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psycho0

natural sleep aids(strong)

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for years i have had a hard time getting to sleep, it can take up to 4-5 hours

it's really shitting me mad.gif

what would be thwe best natural sleep aid?

homeo. melatonin does shit, even valim and that don't work.

should i maybe try L-Tryptophan? or can u get strong melatonin?

thanx

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Originally posted by psycho0:

should i maybe try L-Tryptophan?

Better still 5HTP from Griffonia seeds

or can u get strong melatonin?

Yep. Other discussions on this topic have featured quite a few ppl dissing homeopathic melatonin. Comparison shopping from ppl here found a good cheap reliable source of 3mg melatonin, a search should reveal the URL, Club Natural or somesuch. You;ll need to find a friendly doctor to give you a script or you'll risk having customs confiscate it when it hits the country

Other ppl will prolly suggest herbal remedies, but these two work really well for me

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Guest VENDEJO
Originally posted by psycho0:

homeo. melatonin does shit, even valim and that don't work.

should i maybe try L-Tryptophan? or can u get strong melatonin?

thanx

How much melatonin are u taking? This is what the brain natural produces to help you get to sleep. Why not increase the dosage.

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Guest saucer-like

For years I had trouble getting to sleep, laying in bed for hours etc. until I stumbled on a mixture of 1-2 teaspoons of plain old Peppermint essence mixed with equal amount of cream (to hide the aweful taste)It may not be opium tea but I swear by it and at a cost of approx 30c a pop it's well worth a try! It works for me!!!

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Well I suppose this is natural, though some might disagree.

If it was still legal, I'd say give GHB a go on an EMPTY stomach. But not enough to knock yourself out, enough to feel drowsy, I suppose on par with feeling drunk. This was great for getting a friend to sleep. However he found at knock out doses, sure you go to sleep fast(15-20 mins), but only for a few hours, then you wake up again, at which point you could take another knock out dose. But this seems unhealthy to me.

The problem with taking a less than knock out dose is the acompanied euphoria, and empathy, which made my friend want to do lots of things other than sleep, but if you can train yourself to resist those urges and go to bed it's great for sleep. Too bad it's illegal.,

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I have always thought the best way to sleep without aide of drugs/herbs is try to stay awake, it will make you more tired and you will doze off.... If you become depend on aides to help you sleep, in the future you might have more diffculties to sleep without aides.

If you have a TV in your Bedroom, get rid of it, your bedroom is for sleeping only, not to watch TV, you will be surprised with the differences, it happened to me, I just followed advice of a workmate, it worked, I dunno how, it just worked.

Thats how I fix my sleeping problems, is just stay awake and watch these boring telemarket TV shows that shows in the wee hours, because I am deaf,I watch TV with captions from these teletexts and these telemarketing shows are not captioned so I do not understand the blabbings of these artifcial yankie salespeople who probably had too many lines of coke or speed, too many face lifts, and too many hours in these Tanning beds. I just stare at the screen until it makes me drowsy, then I go to bed...have a good sleep!

I heard there's a good way for hearing people to sleep is have a tape recorder and record these boring old people chats in Nursing Homes, and when you go to bed, wear a walkman to radio and listen these tapes oldies's chat, it's supposed to make you sleep, that what a friend of my old man claimed, don't ask me if it works.

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Originally posted by psycho0:

for years i have had a hard time getting to sleep, it can take up to 4-5 hours

it's really shitting me  mad.gif

what would be thwe best natural sleep aid?

homeo. melatonin does shit, even valim and that don't work.

should i maybe try L-Tryptophan? or can u get strong melatonin?

thanx

Yeah, up to 6g melatonin (from www.melatonin.com) does very little for me as well. I have seen talk of increasing the effect with mono-amine oxidase inhibitors (MAOIs), but the downside there is that you have to watch what else you take - no alcohol for instance.

Other natural substances that have been verified by research (see medline) to tackle insomnia include valerian, kava and St John's wort. The latter is typically regarded as an anti-depressant, which doesn't necessarily mean that you have to have a clinical condition to benefit from it. However, the theory says that it should be more effective at preventing the early-morning wake-ups rather than the late evening "can't drop off" syndrome. You can obtain all of those substances, sometimes combined together, in highly expensive pill form from your health-food store or supermarket, which obviously starts to make cultivation and/or bulk purchase look attractive.

Shame you don't get anything from valium - it improves my sleep, as well my mood (which I realise is probably an indictment of my personality and/or lifestyle)! However, it appears to be nasty if taken continuously, and I don't like having to grovel before my doctor to get a script. There is some research suggesting the chamomile family contains potent natural benzodiazepine-like substances, and you will certainly find people who will vouch for the calming effects of chamomile tea. Once again, it doesn't work for me personally (that is, using commercial dried preparations). I would even go so far as to stick my neck out and suggest that there could be a placebo effect operating here, because the research seems to indicate that the main active substance in chamomile has poor bio-availability due to poor water solubility in the first place. Anyone want to disabuse me of that notion? (One thing on my "to do" list is to play around with extracting chamomile into other solvents).

Lastly, whilst we're talking synthetic substances like valium, have you given anti-histamines a try (eg, phenergan, restavit - from the chemist)? They knock me absolutely silly fast, but tend to have some unpleasant side-effects, like next-day grogginess, pins and needles in the extremities, and heartburn (which is completely odd, because some anti-histamines are supposed to _prevent_ heartburn). However, as a last resort, they are unmatched.

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Yeah Restavit(Doxylamine succinate) is the best antihistamine (muscle relaxant?) I've tried for sleep. Like you a full tablet is too strong and I feel comatosed the next day till early afternoon, but 1/2 a tablet is much more tolerable. I'm used to going to bed very late, but when I take a dose at 9pm, i'll be asleep by 10pm so they certainly have the desired effect.

The problem with them (for me) is a tolerance to them builds up immediately. If I were to take a tablet tonight, tomorrow night restavit wouldn't work for me. I'd say they're only good to use one night, then maybe 3 nights later. Increasing the dose didn't help me sleep either, after taking 4 tablets I hallucinated all night, and I'm unsure if I did actually sleep at all or weather I hallucinated I was sleeping.

Also if you're on any medications that aren't very selective and are histamine antagonists(maybe only a problem for H2 receptor antagonists?)such as tricyclic anti-depressants, anti-psychotics and probably lots others, Restavit won't help with sleep.

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A study with geriatrics showed that a few drops of lavender oil on the pillow was as effective as valium for preventing insomnia. I also recommend other essential oils, such as basil, rose, oregano, marjoram, clary sage (avoid alcohol with this one as the hallucinations are boring and keep you awake) and frankincense.

Herbal teas can be very effective but often you have to get up for a piss within an hour.

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there are these great vials of herbal concoctions one can find in chinese herbal shops that, for me, work better than valium and don't have the same side effects that synthetics have.Each vial contains zizyphus jujuba seed, schizandra chinensis berries and salvia miltionhiza root. These herbs are said to "nourish the heart" which is the place where one's spirit is said to reside during sleep. The name of this herbal product is "ZAOREN ANSHEN YE", available from most chinese grocers or herbalists.

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It appears that melatonin is ineffective and may even result in paraodixal reaction (ie it keeps you awake after a 1-2 hour nap and may even cause anxiety after that time) in people with extremely low serotonin levels. In these cases it is advisable to increase serotonin first or concurrently. Melatonin will then work.

Essnetially it is melatonin that puts you to sleep naturally. So if it doesn't then you have a problem with melatonin. This may not be a sinular problem as melatonin levels are in most cases directly related to serotonin levels, and inversely related to cortisol and adrenaline levels.

Thus, getting your adrenaline down will go a long way to helping your body rebalance itself. This can be done in many ways, ranging from meditation & relaxation (incl essential oil aromatherapy and acupuncture), adrenal antagonism (via serotonin increase), or GABA binding (via kava, valium, GHB where legal).

Temporary releases causing depletion of the required transmitters is NOT recommeneded. This includes smoking cannabis and to some degree opiates.

A good regime for people who have trouble getting to sleep and have an active mind is to take small doses (

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