Thelema Posted January 20, 2004 (edited) OK OK I thought for ages that the botanical specimen of this story mustve been gabulimima, but Im starting to think it might be something else. About 8 years ago, in the northern territory, a guy got bitten by a crocodile, and a native came along and helped him, took some bark from a tree, ground it, mixed it with his saliva, and rubbed it into the wound. The pain relief effects were amazing. Anyway, so the story goes, from a trusted source, (and Im pretty sure the NT newspaper or the West Australian reported on this, too) the tree was later found and analyzed and found to contain a pain-relieving opiate(?) about 5-8 times stronger than morphine. If this aint gab, what the f*ck is it? Does anyone else remember this incident? Edited February 10, 2009 by Thelema Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
reshroomED Posted January 20, 2004 Thelema, I vaguely remember this. Can't be of much help other than confirming. I remember thinking "this'll be one for the medicine-box" but heard no more and forgot about it. ed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
t st tantra Posted January 24, 2004 i seem to recall a previous thread refering to a wa scientist who was researching this,i think it was being kept as secret as possible . t s t . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torsten Posted January 25, 2004 yep, lots of speculation, but I think someone is covering this with a commercial interest. But the simple fact that this plant exists should encourage people to go out and find it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VINS Posted January 25, 2004 savage trees attacks and dental pain in prevision :D :D [ 24. January 2004, 22:27: Message edited by: VIN'S ] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JumpedAngel Posted January 27, 2004 Hey Thelema I was unaware of this report, Ive been looking at native plants with activity and have several that show promise, I think the problem is we dont have the resources to investigate the matter further without giving the show away. One plant species Ive been looking at with great interest for some years is the humble acacia, yep!, the one we all take for granted, THE premiere Astralian bush survival food (Acacia Tears). Down here in the south east of the continent we have the two alpine acacias which have been shown to contain DMT in the bark as well as the typical high levels of tannic acid, I am not familiar with DMT and do not know if it will relieve pain also. Many people may not be aware that the tan-bark industry sustained the Australian economy at the turn of the last century. That is until the South Africans stole our plants, set up plantations and outdid us with cheap slave labour, ohhh, so cunning. Tannic acid itself is of interest when it comes to injury, one might automatically not associate treatment of a wound with an acid, but in England during WWII tannic acid was the one treatment they had which worked on the burns victims who were able to survive. However the one overwelming thing that made me think of acacia when I read your article was the knowledge that the wet or damp sap of one local acacia was used in traditional Aboriginal medicine to treat open wounds, it is also known that the bark of this same acacia was used to stun fish. It is quite likely by my reconning that there be whales out there yet. This is the Lightwood tree (Acacia implexa), very difficult to distinguish from Blackwood tree (A.melanoxylon), Lightwood flowers in the summer/autum as oposed to winter/spring for Blackwood, I will update my web site in a few months with fotos of the pod as this is the only other way to differentiate for sure, the pod of the Lightwood is long and wriggly like that of the Blackwood but the funicle on the seed of the Blackwood is red and encircles the seed, whereas the funicle of the Lightwood is white and folded beneath the seed. It is likely also with this being only one of some 900 members of this species that there are a number of acacias yet to be discovered or rediscovered. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thelema Posted January 31, 2004 i think it would be quite preliminary to suggest that "opiate bark" is an acacia. For instance: 1)Hakea Divaricata: (fork leaf corkwood)- bark ground and used to apply to burns. 2)Wilga (geijera parviflora): a tea made of dried leaves with intoxicating effects. 3)Caustic Vine (sarcostemnia australe): smoke treatment used to relieve severe pain. 4)Amorphophallus (see ethnobotany post): ether-like smoke. There are so many secrets out there, still, baby. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mescalito Posted February 1, 2004 Fresh dried tobacco was employed in the war(and on my jobsite more than a few times!)for open wounds to halt excessive bleeding,is there a connection with the Acacia here? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theobromos Posted February 2, 2004 Thelema would that be Sarcostemma australe? Related to Sarcostemma acida, one of the modern "substitutes" for Soma. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rev Posted February 5, 2004 Its not just natives but familar plants that have anaesthetic uses The inner bark of the Custard apple is used in Arnhem land as a painkiller for dental pain Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Machine Elf Posted February 5, 2004 On a friend's personal experience I would doubt that the DMT containing Acacias were used for pain-relief. Suffering from a very painful rotten tooth, he was surviving on Panadeine Forte until his dentist visit. After smoking some Acacia bark the pain came back full force, appearing to nullify the benefits of the pain-killers. Belfy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theobromos Posted February 6, 2004 The other parts of custard apple and other Annonaceae may cause a Parkinson's-like deterioration of the brain. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
planthelper Posted February 6, 2004 maybee some plant from the myrtaceae. psidium guajava "guava", contains quercetin which is said to be narcotic. ...chew leaves, its used against dental pain in panama... [ 06. February 2004, 07:08: Message edited by: planthelper ] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Adrian Posted February 10, 2004 Apparently A.malanoxylon has been used topically for artheritis. In relation to all this talk of tooth pain & native plant useage. Has anyone done any further research on Dodonea viscosa. I tried an extract from several grams of dried leaf and thought that it felt somewhat stimulating, but I wouldn't be able to state it's effects conclusively. (right now I feel something unrelated coming on very strong, ooh gooosh! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rev Posted May 15, 2004 lets think about this... tropical australia guy gets bitten by croc crocs live in water guy was prob near water plant put on guy was prob near water screen littoral plants of northern australia... mmm mitragyna relative? nauclea coadunata/orientalis? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_e_ Posted May 25, 2004 i can vouch for somekind of alkaloid content in D.viscosa having done multiple bio assays over the past couple of months.. From my source: 'their are severel varients of this species, of them, the one local to ..... in nsw is the most potent.. It has an effect similiar to but nowhere near as intense as coca in terms of anelgesia and stimulation, a brew can be made from its leaf and stem matter for higher doses or u can chew the leaves if the taste isnt too astringent' Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
t st tantra Posted May 25, 2004 i seem to recall that dodonea viscosa was chewed but not swallowed and that torsten had some unpleasant effects from an oral extract. t s t . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thelema Posted May 25, 2004 Good thinking Rev, and Im pretty sure it was in the north west of western australia or west northern territory, Kimberly way. Apparently there's a local ind. population that actually CULTIVATE it. Does that help you any further? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bloodbob Posted May 25, 2004 Maybe someone wants to go to for a holiday and collect a few samples? http://www.ravenshoe.com/cedarvale/plants.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torsten Posted May 25, 2004 I spent several years hunting down D.viscosa and other dodoneas and all of them were without effect. Some of the root brews I made from viscosa were unpleasant, while all of the leaf brews were inactive. If there is an active D.viscosa then it wold have to have a limited range as I collected it in many different areas (incl about 10 locations between newcastle and wollongong). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_e_ Posted May 25, 2004 I was told by a local bushfood specialist/mycologist/landcarer who has an excellant knowledge of the bio-region that whilst D.viscosa was used by aboriginals all over the place, it was renowned to be of differring potencies in specific areas and also at specific times of the year.. He wouldnt even tell us the botanical name of the plant for about 3 or 4 months, and is always walking around chewing its leaves whilst he works.. When we first started chewing the leaves with him we found little if any effects, however the more we chewed and the more we concentrated the more we began to notice its 'stimulating effects' with enhanced alertness and clarity of perception becomming more pronounced the more we chewed. Whilst i wouldnt describe it as a 'high', i would still say that it is definately active, as i am yet to chew anymore then 10-12 leaves in any sitting. When he eventually gave in and told us the name of the plant, he also alerted us to a huge population out towards the western edge of the hunter valley in a state park close to scone and muswellbrook. On subsequent trips to this state park we have observed thousands of plants that inhabit not only the state park, but the roads into the Barrington State Forest as well. If u would like i can collect numerous samples from 3 different sites i know of and send them up for analysis? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torsten Posted May 26, 2004 Yes, we would love to analyse them, but hold that idea for a few more weeks as we will be in a better position to do so then. We would obviously also be interested in growing this variety in the gardens here. We already have a few species and varieties and some of these have not been bioassayed yet. I am also a lot more sensitive these days then when I did my first lot of research into this species 15 years ago, so I might notice a much smaller dose than before. I pass through your area every few months, so maybe we can go for a trip out that way one day, collecting samples, seeds and herbarium material. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rev Posted May 26, 2004 Thelema - ive already got a bag of leaves sitting around. didnt get bark but could be arranged Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seeker Posted June 3, 2004 Greetings Those with appropriate access may find it useful to research the work of Dr (now Prof) Quinn of Griffith U. It was reported in 1999 that he had found "..a morphine analogue.." in the bark of a tree in the Kimberlies that in its crude form was twice as effective as morphine and potentialy, in a purified form, a hundred times so and without any addiction problems. Quinn is now VERY silent and it is reported that his entire department is funded by a major Pharmo Company. Regards Seeker Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thelema Posted June 3, 2004 without a doubt, thats it! At long last! now we need someone from that university to find out for us. YAY! there was another botanist over here that specialized in indigenous medicine for the CSIRO that reported the native farm of this tree in the kimberlies. Maybe if there's someone from up that way? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites