Yeti101

I read somewhere that coleus sp, includin blumei, had similar effects as Sal div. Does anyone know anything about this? I read it in on a page on erowid somewhere and have had trouble finding it again.

Nope, I don't think it's that. Can't wait to find out.

Well, involucrata could not be too toxic, as in the article above a diluted extract made from 80% ethanol was squirted onto brain cells. On the other hand, these cells were no longer in their owners heads at the time. I can find no mention anywhere of this salvia containing cyanide, but that does not mean it isn't there. Since some of the active components in S.involucrata are water soluble, It seems pointless to do an extraction with non-polar solvent, which would solve the potential cyanide issue, yes?

Does anyone know anything about Salvia involucrata? I've got a very large plant growing, and I'm mystified by its somewhat resinous flowers and psychoactive-looking taxonomy. I have been unable to find any actual information on what might be in it.Just wondering if it has something really deadly in it before I begin sampling (or testing on my unsuspecting friends).

Amazing alright, That man must have seen some weird and wonderful things in his time so far. Keep us oposted on the hydergine front Torsten, that looks really interesting. :D

I could not access it either, but check out this article that I turned up. http://www.ncl.ac.uk/medplant/about_mprc/A...e_nicotinic.htm Not really about involucrata specifically, but it does mention it and it is a fairly interesting read (if you like this sort of thing).

Hmmmm don't quite know. I'm pretty fond of the taste actually, especially of young tips and soft twigs from midsummer khat picked early in the morning. Yum.

I'm not sure I'd describe Tibetian buddhism as "Zen like". Upon investigation I think you will find that they are quite different. Not that I'm very suited to either. I enjoy my earthly/sensual pleasure too much to really commit to a disciplined, ascetic lifestyle, which both Tibetian and Zen buddhism demand, if you are a strict follower.

Fantastic!

I'm interested in peoples opinions on/answers to the following ideas: 1) Is doofing (or what ever you want to call it) or any part of the experience a religious experience? (By 'religious' I mean anything ranging from extra-factual knowledge to out of the everyday experiences and feelings to things that might be considered more conventional religious experience.Psychodelic experinces also count.) If the anwer is yes, how and why? 2) What are, in you opinon the roots of doofing and raves in terms of them being a religious (depending on your viewpoint) experience? What cultures and traditions do you feel have contributed both mentally and physically to the symbolic, physical, mental or even spiritual dimension of these events as we see them today? I'm writing a feild report for a phenomenology of religion subject at uni and while I have my own thoeries on these matters, and have collected some material already, I would really love to hear peoples thoughts on the matter so thart I can put a bit more diversity of opinion into it. -Sam

Ah, sweet sweet LSD, I have never been quite the same since, in a good way of course As for the doof itself, it had much in common, from a phenomenonological vewpoint. (which involves both being objective and taking things at face value. Needless to say I never really got what they were on about) Symbolism, the use of 'sacrements', mystical iconogaphy, even architecture/setting, religious experiences broadly in the form of extra-factual knowledge and a common opinion that these experiences were not "illusions" places, in my opinion, the doof experience, for many who attend them, squarley in the category of religious experience (but not religion). Couldn't be utterly wrong, got a distinction for that subject. Sam.

I agree with rev on this one. The subjective experience of E is SO different to how someone appears to be acting from a not E-ing observers standpoint. People on E can, forget or just plain miss the fact that they being rude, abrupt, selfish. Has anyone else been berated by some pill munching party-animal for having the audacity to bring them down by "not being interesting enough" ? E can offer insights, but that can be said of many substances. Often it is used a chemical security blanket more than an aid to conciousness, but that can be said about many other drugs as well.

I've managed to get growing a large Mucuna pruriens (aka Velet bean) plant. I was going to experiment with smoking the leaves, but remembered the warning about the hairs lining the seed pod and noticed that the leaves are also covered in very fine hairs. A preliminary test (rubbing a fresh leaf on my forearm) indicated that these leaf hairs are indeed also irritating, to myself at least. How in the world do I smoke something that has such an efect? I would hate to think what one of those hairs would feel like in my throat or lung. If anyone has any ideas or experience with this plant I would apreciate any advice that could be given. Till next time....

I didn't realise there were two varieties, trust me to get the hairy one (off SAB actually). I did think that as the seed pod hairs contained serotonin and irritants so did the leaf hairs.As for the irritation, the dried leaves seem to have much less effect, but this needs further work. A very well filtered extract or something like that may be the answer in this case. Who would know, there is limited information concerning the leaves available. Be nice if it worked out well though, an easy plant to grow once you get past the germination. Maybe I'll just have to wait for the beans.....

I've had people in the past ask me if I could help find them a room in Newcastle, and at the time there was nothing available. Now some of my friends have a vacancy at their house that they are looking to fill. So here it is: $55 per week + bills. Close to Uni and bus routes. LAN connection and resident computer wizard available. Sorry that it's about two years late Tripitaka Email or pm me if interested.

Presented my report on monday, talked for so long that my lecturer had to ask me to stop. Thanks to all for the input.

A few quick questions. 1. When can I pick the berries off my Withania somnifera plant for the seeds? (If anyone wants any of these email me, I am going to have heaps) 2. How long does dried Illinois Bundleflower root retain its potency?

Thanks heaps guys, especially electro!

Ah I can see it now "Strange correlatio between ethnogen use and monty python analogies"

You tell them Gomaos!! No amount of anecdotal evidence and testimonies of visions about God affect the logical inconsistency between the way the world is and the way that christian God is supposed to be (Omnipotent, Omniscient and Benevolent). This proble does not have to mean god does not exist, it could mean our connception of him/her/them/it is incorrect. Therefore, one or more of the characteristices have to be modified or discarded. If god is understood to be of limited power or knowledge, or to be neutral rather than good, the problem evaporates. This I suspect is not a huge problem for most people here. It is a problem however for people (conventional christians) who want to maintain all three of the aforementioned attributes. I'm willing to admit that god is all-powerful if christians are willing to admit that god is not just responsible for the nice fun things in life, but for the undeserved suffering and gross unfairness as well. (Which they will never do.)

Maybe. However some people, like Berkeley, said with reguard to minds that to exist is to perceive. So by his view we would have to stop perceiving everything (including ourselves) to stop existing.

Oh come on, is no one willing to step up and say that if no one hears the sound then it just plain does not exist?

What's so wrong with a subjective veiw anyway? Is it not arrogance to claim that our views are anything but that? The truth of many things that are important to us are in our experience of them: pain, pleasure, pscychodelia . If one thinks one is in pain, then one is and so forth. But the truth about tables is not like the truth about pain, is it?

Damn right salvia is a dissociative. My gnome once managed to give himself a nasty burn on the leg with a very hot butane lighter whilst his sitter was momentarily distracted. The gnome was completely unaware of this happening.

Been trying to find info on Psychotria loniceroides for some time now, without much success. I do recall in an earlier thread that somone hade taken some sort of extract without any ill effects, here it is: http://www.shaman-australis.com/cgi-bin/ub...t=000430#000000 Maybe t st tantra could shed some light on the situation. Would be fantastic if P. loniceroides did turn out to be useful, it being so widespread and all. [ 22. May 2003, 11:23: Message edited by: Yeti101 ]