Effective Alternatives To SSRI's

[Starward]

I am looking for effective alternatives to SSRIs. My friend is a non-responder from standard SSRI treatments. But they feel like they are struggling. However, their root problem is not biochemical but rather environmental, in the form of emotional abuse.

My initial research seems to list exercise as more effective long-term than drugs, but long-term compliance is poor as we all know.
Increasing omega-3 via fish also seems to be helpful - But is fish worth the cost and heavy metal/micro plastic exposure? As I understand it whole fish is better than supplement.

What about 5-Hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP), also known as oxitriptan? (SEEMS HARDER TO BUY)
What about S-Adenosyl methionine (SAM)? (SEEMS EASY TO BUY)

What others have any data to support their use?

[fyzygy]

What's the diagnosis? SSRIs are only marginally better than placebo for depression, with their own host of depressive complications such as suicidal ideation. But I was on various SSRIs for several years, and once upon a time, an MAOI anti-depressant. I can't vouch for any of them. I ditched SSRIs so that I could pursue psychedelics as a therapy instead. San Pedro is a powerful ally. 

 

Omega 3 from plant sources would be preferable to marine sources. Farmed salmon contain very low levels, compared with wild. Contamination (pesticides, PFAS, heavy metals, plastics) is definitely a concern. Apparently the Omega-3 in fish comes from algae, in any case. Maybe something like Spirulina, which has an Omega-6 to Omega-3 ratio of 1.6:1? Walnuts, hemp seed, flax seed, chia seed ...

 

Vitamin D is a useful supplement across the board, including for brain/gut health which is essential to dopamine production. Or make your own Vitamin D, from sun exposure. Good luck finding a vegan Vitamin D supplement (only one local brand that I'm aware of that isn't sourced from lanolin). 

 

Some form of counselling is probably advised for survivors of emotional abuse. It's difficult to find a suitable mental healthcare professional. And it's not cheap (even the GP consultation to devise a Medicare-funded mental healthcare plan can be prohibitively costly). But even a free service like Lifeline is pretty good value, in a pinch. And there would be other free services in their local area, but they would have to seek them out.  

 

Edited April 9 by fyzygy

[Starward]

4 hours ago, fyzygy said:

What's the diagnosis?

 

No diagnoses - just like everyone struggling with life, so the GP pushed SSRI's. If you were to ask for symptoms, negative self-talk, low self esteem, anxiety and occasional panic attacks, moods swings. The normal everyday stuff of end-stage capitalism.

 

Like you, I myself have been through the "SSRIs for several years, and once upon a time, an MAOI anti-depressant" merry-go-round. And my friend has decided to get off before she got fully addicted.

 

4 hours ago, fyzygy said:

San Pedro is a powerful ally. 

 

To True - maybe micro-dosing might be an option!

 

4 hours ago, fyzygy said:

Farmed salmon contain very low levels

 

She loves fish so this might be an option.

 

4 hours ago, fyzygy said:

Vitamin D supplement

 

Is interesting - its absence in blood tests correlated as a marker of ill health for many diseases, however research regarding supplementation benefits is spotty to poor. However its risks are low, and I side with the idea that it could do little harm if taken.

 

4 hours ago, fyzygy said:

counselling

 

She is seeing a talk therapist, because money is not a major concern for her. However, it is just talk, and I feel that some kind of somatic trauma therapy or EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitisation and Reprocessing) would be better. But finding a good trauma therapist seems to be a challenge.

 

ANYONE KNOW A GOOD TRAUMA THERAPIST?

 

I personally have found exercise and a mediation practice to be most beneficial for myself, however as I stated getting other to stick to actual practice is hard. As a culture we seek externalize solution for our internalized problems.

 

 

Edited April 10 by Starward

[withdrawl clinic]

fyzygy gave good advice!

 

a good face to face councelor can make a big difference, don't go on seeing somebody , who doesn't "click" with you.

phone counceling services are as well very good at times, call till you "click" with a person.

 

i struggle with all of the above as well, and prescription drugs, had always bad side effects, (i don't even like sceletium).

moclobomide has been taken off the psb, but is what was suggested. i have used plant maoi's, instead of moclobomide.

 

as said, sun, excercise and good nutrition make a big difference, as doe's the abilety to end relationships which are not reciprocal beneficial.

 

lagochilus, withania, and sinicuichi, sun opener, could all help too.

only when you get older like the 60 's one understands how trauma affects us, in so many different ways.

[Alchemica]

A heavily biomedical psychopharmacologist was once asked what would he say the best antidepressant was and it was "to go out and find someone to help". I'd agree that the multifaceted behavioural activation towards something valued and greater than one's self is a vital ingredient to escape the woe. Doesn't have to be changing the world but just something small and simple that induces the sense that "it was a good day that mattered" is a nice start.

 

I could list ad infinitum potential antidepressants, which you could try and see if they work but in reality that's where I'd start. I find novelty is an important dopamine effluxer so find novel things to do. Exercise, diet as mainstays.

 

Here's a list of potential nutritional etc options https://1drv.ms/x/c/a157359194a53c21/ESE8pZSRNVcggKF-CgAAAAABlsQ51KStyjW4ly8V9_-FlQ?e=IIMmSg&nav=MTVfezAwMDAwMDAwLTAwMDEtMDAwMC0wMDAwLTAwMDAwMDAwMDAwMH0 that could be coupled with such.

[Starward]

On 4/11/2025 at 11:21 AM, withdrawl clinic said:

the abilety to end relationships which are not reciprocal beneficial.

 

All to true, yet confounded by our society valuing money and financial stability over our own personal well being which makes it hard to break away from abusive relationships.

 

All so often as people betray themselves for the privilege of being a wage slave. Myself included.

 

On 4/11/2025 at 11:21 AM, withdrawl clinic said:

lagochilus, withania, and sinicuichi, sun opener, could all help too.

 

Interestingly, I’m growing all of these plants, with lagochilus being the most recent addition. I hope that what I purchased as lagochilus seeds is indeed what it claims to be.

I can understand why withania would be useful for regulating cortisol levels, but why are you suggesting lagochilus and sinicuichi? These two plants are not typically known for their mental health benefits.

 

As far as I can understand sinicuichi has a euphoric effects and lagochilus has sedative and hypnotic effects. But nothing for them being antidepressant and anxiolytic.

 

On 4/11/2025 at 11:21 AM, withdrawl clinic said:

only when you get older like the 60 's one understands how trauma affects us, in so many different ways.

 

Well I got any early start with suicide attempts at age 13, since then my life has been one long journey of uncovering trauma. However I can see that the 60's would be that time when people start to take stock of themselves and might face some unpleasantness about themselves.

 

On 4/11/2025 at 9:36 PM, Alchemica said:

to go out and find someone to help

 

👍 Agreed

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 12 by Starward

[Needfulalterego]

I feel this. I spent 6months all up inpatient between 15-25. Multiple suicidate attempts and Including Anorexia Nervosa to boot which meant I spend 8 weeks in patient refeeding and learning to consume healty \food intake. I got treated for my ADHD untl 18, which got blocked by diagnosis and treatment for Bipolar Affective Type 1 diagnosed around 20. I currently receive CBT from my drug health doctor, who gives me my script for monthly injections as COVID fucked me and had to start treatment because by 30 I became a proper junkie and I still struggle to stay clean and ended up with an epidural abcess which has me still wetting myself and walking with messed up gait
.
> ANYONE KNOW A GOOD TRAUMA THERyAPIST?

Yeah maybe my wife is seeing someone decent. We had 2 close friends die within a week of each other rcently. Where are you based my God Father is the head of the Doctors union I'm sure I can find something whever you are.
w
Antidepressants I would recommend insead of SSRIs are Avanza, ore something lighter, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agomelatine Edited April 13 by Needfulalterego

[Needfulalterego]

P.S I have a psychiast that manges the ADHD and I meet criteria for High Functioning Autism Spectrum especially because my brother's autism is more severe. For over 10 years and he saived my life by treating ADHD with bipolar. I don't live by diagnsosis, I am not just a bunch of labels that I define myself by. But you can find the right treatment... for me it's contiuing the bipolar meds, and dexamphetamine, and buvidal. I have a functioning career in tech and stayed with the same company for 8 years after leaving CSIRO for one of the big 4s.

[Needfulalterego]

5HTP is not going to cut it as an antidrepssant sub. You can have all the serotonin in your brain that it can take but it's not going to fix issues without reuptake inhibitors or the newer gen tetracyclics or Agomelatine. It's like taking tyrosine - have all the dopamine precursors you want but you brain isn't going to do much with it

[Starward]

@Needfulalterego - Thank you for sharing.

 

Edited April 15 by Starward

[saguaro]

There is scientific evidence that exercise can be more effective than SSRIs for certain people.

 

I understand most people live busy lives and work tiring jobs but most people also deny themselves what they are capable of. 

Edited April 21 by saguaro

[Starward]

3 hours ago, saguaro said:

There is scientific evidence that exercise can be more effective than SSRIs for certain people.

 

My friend has started daily dog walks and bike rides, and she says it’s good for her. I have also gotten her to increase her fish consumption and to cut out the sodas.

However, she has decided to go back on an SSRI - she saw a GP, did the 2-minute mental health inventory quiz, and the GP wrote out a script. Wham, bam, thank you, ma’am. Out the door she goes.

No attempt by the GP to help, no attempt to direct towards services, no attempt to understand. Just write a random script for some random SSRI. Times up, get paid.

People are so uncomfortable being uncomfortable. Nobody wants to sit with their grief and their pain; they just want to be numb to the core.

 

Over the weekend, I gained a profound understanding of my own behavior, which is deeply rooted in my unexplored emotions surrounding my childhood experiences. It’s been a challenging journey, and I’m grappling with the overwhelming flood of thoughts and memories that have surfaced in the past few days. These thoughts are fueling an intense creative process, with journaling and dreaming becoming my outlets. However, the process of integrating these insights into my life is arduous and requires a significant amount of effort—work that many people would rather avoid.

 

Simpler to pop a pill.

 

 

Edited April 22 by Starward

[immanuel]

I have schizoaffective disorder and whilst the positive symptoms are mainly reduced through medication I most struggle with the negative symptoms of this illness.

 

The most important aspect of my recovery has been through inner work and a discipline of meditation.

 

It definitely requires persistence and patience but ime this is the best route for healing which in my own personal experience is a more "mild" form of a DSM "disorder".

[fyzygy]

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2025-04-28/ketamine-nasal-spray-added-to-pbs-for-depression-treatment/105217432

 

[-RC-]

Can't give 'em mushrooms though... 🥺

[Starward]

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/1BeuFKUXof/?mibextid=wwXIfr

 

I’m not convinced about Ketamine or these legislative changes. Again, the government is once again restricting mental health treatments to the wealthy, just like they did with psychedelics and cannabis. The video shows that to access the treatment, you’ll have to visit a select private treatment clinic KA-CHING KA-CHING that will charge exorbitant fees to access Ketamine treatments forcing people to abide by onus rules and restrictions, like being unable to drive or work on dosing days. Only the leisure class can afford to not work a couple of days a week to access medical treatments. 

 

It seems to me that the Australian government is concerned; health care is really a pay-to-play system.

Looking at Ketamine itself. We have all read about the Ketamine days spas and clinics that are flourishing around the US. Services that market Ketamine as being akin to having a mental health facials during your office lunch break. Reports are surfacing that amongst the elite business and leisure classes, Ketamine is being used in huge quantities, supplanting alcohol as the drug of choice. There are rumors and grave concerns amongst certain commentators that Elon Musk’s increasingly erratic behavior are due to his near-chronic use of Ketamine. Then there is the death of Matthew Perry amongst many others linked to Ketamine. 

 

Today's Ketamine is very much akin to the Nitrous oxide craze of the 19th century.

 

Reading Ketamine treatment reports, I am struck that Ketamine is becoming just another pharmaceutical money-making venture. People report needing ongoing, repeated weekly or monthly treatment sessions, often costing substantial sums (for a generic drug), that over time require ever higher doses, with no ultimate resolution of the disease itself.

Ketamine is the perfect drug for the medical and pharmaceutical industries, that is having its day, having had FDA approval and being used by doctors for pain management and having a relatively good safety profile. Making it an easy sell for off-label use to treat other conditions. Ketamine also does not have the stigma that have proven as a headwind for psychedelics, making it an easier sell to the political classes and the plebeians masses. But best of all its a cheap generic ideal for lifestyle marketing. Let the good times roll.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 30 by Starward

[fyzygy]

16 hours ago, -RC- said:

Can't give 'em mushrooms though... 🥺

Researchers were trialling psilocybin for treatment-resistant depression in Oz, it's probably in the pipeline. I'm not sure where things stand at the moment, psilocybin was prohibitively expensive when first approved by the TGA (for PTSD?)   

 

The new ketamine substitute -- non-psychedelic, I assume -- will be on the PBS, costing tens instead of thousands of dollars. But yes, even a GP consultation is prohibitively expensive these days. Big Tech Broligarchy is always looking for a new Soma to dispense to the huddled masses. 

2 hours ago, Starward said:

KA-CHING KA-CHING