holy shit

[Andrew]

uh oh......While I am strongly against violence I have to say "what goes around comes around".Pity for all he innocent people involved.

[NordicRituals]

pretty incredible stuff. i wake up and mum tells me that the twin towers have collapsed.

crazy crazy world. i'd hate to think about the US response to all of this. looks to spark a very hostile situation with bin laden... what frightens me is that dubya said he's holding the countries that habour him just as responsible... big war ahead.

[Darklight]

Civilian casualties anywhere gives me the horrors. The only thing I can't forgive those responsible for this one is sending passenger jets full of ppl crashing into one of the most densely populated civilian areas on the planet. Mexico city, Beijing, Dehli would be equaly fucked.

Military anywhere, fine, they're up for it more often than not. If they didn't work it out before they joined up then they'd have a fair idea soon after. At least they have a culture capable of dealing with it ( at least at the time ).

Can you imagine the triage units in Manhattan? They're the ppl my heart really goes out to. Making instantaneous decisions like who lives and who dies an unassisted and painful death unattended in a corridor would be anaethema to trained healers. Whether or not they are making consistently responsible decisions ( who ultimately among us is so capable? ) they will feel responsible for them nonetheless.

Stock up on morphine and silk stockings ( oh, that was last war ;-) dudes this is going to get weird

[?SaToriBluE?]

I still think people have to keep a realistic perspective. It was an act of anarchy by a group whose resources included martyrs, knives and a few well aimed jetliners. While resourceful, it was hardly an act of terror within the realms of what is actually possible in todays world.

What this terrorist action demonstrates is how vulnerable we are to acts of terrorism, the scale of this though is insignificant, compared to what is actually possible. Just imagine what would happen if it was a well coordinated biological weopons attack. You could wipe out the population of entire cities in days. All you would need is a crop duster or a jar of spores, gasmask and a water reservoir, hey you could use all three techniques.

If those terrorists could organize slamming a 737 and a 767 jetliner into The World Trade Centre's two towers, then they can organize to drop jars of spores in all of a cities water reservoirs and a crop duster or three.

They would never be able to mobilize enough vaccine to immunize a whole city against anthrax or worse.

I am interested to see if the entire world uses this as a catalyst for mobilization against the terrorist nations.

[This message has been edited by ?SaToriBluE? (edited 12 September 2001).]

[woof woof woof]

They had it coming....

Opressing other countries or just ignoring them.... what you give is what you get!

is terrible what happenend...but it had to happen....

folks don't let the emotions blurr your perspective of reality.

they had it coming

remeber God is great...all doen't happen withou a reason.

I think America will even benifit from this incident in the future.... they would be very stupid to let an opportunity like this go.

If it does'nt kill ya , it'll only make you stronger.

Peace.

[?SaToriBluE?]

I do not think America have anything coming at all.

I think whoever is stupid enough to own up to this act of madness is going to bring the full might of truth and justice down upon themselves and anyone insolent enough to protect them.

The mightiest and most powerful forces in the world could well decide this is a perfect reason to annihilate anyone minutely responsible.

If this happens, then throwing a couple planes, at some buildings is going to look pretty absurd.

It will be an interesting situation to watch unfold. Anything might happen and very little might actually take place, it is impossible to tell from our perspecitve. Be interesting finding out though. I personally hope the world does something significant.

Using civilians in such an act is just unforgivable.

[This message has been edited by ?SaToriBluE? (edited 12 September 2001).]

[gomaos]

Originally posted by Torsten:

At least this will be the end of the Taliban in afghanistan - one regime I have little sympathy for.

I second that.

And to put an ethnobotany spin on this ...... maybe we will be able to travel to and in afghanistan in a few years after all (to collect lagochilus).[/b]

When I was there in 1977 they were world leaders in producing a certain herb extract.

Wouldn't mind sampling that one again either.

[spiraleyes]

beginning of the end....no?????

[DreamingNagual]

This is unreal,Woke up about 2 hours ago and seen the tellie...Oh my god people jumpin outta windows, Is bin laden realy behind this??

I just logged on to www.policescanner.com

can hear it live,

Oh my god!

[Guest Hyper-SpaceCowboy]

US has bombed 19 nations since 1945 all in the name of capitalism.

What do they expect?

Its a tragedy

My heart goes out to the innocents

[Chemical Shaman]

From the Erowid:

The Erowid crew is saddened by today's terrible events.

Perform an act of kindness today to help balance the fear and hate.

[dutchie]

Whoooe shit. I was woken this morn to find myself feeling the same at the begining of the gulf war. Another war showed in all its gory glory on tv. It felt quite surreal. I watched that second plane hit the second tower and I was shutterd with an imense feeling of disbelief and desensitization. It looked like a computer generated movie, the reality of it blured with previous explosive movie scenes shown in the latest block buster. Its such a strange feeling... it must be horrible.

People are right in thinking, "they deserve this", i agree in some respect but as torsten said , those peolpe in those planes didnt have to die and nothing excuses this type of action against anyone.

As for a masterminded plan, comon, any goose with a airport schedule, a few computers and a copy of MS Flight simulator could get away with this, plastic knives, whatever, it wouldnt be that hard when you think about it. Once the crew was taken out, who can stop you? As nasty as it seems, it was a hugely sucessful, cheap strike at the heart of the US with their own flying fuel(explosive) carriers.

Very clever but by no means a masterminded attack.

Those poor people............

D

[Guest VENDEJO]

How can you make someone down a plane by threatening to stab them? Or did these so called Muslem extremists have pilots who flew the planes themselves once they took control.

Come on satoriblue we're a US outpost - why wouldn't our news be full of US propaganda. I spoke to an African guy today who said they were celebrating in the streets of Iran. I noticed in his speech (on TV) that George W looked really amused at one point - what a shithouse choice of person to use for PR.

How the fuck did he get that MBA???

But then again he also said he spoke Spanish and said Hola Hispanicos when he went to Mexico what a fuckhead.

[Guest reville]

Originally posted by dutchie:

As for a masterminded plan, comon, any goose with a airport schedule, a few computers and a copy of MS Flight simulator could get away with this, plastic knives, whatever, it wouldnt be that hard when you think about it. Once the crew was taken out, who can stop you? As nasty as it seems, it was a hugely sucessful, cheap strike at the heart of the US with their own flying fuel(explosive) carriers.

Very clever but by no means a masterminded attack.

Those poor people............

D

yeah sure but 4 planes simultaneously with no leaks to Intelligence agencies US or international? And finding 4 people who can fly planes and are willing to die?

Not a mastermind plan unless its not islamic fundamentalists but rather Christian fundamentalists framing the mystery man Osama bin laden in an attempt to galvanise public hate and start a holy war of their own....

Why does everyone forget the Christian and Zionist zealots and concentrate solely on the arabs - I guess its cos were made to feel guilty about the hard time the jews got in WW2 that we forget to mention that the zionists themselves are bloody Nazis and that since bible belt america is all about family values and shit, that they dont crave a chance to seize political power and all those nukes? I bet theyd love to send a few blessed nukes to take out the 'chockos'.

i really dont know what to think...I havent gone to lectures today.. im here and going over the comments and feelings of fellow psychonauts here and at the shroomery..

I just feel like well that right now for every runaway lynchmob theory that gets put across CNN i need to come up with a counter theory lest we all believe what we are told..

i hope the military can be restrained, this is only as big a deal as we make it.

[This message has been edited by reville (edited 12 September 2001).]

[shroomy]

scary shit. wathing the tv this morning was almost like being under the influence of mushrooms "very sureal" I don,t know who was responsible but all of us will pay. me i just went to the bank and locked in my home loan for the next two years all this talk about the world stock markets being down and our own loosing 7% today scares the shit out of me. i also seen peter costelleo dribling some shit about how australia was well placed to ride this out but he looked more of a liar than he ever has almost troubled which is way out of caracter for him. dam they just showed video footage of the first plan slamming into the first tower. why was this video cam pointing at the trade center at that particular time expeicialy since the plane came from behind where the camera man was filming you would think hearing a plane flying that low you turn to see what it was not just stand there filming a inert building mmmm seems a bit sus. anyway i feel sorry for the victims and their families of those that died today and for those that will surely die in the name of payback tommorow.

[Schitztrip]

yeah it sure is a tragedy, and today allready i've heard a lot of ignnorant, bigoted responses, for example "all the bloody Arabs should be blown up" which is very disconcerting. Hmm let the scapegoating begin...

[spiraleyes]

this makes the world seem so much smaller!

[Guest mandragora]

l

Edited April 17, 2007 by mandragora

[waterdragon]

the real tragedy was that the fourth plane went to waste. i feel for the families of todays dead, just as i have felt for the innocents abroad, and the innocents within america that have suffered too long under successive regimes. the U.S policies - foreign and domestic are starting to bear fruit and i'm looking forward to a bumper crop. the downside is that this will galvanise the U.S public and congress and all of a sudden the skies the limit. interesting times we live in.

[Hopping Eagle]

Man's inhumanity to his fellow man never ceases to amaze, regardless of race or religion.

"Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. We are more than the sum of our knowledge, we are the products of our imagination."

- Ancient Proverb

What are we leaving for the future?

Why should the stockmarkets be dropping (I know the reasons but don't agree with them)- there's bastards out there making a shitload of money speculating on other peoples misfortune.

Whilst one can see the karma behind these events the loss of innocent life - wherever on this earth that may occur is something to mourn.

Peace brothers & sisters

[rkundalini]

Re blaming bin Laden, well you need to consider that the people who organised this were crazy enough to actually do it. Nothing can actually be achieved by doing that and surely the only mindset that could motivate it would be an insane and delusional plan to topple the west, beginning with America. How many people are that insane and yet are so extremely capable as to be able to pull this off in the face of many hundreds of billions of U.S. "intelligence"? Not very many. However, as pointed out in the media, at least there appeared to have been no biological or chemical weapons used, which is maybe puzzling if these people were that full-on.

I can't believe this is happening. Here I am thinking CS has seen a little 2-seater plane crash in Melbourne or something... I just spoke to a friend who flew out of JFK airport (bound here) only a couple of hours before it happened, ie they were in the air at the time... jesus. Another collegue is stuck there but is OK.

Oh well, as Torsten says, bye bye Taliban.

[This message has been edited by rkundalini (edited 12 September 2001).]

[Guest si]

watedragon wrote:

"the real tragedy was that the fourth plane went to waste"

are you kidding or what ?

"the downside is that this will galvanise the U.S public and congress and all of a sudden the skies the limit"

ohhh, i got it now, here i was thinking that the downside was the exceptional loss of life (it is not my place to judge who are innocent or guilty) and the incredible pain felt by the surviving families and friends. Thanks for clearing that up.

"interesting times we live in"

i guess so....

[gomaos]

Originally posted by rkundalini:

. However, as pointed out in the media, at least there appeared to have been no biological or chemical weapons used, which is maybe puzzling if these people were that full-on.

Perhaps that's next on the agenda.

Or, as they say on "The Simpson's":

"That arranged can be!"

[Schitztrip]

For the last 15hrs now - I’ve been watching the coverage of the New York terrorism and the subsequent racist scapegoating. The whole event is pretty disturbing…people leaping out of windows, rescue workers being crushed etc

And now the evilest guy in the world is supposedly Osama bin Laden – he probably was responsible - I don’t know.

What the news coverage seems to be ignoring though, is that it was none other than the American CIA who trained this guy how to be a terrorist. When the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan, the CIA trained him and his buddies how to most effectively destroy things. It worked! The soviets turned and ran and Osama thought it might be a good idea to use the techniques he was taught against his teachers!

The whole thing is highly dodgy – its hard to believe a guy living in the middle of nowhere in a tent could orchestrate something like this. I just heard that books were found on how to fly planes in the back seat of a car or something and that they were written in Arabic. Gee those guys must be really fast learners, read a book and know how to accurately fly a plane in to the World Trade Centre. But who knows, it probably was him.

Still, Americans, it seems abhor terrorism, unless they re the ones doing the terrorising. They trained terrorists to kill thousands of people in Nicaragua in the 80s, not to mention the oppressive regimes that they have funded in say Chile, Vietnam, Indonesia, Gaza and Salvador. And what about the state sanctioned terrorism of Iraq that continues 10 years after the gulf war has ended! Really, its little wonder that orphaned children in these countries hate America!

You know what is really ironic, these people hate George Bush, and the innocent victims in New York didn’t even bloody vote for him!

The media and government whipped up a fervent display of ugly right wing propaganda right from the start – the possibility that it was another Tim Mcveigh wasn’t even considered! Already Muslim groups have reported hate mail ad threatening phone calls. People are so ignorant! The Taliban and so forth only represent around 10percent of the total Muslim population anyway

[Guest Ramon]

Originally posted by Chemical Shaman:

Perform an act of kindness today to help balance the fear and hate.

whilst I haven't finished reading these responces yet, this I think is the most important point I have read yet.

I think that one of the most unfortunate pieces of footage I have seen is the Palestinians , celebrating the news. I can see their perspective in that they have to live with this type of shit every day. But still I don't think that their cause will be helped by them celebrating in the streets. If America was biased against them before imagine how they will feel about them after seeing that sort of thing,

[This message has been edited by Ramon (edited 13 September 2001).]