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BAP on crested trichocereus

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Started making more BAP mix lately to use on my plants. At and since the last Perth SAB meet I have picked up a few crest revert bits (TPM x N1, TPQC x TPM)

Chatting to someone recently has said that using BAP on crests will only throw reverts and these pups will not crest again (also a thread on shroomery but there is only a handful of replies). What is your experience on that?

I have hit a number of crests (whole and ones that have been cut for graft scions) with BAP, noted the # of areoles and which specimens. I will keep this thread updated


BAP: 19/10/2018:

(Peru x Juuls) x TPM - 4 areoles

Sharxx Blue x TPM - 4 areoles

TPC x Juuls (grafted scion) - 3 areoles

TPC x Juuls (mother plant cut for scions) - 2 areoles (this specimen already has 3 columnar looking pups emerging from when I cut it to pieces)


I have another TPC x Juuls which is columnar with 5 pups (also columnar so far). I am unsure whether to let them live on the mother plant or remove when suitable for numbers purposes.


(BAP mix is 10,000ppm - 1% w/w)

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This would be great if someone discovered a way to take the cresting genetics out of a specimen.


The ability to selectively force a cacti to remain stable forever could come in handy.


What I am wondering though is that since the cresting phenomenon can often be passed down to a crested's progeny, will cacti thus treated also no longer have crested offspring?  


Or more interestingly, will crested cacti thus treated also have their offspring revert permanently as well?


Perhaps what is needed is a day by day or week by week type progression thread of bap on a few different crests to prove this out? What may be true with one specimen may not be true with another.


The difficulty one might find though is that some crests take weeks to crest from seed and some take years.


I'd suggest you experiment with a crest form that only took weeks to form a crest from seed rather than one that took years to form as your experiment might take an excessively long time to confirm if you chose a specimen that only crested later in life.


I am sure there is no shortage of crested forms that have crested within a few weeks time here on these very forums.

Edited by Inyan

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Trying not to edit my posts too much, so I'll just add this below. 


Have you also heard the rumor that a crested cutting that is too small also will revert and lose its ability to crest?


Perhaps that is indeed true with a particular crest.


However, my own experience proves otherwise. My suggestion, test something that seems a little off before you discount it, but realize that results may vary simply due to the specimen used.


The same thing happens in hybridization. Someone assumes a cross can't happen with a particular species because they have attempted the cross a few dozen times with the same exact specimens. Pollen can be quite variable from one locality to the next with some species.


Sometimes experiments have to be repeated many more times than we would like before positive results are found and yes, sometimes one may find that those positive results are not what you were actually looking for.


False positives and the like abound. The right method may simply not have been found yet or if the right method is known the method may be beyond the expertise of the one trying. There are often many different variables to look at.


Back to your crested specimen, I will look through my pictures to see if I can find a very tiny less than pea sized graft I did of a crested form that reverted for very little bit. I then cut that specimen back again and prompted it to go revert again. Round and round we go, but the story is the same. Crested forms when cut very tiny will often revert to normal, but then often go right back to crested. It all depends on the genetics of the particular crest one is talking about.


I have another crest I cut back on where several pieces reverted for several inches. One piece is just now starting to crest, but it is still only a few inches tall.


Do your own experiments and find your own answers. That is the best advice I can give. When your ready to give up and are satisfied with your answer realize there may yet still be more to the story.

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Here you go, these are the only photos I can find unfortunately of this crested specimen I grafted at a much smaller size than is shown in these photos. If memory serves me, it did not lose its crested form initially when grafted the first time. However, I have cut on this one a few times since this photo was taken and some pieces did indeed revert for a time.


I will take more photos when I get  home to see what is going on with this one now. Bottom line,  small crested pups grafted can indeed revert and then go back to crested, but need not ever revert.


In the mean time... 




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