gerbil

I've had the same similar thoughts the last coupla weeks re: age and stages of maturity also somewhat stable expressions of variants within it's description It's become very clear to me over the last few years that our taxonomic classification of species is fairly poor at all the intricacies of the plant world, is it possible in the long term or is our cultural language and practice too restrictive? floribunda has variation within a specific range, as do plants like aya, our cultural system doesn't understand the complexities of traditional oral plant taxonomy, we're aware of the endophyte piri piri example, and still list things like b. caapi as single species yet a group may have 13 species out of our one. I struggle to see how our system can communicate all the complexities, at least at this stage of it's development, when plants are dynamic and locally diverse specifically, which then have mass human influence splayed into creating more confusion. Not that you really asked this specifc question, but i guess i'm saying our classification is too broad and loose and our references are at an infant stage while our cultural upbringing demands a solution of pin point accuracy, a personal enforced demand where we truly aren't satisfied until we've put something in a classification box and labeled it, the apparent primitive systems seem too advanced or just not part of our stimulated learning for our comprehension at this stage? anyhoo enough ramblin' hahaha Think i'm losing my mind, besides the floribunda diagnostic drawing, i can't find it's inflorescence colour listed??? swear i just read it in the text??, in that sense colour possbily is a minor diagnostic feature within these groups. bah, either way taking it to the extremes, in the description the phyllode length is quite variable with it's extreme x4 of the minimum listed length, group that with yellow to pale yellow variations in all degrees of extreme expression of the species and it gets easily confusing, but still under the floribunda blanket. There will be major splitting of species in the future and no doubt many to come outta these handfuls we've been looking at lately. From field observations of aging plants, a more erect thiner phyllode can go to a more broader shorter pendulous on older plants from younger. bark i reckon could be variations within the population as well as age, but also importantly the plants overall conditions during it's life, some plants may get old and be called mature but will have not have reached their biological capability, therefore a plant that may eventually have rough bark hasn't had a chance to do it even though it may have died of old age, age is an interesting aspect and us counting in years is too restrictive, i'll babble that to ya in person one day lol

mucronata http://www.worldwidewattle.com/speciesgallery/mucronata.php floribunda http://www.worldwidewattle.com/speciesgallery/floribunda.php They're tricky ones, particularly these groups, i'm battling similar dilemma with some at home. think i may have a mucronata, or a thinner floribuna, or a nursery hybrid? wish the tag was kept as it's planted ... Are there any glands present on the phyllode margin? it's hard to see in the photo, and can be difficult to spot on some species not present on the floribunda, but present on the mucronata, that seems to be a easy-er characteristic to slate up It does look quite floribunda like, the fairly pubescent stems seems characteristic, can't find that info for the mucronata at present.

You're complicating the process i reckon, just do the boiling water treatment and take out the ones that swell properly, it's best to wait 12-24 hours after treatment so slower ones can swell and catch up to the ones that are almost instant. Retreat the seeds that didn't, repeat process... You want a light mixture that holds moisture, drains well and is light enough for seedlings to get their roots out, many prop. nurseries do a coir:perlite mix for initial seedling, then prick out quickly and pot up to a nutritious free draining mix, like a compost:coarse sand. I custom each time by eye and feel so can't really give specifics. I often opt for a seedling mix with compost to give nutrition, as coir/perlite tubes don't offer anything, but as said nurseries usually prick outta perlite pretty quick. Get tubes or pot with a bit of depth to them, you don't really want large circle pots for germination so tube like pots can be good, depth but not too much width, acacia want their roots down, huge growth will be under with very little veg on top, once the root is disturbed it loses it's complete genetic potential imo. (which generally always is the case with potted speciemens imo), so good to keep them on the run and don't get them pot bound, if destined for the ground get them in asap. Don't get me wrong though, root bound potted specimens planted out still can reach the benchmark of the species, just not what it was fully capable of. setup tubes with chosen mix, water them in well, dib holes in the top and sow swollen seed about 1-2cm, cover with mix and mist down well, put under close fluoro lights and keep at comfortable room temp, only mist if the surface dries out significantly, usually you wont have to mist pre-emergence, don't overwater them and give them time to come up, 1-2weeks they'll crack surface no worries. Don't mess around with humidity chambers etc you'll invite rot and stagnant air, if your soil is moist, airated with a nice light source in fresh air, and okay warmth, they'll come up. Generally room temp with the close fluoro gives all the warmth it needs.

Have a job on in the morning out far north suburbs, don't reckon it'll be finished by 12, but i'll try my best to go straight from there so might just make the later stages of it? Will try to start earlier to get away earlier but it'll be tight. Have some long overdue bits and pieces for some folk so i sorta need to get there, here's to hopin'... fkn shiitake decides to fruit this week, damn thing can't wait a bit longer?

so many shades of blue :D nice one mate. Watch those tall bridgeys, had about 6m of about 10yo pach come down recently, the sound and dent in the ground was pretty scary and that was after it took out 2 other cactus and some rose bush, I staked a similar size bridge that luckily made it through, but mate they are scary to work around when at that height, especially with that weight, take care yeah.

looking at mucronata ssp longifolia, it will be an interesting and tricky one, am getting lots of varied information in veg. communities, from heavy abundant widespread, to abundant in widespread pockets but not as wide spread...east to west, coastal and inland...i reckon even getting info from council to council would be hit and miss, 'tis hard to source ID folk with well truthed locality data in the local authorities. It also doesn't help when councils split themselves in delineated veg communities away from the standard state based ones, (which are pretty slack anyway, so no big surprise with individual innovation) Probably another one that is under my nose in my area too! Will keep ya posted...

hah you've just sparked me back into it, checking some validity of locational data is coming up with some inspiring info :D Good luck with the local project, well worth it i reckon, i got to a stage where i couldn't find anymore on the ground or on species list for the area so thought i nailed most of them, then found a whole new bunch and am continuing to find more within very short areas, they are hugely dynamic and it's quite impressive the diversity of species over very small localised areas, which change over short distances, bioregional significance ey, hugely underrated. Often there are good isolated plants around in local areas that aren't acknowledged as being there, or haven't been recorded for ages, persistence definitely comes up with some good surprises, with definite chance of new species and hybrids. Now's a great season/year, as with the good rains after long dry, seems a lot of species are making themselves more prominant with massive blooms and healthy tip flush. The tricky buggers are planted specimens especially different forms/varieties brought in from outer localities being sourced from a few kilometers to continent wide and then the hybrids of, which then start to naturalise, which makes the local area variable non-valid in ID and then opens you up to the possibility of it being any species continent wide haha fun... Then after you get your head around some stability of species occurrence in vegetation communities you can acknowledge from viewing, bushfire come in, and it's back to grasshopper. It's often best to source as much info as possible from wide range of sources, some species i've only been able to click when 1 reference say out of 10 has included one extra sentence with the critical piece of info, when all other references excluded it, it's tedious seeing parroted classification info, but weeding out the special reference is well worth it. we'll do a walk one day eh :D

Haven't studied it myself, though maybe check out Toothache plant which seems to be going under Acmella oleracea these days. Miswak plant / products might be worth investigation, Salvadora persica, though usually a cleaner / preventative afaik, though adaptive no doubt. Cloves can be useful too. Salvia's can sooth throat issues, possibly worth looking into their actions. Warm salt water rinses help. I highly recommend going and getting it checked by a dentist, mouth infection issues aren't something to take lightly.

just quickly having a look, Acacia oxycedrus http://www.worldwidewattle.com/speciesgallery/oxycedrus.php Acacia oxycedrus x sophorae http://www.worldwidewattle.com/speciesgallery/oxycedrus_x_sophorae.php Also hybridises with the longifolia variant of Acacia mucronata http://www.worldwidewattle.com/speciesgallery/mucronata.php as with the longifolia variant of Acacia longifolia http://www.worldwidewattle.com/speciesgallery/longifolia.php as well as Acacia floribunda as mentioned in the first link, which i reckon would be of great interest. "specimens apparently referable to a hybrid between these parents has been recorded from Brooklyn on the Hawkesbury R., N of Sydney" There's collection data for it, but little hesitant to post it even though it's easily publicly accessable? If yours have ball flowers spacemonk they'll be a different species altogether, there's a few options under the ball ones similar to oxycedrus, there's also reduced spikes which can look a bit ball like. Were they singular balls or many balls on a stem?

yeah the melanoxylon seems to be highly variable in it's foliage expression within localised and broader populations, particularly at young stages like the plants in the photos, not strictly but moreso than a lot of the other Acacia i see on a regular basis, but those species alone would have their specific unique variations too no doubt. I recall when learning the locals around here years ago, seems the melanoxylon was quite frequent in throwing out juvenille bipinnate foliage, specifically like they do as seedlings from the transition from bipinnate to phyllode, i.e. a pyhllode terminating with bipinnate foliage. I've no experience with alpina either, though i think generally their phyllodes are much smaller, maxing out at around 30mm width in the more extreme expressions. Some of the giveaways with these photos are the characteristic patterns/colourations of the stems, the characteristics of the dead phyllodes and the variation of the live phyllode of which is easy to skew ID as there seems to be less stable representation on those plants, though can still see some of the general melanoxylon phyllode shapes poking around in there. though with anything, nothing is 100% ;) If you're up that way sporadically, can't hurt to check in on them for flower structures etc to solidify ID over time, or even just to see the further variation and stabilisation the plants will go through. A good local species to see mass shift in width of phyllode, particularly on young plants is A. pycnantha, going from like dinner plates at times, to those more skinny extremes that melanoxylon can do. Plus their colours are really purdy, almost smack on like phleb, sunburnt colours...

just a melanoxylon there fella, at least from what i can see.

Bedfordia arborescens, blanket leaf http://museumvictoria.com.au/forest/plants/blanket.html

Sorry all, not looking good for making it, have a function at 1pm (timing ey) amongst other things. Apologies for prior convo's with some members, things are complicated, will try to be in touch.

Absolute pleasure, great communication, quick packing and posting, excellent plants too! Highly recommended. Thanks dug!

I followed bits and pieces of the progression of medical use in the states / canada over the last couple of years, watching politicians/czars make completely false statements to support their agenda which was whittled down over time as more intellectual interviewers pushed specific topics and statements to a point where in some cases the politicians/czars had not a leg to stand on regarding their 'no medical value' 'no studies ever proving this or that' etc. Finally when it hit this point in conversation, after it was shown the 'no medical value etc' was a pure lie and the people were squirmin', it came down to and was happily put out there by the speakers that they specifically did not want people getting 'high', from the examples i remember it was in no way a public health thing, i.e. can't get high 'cause they'd be an intoxicated danger in the workplace etc, to me it was quite clear it was the mentality of fear, the whole white male industrialised drinking culture vs pot smoking hippies who threaten the current establishments social structure, unsustainable industries etc. So yeah, your statement is exactly what they want! The demonisation of a plant, demonisation of races, complete dismission of the plants values, then sneaking in, taking parts of it to use for their pharmacy industry, then demonsied and dismiss the plants lack of worth again.

re: durability, Two (90mm?, standard size) plates fit well into the small padded postal envelopes, never had a complaint of a breakage. Have had plates just with a wrap of paper around them, sent to me with good success too.

yah both melanoxylon.

wooh nice one again obtuse, very nice work :D makes ya wonder on the abundance across the southern tip if not appropriate habitats all across tassie of these fellas if they are fruiting at least consistently in one area. cheers for taking time to put up the pics and info.

Could i get # 18 please? Will pm ya. and good to see ya 'round too!

i've got mine in the ground, probably a 4-5 year old plant, we receive frosts which differ in severity over the years, strong frosts but not ridiculous. I like to cut mine back to a bit above ground level once or twice a year after fruiting or if leggy, and they reshoot to a good bushy 2ft in no time. Very easy plants to grow.

probably the honey locust http://www.dpi.qld.gov.au/documents/Biosecurity_EnvironmentalPests/IPA-Honey-Locust-PP47.pdf which paradox ID'ed well over here http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=27198

yeah too much experience over here too, breaks your heart, lost 2 balls of ceaspitosa about a month back, a good 7" diameter+ on both, from the inside out, probably at union, all salvaged bits rotted over the following weeks. My perpesctive it'll be a challenge, do-able but sometimes just outta your control, some of the healthiest heads i've had have re-infected before, good luck

I reckon it was a combination of alcohol synergy, adrenaline and taking too much of a good thing, even if the latter dosage was perceived to be large or small, i don't think many people grasp the strength, particularly the same material in different contexts. An overdose imo can be as simple as a puff, then the substance gets the blame with adulterants etc, where in reality the dosage was too high for the context.

lol well there goes go-go's question just as i hit reply toast of course you are very free to do what you please, but to me this plant is an example of where i think we should be supporting the person/people who created it by making a purchase instead of trades, at least at this young stage in it's existence, just my opinion.

Only had a chance for a brief look in some books, might not be karroo as the spines are different from info atm. The planting thing intrigued me too, am pretty sure the karroo thorn , camel thorn etc. Acacia are on the eradication list in most states if not all? Where abouts did this fella source his material? Local wild seed collections, nursery? Tripsis your ones possibly are Acacia drepanolobium.