The Spineless Trichocereus Scopulicola Project

[mysubtleascention]

finally..

my question:

It is acceptable for my purpose, if the seeds are result of hand pollination between two spineless scopulicola parents ..but open pollination of scopulicola will result in progeny I'm not interested in..

Is it possible to ask your supplier of their exact method ?

Koehres answer:

T.scopulicola has been collected at the original location Mr Ritter found
kind Regards
Bettina Koehres
Besuchen Sie unsere Webseite: www.koehres-kaktus.de

[hostilis]

Thanks for doing the inquiry mysubtleascention!!

[mysubtleascention]

I know of someone trying to cross scop x scop for the last couple of years with no success .. perhaps his plants are all the same clone..

.. perhaps it is time for the spineless scopulicola seeds project

[zelly]

Trichocereus scopulicola

This Ritter species is currently believed to be extinct in the wild. Or at least several sets of people have been unable to locate it including botanists searching on behalf of the Kew prior to the publication of Hunt’s New Cactus Lexicon. It is suspected of having been extirpated by freely wandering goats, as is the case for a number of cactus species.

http://troutsnotes.com/tag/scopulicola/

[hostilis]

We should do it. All share scop pollen and see if we can get some fruits.

[Evil Genius]

Spineless Scops exist, but maybe some are not labeled as such. I got some that originally came from Knize years and years ago. Don´t have them anymore but we just need to keep an Eye open and they will be shared around in the Scene. A lot of people bought the Scop seed and if there are any Spinless Ones, just sort them out and propagate.

[Gunter]

My spineless scop seedlings had spines until they grew up a bit...

[hostilis]

That's how I figured they would start. Spines at first untill they mature a bit. Did you plant the seeds yourself or buy them as seedlings?

Edited December 4, 2014 by hostilis

[Gunter]

Planted from seed. They had spines up to 1cm and often many at the areoles, the spines only avetaged 4-5cm...

When they plants were about 15cm tall and about 5cm thick the spines got shorter and shorter till they were not observable. A little later on in maturity there was also a rib

shift from an average of six to five. These events occurred in all of the batch, I grew out nearly 50 plants and donated most of them to a botany club fundraiser at a university.

Edited December 6, 2014 by Gunter

[hostilis]

Nice. Have any pictures?

[zed240]

I can take some pics of my 2 scop seedlings that have spines at the bottom and now are growing spineless. They are about 2.5 years old from seed. I will post pics tonight.

[hostilis]

Where did you get your seeds zed?

[cactuscarl]

I have spineless scop. My boss had one about 2m tall and it fell so I ended up with a piece. It doesn't get real thick... only about a bit thicker than normal pc. I thought it was a pachanoi for a while but its got that scop skin and goes completely spineless on old growth... smooth to touch.

[hostilis]

So it has spines but they fall off?

I feel like I'm interrogating everyone on this thread. Lol.

[Evil Genius]

They probably don´t fall off. It´s just that some Plants tend to produce very little spines on the upper Body. Some are completely spineless the older they are. I am pretty sure that many of these Scops will look very spineless as mature Plants. The small Seedlings that you sometimes see and that resemble Pachanoi haven´t reached their adult Form yet. With cacti, there are many that change into an Adult Form and look completely different.

Btw, Validus is said to be spineless on the upper Part of the Body too. At least that´s what Backeberg said.

[zed240]

If you run your hands over the top of first one you don't get caught on any spines. The second one isn't as spineless on top as I thought it was just yet. They're both about 35cm tall so I'm guessing(hoping), they'll get much fatter and the second one a bit more spineless soon enough.

I've also asked the seller where the seed came from and we'll see what he says when/if he responds.

[zelly]

hostilis, think of it like this.....spines are leaves, and on an incredibly tiny plant with minimal surface area, the leaves (spines) are doing their job in promoting plant growth. As it matures and acquires more surface area, the leaves arent necessarily necessary, if its in the plants genetics to be spineless.

many, many spiny trichs go nearly spineless on mature tips, its just the way they grow, and it seems bridgesii more so than others.

[hostilis]

Interesting! Thanks for bearing with me with all my questions. I've just been extremely interested in learning more about scopulicola lately.

Here are some pictures of my scopulicola cutting. It has tiny tiny tiny spines (virtually spineless from SS), but you can't really see them except for at the very tip. This was when I first got it. It's grown a few inches since.

From what I understand there are a couple clones of (virtually) "spineless" scop floating around. One that has "belly button" areoles, a clone that has slightly indented areoles, and an exposed areole clone. I'm not sure if these are all the same clone grown in different conditions or just a bunch of different clones, but if we could get them bred together we could get some awesome plants.

So who would be interested in the spineless scopulicola seed project? We could either trade cuttings or trade pollen of our scops and try to make some spineless seed. I don't have any flowering trichs yet, but I'm sure lots of you do.

If any of you are interested I'd be down to facilitate it and possibly pay for some of the postage costs of pollen in exchange for a few seeds if successful.

Edited December 5, 2014 by hostilis

[☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ]

defo interested

all my scops look spineless (cept the babies obviously) but i can still feel the spines lightly if I grab em

and only just see them if i look very very close

i was fortunate enough to aquire a tip from one that had already flowered recently ,

I'm hoping that will be my first scop flower and will probably be up to scratch re- pollen taking/storing etc...; by then.

scop 1

scop2

scop3

scop4

scop5-flowerer

Edited December 5, 2014 by ☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ

[☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ]

many, many spiny trichs go nearly spineless on mature tips, its just the way they grow, and it seems bridgesii more so than others.

indeed that and check out succseed's terscheckii

seedlings atm are indeed spiny and wont be like the pic till old...

[Berengar]

Succseed's 'spineless tersheckii' for me produced some Browningia-looking seedlings. They were only 5 or so cm (grafted) when they both died, but they definitely did not look like Trichocereus to me. But perhaps it was a mixup on my part. I have a couple SS's terscheckii seeds leftover, and I'll try again in spring.

On a topic more related to the OP, I've noticed that most hybrids with scopulicola dominant genes tend to become almost spineless when they grow to a couple of feet, regardless of how spiny the father was. Anyone else noticed that? Most other hybrids settle somewhere in the middle...

[☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ]

dang, browningia are so pretty i just cant afford one at the prices they go for over this way...

I only sowed my spineless terscheckii in spring but here are the last few standing (sowed 10 per pot and had 100% germ rate but whittled down to 5,-lol- i really need to hone my summer "seedlings protocol" so I bake less of them)

and heres some zelly scops from about that time tooI forgot how many of these I lost

Edited December 5, 2014 by ☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ

[Gunter]

When cut my spineless scops had 1-2mm spines on regrowth.

[Micromegas]

Interesting thread.

However, I'm not quite sure i understand. Isn't a scop by definition spineless? If I had a "scopulicola" with spines I would call it something else, like cordobensis.

I have never seen a mature "scop" that had spines. I have several from different parent plants that flower, one day i'll try to cross them currently they're 1000s of km away.

I bought one of those tiny scop seedlings from bunnings once, now it is 7ft tall it doesn't have spines i'm sure it would cross out with other spineless ones from cuttings.

I like then coz you can give them a good fondle.

[Auxin]

When ritter defined scopulicola he said spines were often absent, sometimes 3-4 spines, awl shaped, to 1 mm long.

So the scops with spines enough to feel when you grab it, but usually not puncture flesh, still count as scops.