How to grow Kratom?

[Zarathustra]

Hello,

I've just acquired a small Kratom plant, and am looking for information regarding the best way to grow it. Naturally, I'm looking for ways to maximize leaf production. Now, in the Marijuana world, there is tons of information. Not so with Kratom. Anyway, now that I've found this forum, I have some questions:

1. Can Kratom be grown hydroponically? I'm thinking either a bubbler or drip-based system.

2. If so, how big of a growing chamber and nutrient resevoir would you need?

3. What type and how much nutrients are needed? I'm planning on using General Hydroponics Flora series, unless someone suggests otherwise. But what ratio?

4. Light!

a. How much light does Kratom need per day?

b. Will 24x7 light maximize production, or will it hurt the plant?

c. Is there any need to vary the light cycle - like with Marijuana, you induce flowering by switching from (for example) 24 hour light to just 12 hours per day. Is there any similar sort of need with Kratom?

d. Along the same lines, does Kratom *need* to flower in order to produce Mitragynine?

e. Do HID lamps (HPS or MH) work well with the plant?

5. Can one plant produce enough leaf to satisfy one person's use (say, two times per week)? At what size can it do so, and how long does it take to get this big?

6. Any other recommendations on how to increase leaf production?

7. Any recommendations on how to increase the potency (or Mitragynine concentration)?

Also, some background:

I've been using Kratom (dried leaves) for about three months. The only sources I've tried have been Daniel Siebert's www.sagewisdom.org, and www.iamshaman.com. I note that Daniel's Kratom is considerably stronger than the other. FYI, I typically consume the water-extracted equivalent of about 25 grams of dried leaf (iamshaman.com variety).

Also, I'm not sure of the pedigree of the plant that I purchased (I bought it from someone on a garden exchange website.)

Anyway, thanks for any help!

Mike

[ 17. March 2004, 11:39: Message edited by: Mike2000 ]

[Torsten]

Originally posted by Mike2000:

1. Can Kratom be grown hydroponically? I'm thinking either a bubbler or drip-based system.

Kratom loves lots of water, so i don't see why not. Being a boggy plant it will be much more tolerant of low oxygen condition than other plants, ie now need for lots of aeration.

2. If so, how big of a growing chamber and nutrient resevoir would you need?

I've seen one 3m tall tree in a 50L selfwatering pot. Although this is a soil filled pot, it does give a guide to the size possible (basically the soil was a sandy medium that did not provide much other than support - nutrients came from regular watering with thrive).

3. What type and how much nutrients are needed?

It's a gross feeder once established, so my guess is *plenty*.

4. Light!

a. How much light does Kratom need per day?

No reason why you can't grow it under 24/7. That will also keep the temperature steady.

c. Is there any need to vary the light cycle - like with Marijuana, you induce flowering by switching from (for example) 24 hour light to just 12 hours per day. Is there any similar sort of need with Kratom?

Do you want flowers?? I didn't think so, so no need to vary.

d. Along the same lines, does Kratom *need* to flower in order to produce Mitragynine?

no.

e. Do HID lamps (HPS or MH) work well with the plant?

Yes, but watch for crisping of the leaves. Kratom is a rainforest tree, so it prefers high humidity and when young a little shade. Grow your first plants along the margin of your grow room, far away from the bulb. bring them closer as they grow.

5. Can one plant produce enough leaf to satisfy one person's use (say, two times per week)? At what size can it do so, and how long does it take to get this big?

It will take a year or two to get to the right size, and then it still won't be enough with just one plant. I don't think there is enough experience with this yet to find an answer, so share it here when you find out

6. Any other recommendations on how to increase leaf production?

A fan. I am certain that wind has a lot to do with tougheing up the leaves and only tough leaves are potent.

7. Any recommendations on how to increase the potency (or Mitragynine concentration)?

Wind and other occasional stresses.

I note that Daniel's Kratom is considerably stronger than the other. FYI, I typically consume the water-extracted equivalent of about 25 grams of dried leaf (iamshaman.com variety).

The stuff daniel has is probably the same as kavaman's. You will find a fair bit of discussion on the potency discrepancy here. The iamshaman stuff is the usual product and the rifat strain is presumably more like this than the strong stuff. But again, this is just a guess and may be related to age, climate etc.

[Zarathustra]

[Fyi, I just changed my display name from Mike2000 to Mr. Kratom.]

Torsten, thank you _very_ much for the detailed response! I'm so glad you e-mailed me about the forums - finally a group of people that have detailed experience with Kratom.

That's an interesting point about stress having a positive effect on potency. Anyone tried General Hydroponics (genhydro.com) "Chi" product on a Kratom plant? It contains chitin derivitives and other substances that make the plant think its under attack by fungus and/or insects, and so the plant responds by toughening its defenses. This theoretically helps to produce more robust plants, and some say that potency is increased in the case of cannabis. Anyway, since you mentioned stress having an effect on potency, I think I'll try this with my Kratom plant.

Those of you growing Kratom hydroponically, can you respond here with the type of system you are using, along with the type of nutrients? I might try something a bit different, to see if it affects production & potency.

Also, can anyone post a link to Kavaman's website, or wherever he sells his Kratom? I did a search on this forum, but the links that were posted no longer seem to work. I'd like to compare his Kratom to the others I've tried (as mentioned above, Daniel Siebert at sagewisdom.org, and iamshaman.com).

Thanks,

Mr. Kratom (aka, Mike2000)

[visualfx]

Mr.Kratom,

I've PM'd you kavamans contact details, I'm pretty sure he doesn't have a website...

peace,

vfx

.

[psycho0]

what about growing in the melbourne area, could u just grow it in a greenhouse?

thanx

[gerbil]

I don't see why not aaron, just as long as temperatures stay reasonable. I'm saving to build a good greenhouse, hopefully with something like hot water pipes for heating. Should be good fun.

If doing hydroponics in a greenhouse, as in, having roots submerged into water as the medium (DWC or aeroponics etc) I'd keep the nutrient solution heated. But if done via ebb and flow, soil temp would have to be good anyway, for good growth.

I've mentioned this in another thread, and haven't been able to actually experiment as i can't take cuttings yet, but using an aeroponic cloner or bubble cloner sounds like it would work a treat, since they like wet feet. Simple to make and very effective with many types of cuttings.

[ 18. March 2004, 11:04: Message edited by: gerbil ]

[psycho0]

thanx gerbil.

i only have a little clear plastic greenhouse atm

i need to build one myself.

[hoodoo]

Some say 4-5 grams of medium grade tea helps keep opiate addicts from relapsing.

[ 21. March 2004, 01:12: Message edited by: hoodoo ]

[Torsten]

There is no need to beat around the bush with source names on this forum. I think the quicker kratom spreads in australia the better, as there are only 2 weeks left before the dried herb and its products become illegal. Buy it NOW!!! The best and most reliable source around here is kavaman, so get in touch with him. Don't order it from overseas as you may find it arriving after it becomes illegal. Sure, customs usually take a few months to catch on, but the fact that it is illegal remains and so do the potential consequences.

[Zarathustra]

Torsten:

Originally posted by Mike2000:

I note that Daniel's Kratom is considerably stronger than the other.  FYI, I typically consume the water-extracted equivalent of about 25 grams of dried leaf (iamshaman.com variety).

The stuff daniel has is probably the same as kavaman's.

I just received a reply from Kavaman, and he confirmed that Daniel's Kratom is the same stuff. Note that Daniel sells the whole dried leaf, not powdered, so I have seen what it looks like. Its been a couple of months since I ordered from him (since his prices are much higher than iamshaman.com), but if I remember correctly, I believe there was perhaps a reddish tint to the veins. I'll order a small quantity and confirm.

Also, one thing I remember very well is that when I boiled Daniel's leaves, it produced a very strong, pleasant, smell that permeated my whole house. It smelled just like "regular" tea. The iamshaman.com leaves don't smell as good, nor as strong.

FYI.

Mr. Kratom

[hoodoo]

oops

[ 21. March 2004, 01:08: Message edited by: hoodoo ]

[hoodoo]

The entire passage below is from the webpage of Maya Ethnobotanicals:

And, finally we have managed to get a quantity of the Premium Top quality Kratom. This exceptional material is harvested in a certain area and seasonwhich makes it very potent. These leaves can be chewed and/or smoked at a fewgrams only, for a full effect. There is no need to extract the leaves, they are ready to use, unlike the commerical quality leaves.

Click here to go to the product info page:

http://www.maya-ethnobotanicals.com/go.pl?...1UGvlgBCqdVm6Wf

Click here to go to the product buy page:

http://maya-ethnobotanicals.com/go.pl?TGjtjkqBRBxscPg

Mitragyna speciosa - Kratom

Harvesting method:

Handpicked without damaging the trees, and new trees being planted the whole time.

Region:

South East Asia. Kratom seems to ease the

mind, energize the body and allows a sort of meditative repose under the most grueling physical conditions. This herb is extremely rare outside of its native region in Southeast Asia.

Test results:

There is much controversy with this plant due to a crop of fake Kratom from France that was distributed worldwide in the recent past. An analytical study found that most of the "Kratom" sold in the USA and Europe was misrepresented

and is not the correct plant. Daniel Siebert has tested this material; chemical analysis has confirmed that our Kratom is authentic Mitragyna speciosa.

Opinions:

Kratom is one of the most effective and pleasurable psychoactive herbs

available. It is usually taken as a tea in doses ranging from 5 to 50 grams, depending the potency of the leaves. The effects last for 4 to 6 hours. When large doses are taken, some residual effects may linger for several hours longer. In low doses it induces mild euphoria and reduces fatigue. Low doses do not interfere with most ordinary activities, however, one should not drive or

perform other activities that require full attention. At strong doses the effects are profoundly euphoric and immensely pleasurable.

Typically people describe the effects as dreamy, ecstatic, and blissful. Many

people experience closed-eye visuals. Strong doses must only be used when one

can devote several hours to the experience itself. For those who have tried the

material, everyone is extremely happy! Even though the material is weaker than

previously tested Kratom, if it is prepared in the recommend way and drunk it is

extremely strong!

Recipes: (commercial quality leaves)

Take 40 gm of dried Kratom and put into a large pan. Add 1 liter of water and

boil at a steady but not too strong speed (without lid on the pan) untill you

have about 200 ml of solution left. Discard the leaves and strain the liquid.

Then continue to boil the liquid slowly until you are left with 100ml of solution. You will then have one strong dose of Kratom which you can store in the fridge. It is best to use Kratom on a slightly empty stomach. The effects of one glass will be very noticeable. When using two or more glasses it is very enjoyable to lie down in a dimly lit place and listen to some of your favorite music. The effects at this level can last many hours.

[ 22. March 2004, 20:00: Message edited by: hoodoo ]

[Guest electro]

DONT DONT DONT spray with pyrethrum .... the poor lil buggers leaves will curl up trying to get away ....

[planthelper]

or, wash off the pyrethrum very soon after, by using a mister filled with water.

and for the scales and similar, use white oil.

i use old, small pump action plastic deodorant bottels for that, and it saves liquid because of a finer mist.