and on hay bales.

whadda ya reckon?

that at 1st seems like a great idea... when I think more about it, I wonder if i could cause problems with local ecosystems. Dont know...

[Ace]

The strain that grows wild in aus would be called the Aus strain - it is simply a locality type. You'll find that they are almost identical to others worldwide and to spread others would make no difference. They will simply morph into almost identical types as our current ones.

Frankly, I dont think its a great idea, simply cos you'd be wasting your time. If you were keen to spread their habitat, then you could do it with a current wild one - take a print, grow it out and do the barrel thing - but you wont be able to outdo mother nature I think. With time, they will naturally spread - as they have done for many many years.

Putting spores into a wildstocks water would be pointless - they would be useless by time they come out the other end, due to stomach acids and such... They grow off cowpats after they have been 'made'. Airbourne spores fall onto them and colonise from there (dependant on conditions).

Long story short - no point in bringing other types here - they will be the same anyway.

[paradox]

that at 1st seems like a great idea... when I think more about it, I wonder if i could cause problems with local ecosystems. Dont know...

yeah, i dunno either, but there is constantly things being shipped around the country and such is the nature of spores, there are squillions of them everywhere, so we're constantly spreading all sorts of spores around every part of the planet all the time.

i'm deffinately concerned about that tho, just don't know how concerned to be!

Edited March 26, 2007 by paradox604

[ENtiTY]

that at 1st seems like a great idea... when I think more about it, I wonder if i could cause problems with local ecosystems. Dont know...

yeah, i dunno either, but there is constantly things being shipped around the country and such is the nature of spores, there are squillions of them everywhere, so we're constantly spreading all sorts of spores around every part of the planet all the time.

i'm deffinately concerned about that tho, just don't know how concerned to be!

I wouldn't worry about things you can't control, you'll end up with an olcer

[paradox]

Putting spores into a wildstocks water would be pointless - they would be useless by time they come out the other end, due to stomach acids and such... They grow off cowpats after they have been 'made'. Airbourne spores fall onto them and colonise from there (dependant on conditions).

i thought the principle way they make their way into cow pats was when the cow eats grass with spores on them!

i was under the impression that mushroom spores are able to withstand the digestive system of cows!

where i come from i have witnessed cows which have been bought from another area come in and found P. cubensis growing in the

same paddock they were in soon after, while P. cubensis had never before been found growing anywhere near that district before and i've never found P. cubensis growing there since!

i assumed that the new cows had 'imported' the spores inside their bowels!

[Ace]

I doubt very mcuh that they could transport viable spores via their gut. I think it'd be much more likely that they'd be transported on the cattle themselves - i.e. hair, hoofs, etc.

I think it was discussed a while back with Indian Orissa spores, might be worth a search.

[shruman]

Im pretty damn sure cows eat spores & spores come out in cow shit unaffected & ready to do their biz.

" Putting spores into a wildstocks water would be pointless - they would be useless by time they come out the other end, due to stomach acids and such... They grow off cowpats after they have been 'made'. Airbourne spores fall onto them and colonise from there (dependant on conditions)."

I dont think this is so either look at malabar very dif to aus & im pretty sure it would continue these traits if let loose in the wild, providing all conditions are met.

"The strain that grows wild in aus would be called the Aus strain - it is simply a locality type. You'll find that they are almost identical to others worldwide and to spread others would make no difference. They will simply morph into almost identical types as our current ones."

Edited March 26, 2007 by shruman

[paradox]

Im pretty damn sure cows eat spores & spores come out in cow shit unaffected & ready to do their biz.

i agree!

[user1]

spores survive the passage through a cow's digestive system, something about them having multiple stomachs which contain different acids than 'normal' mammals. that's why mushies only really grow outta cow flops.

at least that's what i read somewhere...

[Ace]

Hmm, to be honest you got me thinkin now!

that's why mushies only really grow outta cow flops.

What about horse poopie? I've even heard of them growing out of roo poopie (subaeruginosa). I still think they are deposited after the pat is laid. I'm sure some of the more 'established' hunters would have the facts on this one... Blue Meanie - come back!!

I dont think this is so either look at malabar very dif to aus & im pretty sure it would continue these traits if let loose in the wild, providing all conditions are met.

You could be right, but I think they would still stabilise over time and look pretty much the same as ours. Dont forget that it is very likely that all cubensis started in one area (probably Mexico) and would have been transported via shipping livestock over seas. I'm 99% sure that I read this exact idea and that the spores would have been transported via the cattle's hair - could anyone elaborate - I will do a bit of research and see if I can find what I was reading (long time ago, so unlikely )

Still sticking with my guns on this one, but I'd be more than happy to be proved wrong

[Jonny Deformed]

I know Ive read somewhere that the spores do survive the digestive system of only cows due to their nifty internal set up.

This is probably the reason they are so commonly found on cow dung as oppose to horse, roo, camel etc.

Many the spore shot from the cubes would be caught be the surrounding grass.

There it waits to be shat on or eaten by cow.

Spores that find themselves deep inside their desired substrate will have a far greater chance of germination due to the high co2 levels and absence of light.

[ENtiTY]

I'm with ace on this one I think.

I would think the mechanism for dispersal as regards animals would be external. Spores getting caught on the feet or face and dislodging later, where by chance their craped on and provided the conditions to grow.

Do equine/bovine eat mushrooms or do they ignore them?

I feel an experiment coming on.

I got a buddy with a horse, maybe if I feed it some material with spore laiden feed and catch the poopie when it follows through then incubate it and see if anything grows.

Wanna be pretty dedicated to carry the experiment out but this would answer the question I guess.

One day when I have the time I'll give it a go.

[Ace]

Sounds like a messy experiment there Harry

[ENtiTY]

Hehehe yeah, thats the scientist in me. Whatever it takes to prove/disprove a theory

Its not that complicated or nasty really, just time consuming.

[Ace]

This is what I was talking about before:

Indian Orissa Thread

By the looks of it, no one answered whether or not spores survive consumption

So it doesnt help much, but has some awesome ideas for spreading spores

[ENtiTY]

WOW, musta missses that thread

Is incredible what they did with the oyster mushies and the contaminated soil! Who would of thought that was possible.

Might have to take some grain jars down to the servo after work for a top up HEHEHE

I feel another experiment coming on!

[Ace]

The chainsaw oil is such an amazing idea - hard to imagine how they stumbled upon that!

I think it'd be great to try some experiments using a bit of oil and sub spores... hmm, the possibilities!!

[paradox]

I got a buddy with a horse, maybe if I feed it some material with spore laiden feed and catch the poopie when it follows through then incubate it and see if anything grows.

Wanna be pretty dedicated to carry the experiment out but this would answer the question I guess.

One day when I have the time I'll give it a go.

sounds like a cool idea, but you have to remember that there are alot of contams in the average horse or cow poop,

so the experiment wouldn't be very controlled!

for example: there might be a paddock full of cow poops, all with spores in them, but only a couple will actually have successful myc in them, when the conditions of that particular poop happen too be right.

[shruman]

I did a search (cow spore) at the shroomery & all evidence sseems to point to cows eat spores spores are viable & there are a lot.

Here are a few excerpts:

i've done it to my grandparents horses once, i used a spore syringe and injected a bit into a few apples and fed them to each other the horses, i've talked to them on the fone and asked them if theyve been having any mushrooms on their farm, they said yea sorta.... i went up there on vacation and they had a big ol' pile of shit and there were only about 30 shrooms on it, but i think over time the number should grow exponentially...

i'm positive it'll work for cows too.... so go for it man.. and good luc

nope, they dont digest them.. thats the cool part... thats also why the spores multiply on a cow and horse farm... they eat the shrooms and shit out the millions of spores, theyre already in the shit so its a sterile growing medium (i think) so they mycelia grows and fruits.....

Whoa... chill w/ the caps... You won't get any results w/ spore syringes... there's too little spores in that little syringe... you would need about 1-1.5g of spores to 4lb of cow feed... it wouldn't hurt to add some innoculated grains into the feed...the thing people dont understand that this doesn't happen in 2 days or 2 weeks or 2 months.... when you get fruits on your pasture you have to let some sporulate, die, and decompose on the grass, so your cows can eat the spore covered grass... sometimes cow pies get covered in grass and inbetween that grass(in the cow pie) there is still some mycelium... the cows eat this and the process is continued... peace and good luck

the natural lifestyle of spores, is they are released into the air and land on cow food (any grain w/o fungicide) they eat the food and spores which germinate inside of their multiple stomachs and dont die because they do not have any digesting acids to help break the food down, so the spores end up fully germinated in a pile of shit on the ground ready to grow mycelium

Jake H

P.S.-get some spores into that cow! lol

That's how it works in nature. The spores drop on the grass next to the mushie, the cows eat it, and swallow the spores, which then actually germinate inside the cow, and come out in ready made compost. Feed that cow dude.

Such experiment has been tested with success already. Yes, some american Pan subbs were grown in Europe thanks to a horse and a couple of crazy guys, go figure .... here...

Use your imagination and knowledge instead of using excuses for failure.

Just drop a spore print in their drinking water every now and then. A friend did this with some horses on his farm, and got some nice shrooms. He said he didn't get that much at first, but months later it started increasing. He didn't just add spores the once, but did it many times.

[Ace]

Sorry, I stand corrected! In that case, I need to do a trip to my grandparent farm on the south coast!! Now, why did I get rid of all my prints!! I will try the spores in the H2O and see if anything comes about - I think it would be better to use pan cyans tho - you would want the highest quality if you were going to bother, wouldnt you?

[paradox]

i've got some pan cyan prints ready to go!

any areas where these guys could do with a boost in population?

[shruman]

I get shiloads of goldies round here but no meanies would give it a go if u could part with one.

Ps FOAF got a bunch of cubes yesterday I always have best finds in autumn for some reason.

Edited March 28, 2007 by shruman

[Ace]

You lucky bugger Paradox!! I'd be spreading these fellas wherever you can - afaik, their populations are fairly small compared to cubies, but I dont know much about the patches up north... I'd love to spread both cubes and meanies right down to the south coast (Bega or further) - it'd be good to see em about, plus there is heaps of farms all the way along the coast!

Guys, spread the love and share whatever excess love you cant use! Shroom on!

[ENtiTY]

Shruman thats some mighty nice info you dug up there

As far as the spores germing inside the animal... don't think thats right. In my experience to hot equals no growth. The temp inside an animal that digests cellulose would be rather warm I reckon. I accept the spores survive the ordeal and are built a prefab climate controlled home by mr moo moo but not internal germ.

Unless there are other factors involved with the mysterious mushies that make this true...