Acacia phlebophylla progress update? ( now image heavy )

[Darklight]

Just out of interest, how is everyone else's Acacia phlebophylla going? I know there are a few out there, maybe people could put up pics and a general description so we can see progress or lack thereof to help come up with a viable protocol for cultivation?

TC plants are doing well, if slow. It seems if they started out well as sterile seedlings, they keep going well- and if they don't they take ages to pick up ( I suspect older seed and will test both batches ) The most I have been able to take from a single parent is ten nodal cuttings before the ( still unidentified ) cryptic bacterial contamination kicks in and the parent plant requires deflasking. So far the 'children' can kick on for several more generations, making new babies along the way.

We still have to work on a few things- testing to see if removing the roots from parent explants affects future growth, and devising an acceptable proliferation protocol so we can produce vastly more plants from each parent. But I'm happy with the successes as previously described here.

What we need soon is a viable deflasking protocol- currently under development- and an indication of the conditions people have plants cultivated under- especially soil type, their age, and maybe a photo. That way once we deflask them, we can give good advice as to the best way to keep them alive in pots or in the ground- without risking entire individual seed grown populations from what is currently a small genetic base

[ 29. October 2004, 10:50: Message edited by: Darklight ]

[Darklight]

Spunwhirlin has very kindly allowed me to post pics of his latest progress with cultivated phlebophylla in the US.

He had two plants in pots which were approaching four years old, which is around the critical age for phlebophylla in cultivation. One of these was on its way out due to an unspecified illness ( spun'? any details? ) and died around the time of repotting.

The other is going strong 8 weeks after repotting and is showing new healthy growth. The mix he is using is 50% sandy loam and 50% granite chips(1/4 in. or less diameter with some cocao chips for acidity ( what are these cob? )

If anyone has a source for Australian native plant ( low phos etc ) fertilisers in the US can they please pass it on? We can send a tub over that will do him for three years or more, but it would be good for him to have a local source just in case, and for the future.

Toxicity issues affect mostly older leaves, so we'll see how it all goes in the next six months. The new growth looks stunning. Congratulations and thanks there spun'!

[ 29. October 2004, 10:49: Message edited by: Darklight ]

[planthelper]

very healthy looking specimen!

whats the climat like at spunwhirlin's US location, that plant to the left is that a hostillis?

waterdragon, if you are out there, how is the young phlebo going?

[ 29. October 2004, 11:04: Message edited by: planthelper ]

[spunwhirllin]

Thanks for the compliments.

the phleb i lost was always a little behind the other,the final re-potting just did it in.

it probably would've made it if i franticly tried grafting it to a obtuse or maidenii or something.

honestly,i think i was somewhat relieved that it finally passed and that i could let it go with dignity and respect,rather than butchering it with some outrageous experiment.

cocao chips are just that,the seed casings from processed cocao.

it's a fairly inert additive that sounded good,improves drainage and adds acidity.

i always kept the phlep soil on the basic side until seeing the phleb soil analysis.

my climate is best descibed as mild.

maybe 3 months of 90 degree summer days,and the other 9 months are off and on rain.

maybe a cumulative month of freezing temps.

i have to keep the phleb in a greenhouse due to the rain,dont want any rot.

yep,thats a hostillis,and a few anadenathera's.

[philistine]

Sorry this doesn't have much to do with the original post here, but Ive been wondering, is Acacia phlebophylla reall that difficult to propagate? Ive been thinking of growing a few myself from seed I collected on Mt Buffalo (yes I know I shouldnt be and I understand the implications of this, Im doing a diploma in conservation, and Im interested in conserving this species) but it seems everyone and everything I read says that cultivation of this species is difficult (if not impossible).

When I was there last year, most of the mountain was burnt to nothing from the previous years bushfires, much of the top-soil on the lower granite slopes (where the phleb. likes to live) had eroded away, or was very shallow and poor (I beleive the term is 'skeletal')

However the upcoming phleb. reqruitment was amazing! Totally dry, cold (it snows there in winter) no shade, total exposure all year round, but there were thousands of baby phlebs coming up everywhere...

Maybe the mountain's magic is what keeps em going

But a more boring, scientific explantion could be that once the phlebs reach a certain age, they rely on rhizobial symbiosis to maintain sustainable nutrient uptake... Has anyone tried growing one with soil from the mountain itself included in the pot?

[ 29. October 2004, 23:05: Message edited by: philistine ]

[Torsten]

Originally posted by philistine:

Has anyone tried growing one with soil from the mountain itself included in the pot?

That was pretty much the first thing we tried when we became aware of the difficulties. I grew one in pure Mt Buffalo soil taken from just around one of the patches.

I think transplanting is the major reason for death. They hate it and as they get older become less and less tolerant of it. They also hate pots/root-restriction, so there is a dilemma unless you are going to plant in the ground. Essentially I think they will grow just fine if planted in the ground in a cold granitic area. In fact I know of at least 3 that are doing fine under those conditions.

[spunwhirllin]

Torsten,

do you think a very large pot would suffice,rather than relocating to the ground?

i've noticed that the root balls stay rather small,possibly due to pot culture.

for trees i generally use oversized pots with excellent drainage,in your opinion will this still possibly hinder root proliferation?

thanks.

[Torsten]

we have grown them to 3 year stage in 50L pots and they eventually all failed. Thjese that we tried to plant from those big pots all died quickly. Only those planted while still small appear not to be affected by planting out.

If you do want to keep growing in a container, maybe try something really deep, but quite slender. eg a 1.5m (5') piece of 20cm (8") diameter plastic pipe.

My latest experiment is direct seeding.

[spunwhirllin]

Well,my a.phlebophylla is really starting to take off,finally.

It has been overwintered in an unheated gh with very little water and temps into the mid twenties F.

Still,it continues to produce leaves at a fairly quick rate,it also seems to be preparing for some serious branch production.

The dark spots on the leaves''toxicity'' has seemed to cease all together on the newer growth,I think its due to the fact that I only water it with rain water which contains no chlorine.

lately i've noticed that the extrafloral nectaries are producing massive amounts of netar.

could this be a possible sign of future flower production?

i've read that the EFN are there to lure ants away from the flowers as to not disturb the pollination process.

Any insights?

I would post a pic or two,but i'm unable to it seems.

[Darklight]

Just to let youse know, I deflasked a trial phleb from tissue culture about ten weeks ago and it's out in full sunlight doing fine. It even has new growth on it!

Wasn't sure how it would go- not just because of the radical temp changes from the TC lab into the winter zipup greenhouse, but also the presence of roots on TC plants does not necessarily indicate that those roots will survive deflasking, or be functional enough to transport nutrients and provide support.

Usually its a good indication, but in some spp I have worked with the TC roots fall off after deflasking, or rot. And the TC plant needs to be able to become autotrophic fairly quickly once removed from the substrate.

In some cases you don't need roots for TC plants to be deflasked, as the deflasking process allows for root development. But the phlebs here are too precious to risk that way and Australian Acacias generally aren't famous for striking from cuttings.

Now we have what appears to be a viable deflasking protocol ( I'll update again in Spring when I can confirm new root gorwth ) I can concentrate on getting TC numbers up- and up- and back to what they were before the contam disaster

It seemed to be a bit straightforward, deflask straight into coarse sharp sand forestry tubes. Put into high humidity dome. Fertilise at 1/2 strength every 2 weeks. Let 'er rip!

I'll post pics soon too

Spun told me it was OK to let everyone know his phlebs have turned 4 years old and are fine! Woohoo! Legend spun!

[Darklight]

Here is the first deflask attempt from the phleb TC. Sorry I didn't include anything in the pic to give a sense of scale, but its in a forestry tube

It's still alive and kicking, which is surprising since its a whole plant in my care and I'm not famous for my deflasking tek.

Let's hope it keeps kicking on. Might try to get a few more trial attempts out this Spring, but next we try to increase propagation rates so we can have some ready for sale next Spring!

[Plantsoma]

Heres my little baby, coming up to two years old this spring.

Acacia phlebophylla

:D

[Pisgah]

I'm not sure I understand the term "forestry tubes." Could somebody explain...

[ 30. June 2005, 19:08: Message edited by: Pisgah ]

[gerbil]

Very impressive darklight, really enjoyed the pics in the gallery.

pisgah, forestry tubes are a standard propagation tube, they are small square tops, with long bases. Used alot for revegetation work, but not strictly. I think they are a little bigger than the ordinary tube stock tube.