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fully vaccinated, two doses of vizier. i now will be invisible

Actually that's meant to be "Imperfect Vaccination Can Enhance the Transmission" etc. And Rogan's cherry-picked a single line from a non-covid paper about chickens from 2015. Which is totally fine, he has the right to express his take/ opinion to another anti-vaxxer, but it's hardly case closed or anything. So here's my take on the paper... For a start, that paper wasn't trying to establish whether or not variants occur in the vaccinated (it's a no-brainer, afterall) but it aims to start exploring the realm of what might be possible. Indeed, it says "There is (already) a theoretical expectation that this happens" , and "The future challenge is to identify whether there are other types of vaccines used in animals and humans that might also generate these evolutionary risks". It's a shame Rogan didn't highlight these stipulations, but instead spin the paper as proof of his opinion, (or the opinion of whoever said it to him to begin with), because it doesn't seem like he read the paper himself. Just out of curiosity, did you, because playing 'chinese wispers' is not exactly a great source of scientific data. There's no dispute over variants appearing in people, whether they are vaccinated or not. But there *would* still be a lower rate of variants coming out of vaccinated people, based on the lower rate of infection to begin with, which seems to be the general consensus anyway (from what I've picked up). Covid will probably end up being like the flu IMO, regardless of vaccinations. It's just a matter of how many people want to be sacrificed unnecessarily for the same eventual outcome as it develops over the years or decades. The paper itself says that natural selection helps to stop potent variants from spreading, but it fails to take environmental factors into account. Natural selection worked well in a diverse, partitioned world, but we are a monoculture now, with very different dynamics and severe consequences of just letting a pathogen run rampant. Is that how we would really want to solve this issue? To randomly kill off millions of people as our way of 'living' with the virus. Remember, it's no longer just the elderly at risk, and Delta didn't emerge from the vaccinated, but the **unvaccinated**. There's a big debate over reducing global over-population, but there's better ways of doing it than dying a wretched painful disease-ridden death. Besides, if someone is such a champion for reducing over-population then they should put their money where their mouth is and get a vasectomy before having any kids, but I'm sure these proponents are happy for someone else's family to die of covid, who cares if it doesn't happen to them etc.. ...and then it DOES happen to them anyway SMH. It seems to me like anti-vaxxers are often arriving at their final solution of just letting a certain percentage of people die, and hope everything goes back to normal. But that won't happen, that's merely an untested hypothetical. Variants will still appear, new cohorts will die, people and the economy will suffer severely. And half-assed vaccination campaigns won't do much either, just look at Israel, they went in hard and fast, with incredible results, and threw it all away by opening up too early. The best way to reduce variants (AND keep people and the economy safe) still appears to be strong vaccination programs. But that doesn't seem possible now that the fear/misinformation genie is out of the bottle. Our only hope now IMO is to stay one step ahead of the misinformed, and take harder measures to prevent the mindless sheep from killing many millions of happy families, as well as their own. But that's highly unlikely now that many of our most powerful leaders like Scomo and Gladys, Trump-ism, are raising the white flag and kneeling for the slaughter. Prepare for the covid-appocalypse, people! When the shyt hits the fan, you'll be waiting a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time for a jab in a queue full of sick, coughing, zombies. Just look at pretty every other country who threw in the towel too early, that's only just around the corner. Don't be afraid, but also don't be a total fool during a serious pandemic. For the love of all that's good, use your f** brain. Time is close now.

i don't think all boomers are 'bad' folk bro, you're probably just matuing - nice place to be. Peace be within your heart

Vaxx gang represent. Disapointed im not magnetic or a 5G signal amplifier. Mental health epidemic is concerning me more but....

Hey Change - you know how much I love you mate but I think you might be oversimplifying things a bit here. I don't think HD and I are so much discussing the politics of the situation. Rather, we are against the blatant misinformation being bandied about - it's downright dangerous. There are still way too many people thinking the vaccines are injecting Bill Gates' microchips - I shit you not - old(er) people that should know better. They have totally discarded logical thought (like why do we need two shots? was the microchips missing components in the first shot? doh) and jump on any human mistake (like mask wearing or slips of the tongue) as proof that its all a scam. Others think its 5G. FFS. HD and I just want to dispel these myths and encourage vaccination - it will save lives and get us back to (the new) normal quicker. And Zedo - it's super tough out there at the moment. You are not alone - my single mates are all suffering big time - I do what I can to help but its not enough. Try and hang in there and, when its possible, get along to one of the SAB meets in your area. The people on this forum are uniquely special. Post more here - pics and random thoughts. Try and stay busy. It is a shitty time there is no doubt but I have seen this pandemic bring out the best in people (and sadly, the worst as well).