IndianDreaming Posted October 3, 2012 I think this is disgusting... http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/experts-alarmed-at-new-adhd-guidlelines/story-fncynkc6-1226486885224 What sort of world do we live in where we pump out kids full of stimulant drugs because they misbehave? Not one mention of looking at the kids' diet to see if that's the cause... 20 spoons of sugar into any kid under 7 is enough to cause them to act like a psychotic lunatic - "if you've tried everything else and its not working" - How long will this approach last? It's quicker, cheaper and easier to buy $5 worth of chemical prison and lock the kid in there... For the one in a million kid that actually needs this, then fine - but give it a year and we'll have 50,000 kids under 7 on Ritalin... Where's Wonko, I'm moving in... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
myco Posted October 3, 2012 i agree that is disgusting how do doctors not get that thats extremely unhealthy for your body in the long run to be taking that kind of shit everyday it makes no sense by the time these kids reach adulthood theyre going to be more crazy than ever after being pumped full of that shit thier whole life wat a fuckin joke 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shamanistic Posted October 3, 2012 I got wrongly put on ritalin as a child and I believe it was a major factor in the amount I was getting in trouble at school. I refused to take it at 15 because I could see it was slowly but surely fucking with my life. I'm now at university studying engineering and I think my decision to stop taking ritalin has helped me get there. Moral of the story - Don't feed your kids amphetamines or analogs thereof everyday and expect things to improve </rant> 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whitewind Posted October 3, 2012 In 2011, News Ltd revealed that doctors were giving 1007 NSW children younger than six the drugs to control attention deficit hyperactivity disorder and, nationally, 52,528 youths aged under 16 were on the drugs. This is shocking. I'm stunned that so many children are given addictive, psychoactive drugs at such a young age - aren't they expected to go to prison when they reach a legal age and go hunting for the very things they were forced to take as a child? What the hell is going on? Is this ADHD real, and what exactly is causing it if it is? I tend to agree that food has a lot to do with it, the most likely cause sugar but there are so many weird additives to the shit that is fed to children it's really hard to pinpoint if this is the direct cause or some synergistic effect. Our society needs to step back and take a really serious look at what is going on here, this is unbelievable. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chnt Posted October 3, 2012 "any clinician who ignores the manufacturer's warnings and prescribes dexamphetamine (ritalin) to a child under six is inviting a law suit for negligence" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IndianDreaming Posted October 3, 2012 (edited) ^ Not now that it's approved... Edit: chopped out my rambling opinion... Edited October 3, 2012 by IndianDreaming Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auxin Posted October 3, 2012 Yeah diet seems to play a role, not just sugar and caff but also food dyes and probably some preservatives and chemical contaminants too. I have a vague memory of a paper saying dietary bacterial intake influences neurotransmitters, not surprising if true as our gut critters modify what we absorb quite a bit. Perhaps the food just being too sterile might be part? Bread has nothing but dead yeast now. No more healthy bacteria, not even in so called 'sourdough' (which is now white flour and yeast balloon bread dyed brown and spiked with malic acid). Same with store bought sauerkraut and kimchee, no bacteria in the process at all. It was disconcerting to discover that a single slice of my home made bread has more fiber than an entire loaf of "8 Grain" bread (which required food dye to make it a fibery brown color). But I doubt its diet alone. I've repeatedly heard "ADHD" people say they got some relief just by turning off the TV and radio and leaving them off. Permanently. Out of curiosity I turned on a TV and watched a bit- its all abrasive flashy lights, swirly things, shit flying at the screen, and yelling now. TV used to be like Mr. Rogers and Married With Children, shows that took their time to make a point or a joke, now its like a meth addled ping pong tournament is using the camera as the ball in a room full of neon lights. If I watched that for 8 hours a day I'd have adrenal burnout too. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Bowser Posted October 4, 2012 "any clinician who ignores the manufacturer's warnings and prescribes dexamphetamine (ritalin) to a child under six is inviting a law suit for negligence" ritalin is methylphenidate, adderall is dextroamphetamine but I agree that both are inappropriate for use in children under six... A rational scale to assess the harm of drugs in the "Lancet" (UK) found methylphenidate to be more harmful and addictive than use of MDMA, LSD, GHB, Solvents, and Amyl Nitrate, while amphetamine was found to be more harmful and addictive than cannabis, and the above listed drugs. And methylphenidate and dextroamphetamine are being used to treat ADD/ADHD in children, half of whom grow up to show no signs of ADD/ADHD most likely because they never actually had it to begin with! It was just easier to treat with a drug than helping parents/teachers effectively help children. Both are very commonly prescribe in the US for behavioral problems. The diagnostic criteria for ADD/ADHD include whether the child's behavior interferes with their learning in school. This means poor parenting or poor classroom supervision could led parents to believe their child has ADD/ADHD. Additionally many parents and child psychologists (US atleast) would prefer the medicated solution since it doesn't require ANY effort on behalf of the parent save popping pills in their child's mouth. Turning the TV and Radio off means they might actually be forced into meaningful interaction with their children (heaven forbid!) I'm sorry, but treating behavioral problems in children with addictive drugs (that have no long term studies in children) instead of consistent discipline and appropriate positive reinforcement is unethical. Not only are the children unaware of the side effects and other consequences of their drug use, but often the parents are uninformed or view drugs as an easier solution to consistent discipline and taking a true interest in their child's life and social development. I watched Louis Theroux's "America's Medicated Children" and it really summed up for me all the myriad reasons why this practice is alarming and disgusting. Anyone interested in this thread should watch... its available on Youtube... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shruman Posted October 4, 2012 "ritalin is methylphenidate, adderall is dextroamphetamine " Adderall is a mixture of dex & racemic amphetamine salts. The only good thing about it is that the kids rarely get the drugs because their parents are the ones taking them or selling them. In alot of cases it seems like a natural progression, sugar, coke, redbull, ritalin, meth... 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bogfrog Posted October 4, 2012 My mate's 8 year old is prescribed ritalin and its actually heart-breaking to see the difference in his behaviour when medicated compared to un-medicated :-( I don't think many families want to be giving their children drugs, but as soon as their kid is pegged as a trouble maker and is found to be distracting for the other students, there is often a huge pressure from the school and teachers to get those 'naughty kids' onto ritalin. In my mates case, the school refused to continue teaching the child unless he was medicated while at school. So another issue amoung a myriad of issues is the teacher's attitude towards hyperactive children. The kids themselves can be exceptionally understanding, but as soon as a teacher labels them as disruptive, the attitude of the whole group changes. We need to change our schools to fit our students instead of changing the students to fit the school. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
coin Posted October 4, 2012 (edited) exercise seems to be incredibly therapeutic with ADD/ADHD...maybe one of its causes is sedentarism. maybe you will find John Ratey's "Spark" program interesting www.johnratey.com Edited October 4, 2012 by coin Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhoenixSon Posted October 4, 2012 good teachers would help the situation a fair bit imho Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bogfrog Posted October 4, 2012 ^ One of the many reasons i'm training to be one of those good teachers. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ghosty Posted October 4, 2012 LOL. it's no different to so-called doctors peddling SSRI crap to almost everyone every chance they get. having said that, all the info people need to make the "wise" choice is available on the net and in books. seems to me only the ignorant and/or stupid will be victims of this. yes, children of "dumb" parents will be victims too, but they always have been in one way or another. it does raise the question though, why is this community so obsessed with stimulants?? can nobody feel good naturally anymore? it's all just another joke. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IndianDreaming Posted October 4, 2012 Bog: See if the school council will let you Jamie Oliver their diet!... It's good to see a plant head in education - my teachers were complete aliens and I've even met some of them years later and they're really strange individuals! Might be why I turned out weird, or maybe I weirded them Ghosty: A lot of people have become dependent on authority figures such as doctors and the govt. It's unfortunate, but they really don't know how to research these things for themselves, and they assume they're being told the truth. I do agree that the info is out there, but if something becomes accepted as the social norm - it takes a lot or research and devotion to get to the real truth - and most people don't have the time or will to dig, they just follow what's advertised as socially acceptable behaviour. I'm a coffee addict by the way - so you're bang on the head with the stimulant comment! Hypocrisy at its best, I'll do it, but it's not ok for my kids... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ghosty Posted October 4, 2012 i think all thats ok. i mean, i was like that too, taking trust in doctors and living in pain. when the problems became so bad it was a choice of putting a bullet in my head or doing something about it myself. now after having cured 3 serious issues that western medicine / doctors cant treat at all. i know to trust ME not anyone else. i think that in time others with medical issues / needs will come to the same conclusion. one of my problems i let doctors play with for over 2 years while i had no quality of life and was in unimaginable pain numerous times every day. when i HAD to fix it myself, i had it beat in 2 weeks. now been 4 years and still no problem. another issue was getting worse over about 3 years, and i fixed that in 15 minutes. when you relise that doctors about as useless as a human can be and it's up to you, it is amazing what you can do. the point being, when you are in THAT much pain. you MAKE the time =) as you have no choice. others will too, in time. on the coffee topic, im too in love of that stuff.. though i drink more decaff these days. it's the flavor i like about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Foo Posted October 4, 2012 There are alot of 90's kids who were wrongly perscribed these drugs as a child who are growing up. As one of them i know i would never give my kids any of that garbage. Soulsucking is the best way i can describe those meds Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ghosty Posted October 4, 2012 could not agree more =) they tried to put me on that stuff numerous times. for ASD. im aware that it does have a good side for others like me, but the negative aspect far outweighs any good (sound familliar). 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bogfrog Posted October 4, 2012 Bog: See if the school council will let you Jamie Oliver their diet!... It's good to see a plant head in education - my teachers were complete aliens and I've even met some of them years later and they're really strange individuals! Might be why I turned out weird, or maybe I weirded them Hey many of my teachers may have been aliens too, luckily for me some of them were angels instead. My goal is to work at a rudolf stiener kindergarten, so no jaimee olivering would even be neccessary.. They are pretty onto it at stiener, you see wee kids helping themselves to fresh greens and berries from the school gardens and feeding the hens, collecting the eggs. Its so cool seeing little 2-4 year old kids sitting down for cups of herbal tea. If there are so many herbs we can use to combat our own ailments, surely more time could be spent looking at which plants could assists children's concentration and attention-span, right? Ginkgo bibliola and gotu kola spring to mind instantly. But for now, i don't have any children to be experimenting with, and my lecturers at uni may nt approve of me testing various plants on other people's kids lol. I'll certainly be trying natural approaches with my own kids when they manifest though. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IndianDreaming Posted October 4, 2012 (edited) Damiana? We had a massive patch of periwinkle, we all used to sip the nectar from the flowers and rummage about in the leaves... I only just read on SAB that it's a nootropic... how interesting Edited October 4, 2012 by IndianDreaming Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
incognito Posted October 4, 2012 I think in a lot of case ADHD = shit parents. Some parents will point out there kid to me as being ADHD (usually uneducated, welfare dependant stoners) and I'm thinking this is just a normal kid doing what other normal 4&5 yr olds do, run mad looking for boundaries .maybee they r making to much noise and asking questions and trying to get ur attention because u sit on ur arse all day watching tv getting stoned. I've seen other parents who are obviously suffering from mental health issues claim their kids have ADHD, and want to get something to keep em quiet. I'm definAtely not saying there is no such thing as ADHD, but I do believe it's a very abused term. So glad I'm out of the social work gig now. Wheat is much less complicated than humans. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
whitewind Posted October 4, 2012 My daughter, she's nearly two now, she's got so much energy I really can't keep up mentally and emotionally. So I started doing stuff that I would normally do to get my head straight, and she came with me, doing a few hours straight walking in the bush. She loved it more than anything; there is so much to see, so many things to pick up, and at the end she is tired enough to sleep! It's stimulation she needs, and no matter how many toys or books you have it's not enough for an active child. I teach her about flowers and leaves, we can see the seasons change, lizards, insects, even Echidnas! But people take me to task over taking her bushwalking - the sun, the ticks, the snakes, all the hazards inherent in bushwalking. Yes, but it keeps me alert and happy and surely an open path is better than a boring walk along a polluted roadway or a fenced in park with a slide and a few swings? Bogfrog, my misses has a Steiner background and she's considering doing the teaching course so we can get our little one into the school (can't afford it otherwise). I think it's the best way to teach kids and I bet they never get any that suffer from ADHD or other mental illnesses created by our sick society. We both hated school and neither of us want our daughter to suffer the way we did.. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
incognito Posted October 4, 2012 I wanted to school my girl in a Steiner school as I think it's much more compatible with her personality than the public school system. However the Closest one has a 2 yr wait, by then she will be in yr 4. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bogfrog Posted October 4, 2012 Whitewind, thats really awesome you take your daughter for bushwalks! I may have had the typically stoned and somewhat absent-minded parents, but that never stopped me from going on big adventures in the forest alone. I was just extremely lucky that we lived in such a beautiful area, as i too had unhappy experiences all the way through school. I was a thoroughly depressed child by the age of 7 and my only outlet was exploring the forests, beaches, rivers and fields in the little town where we lived. If mother earth hadn't taken me in, who would have? There are few safe places in our world for sad, lost children. Stiener is almost certainly the way of the future for education, and i can't wait to play my role in something much bigger than me. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bogfrog Posted October 4, 2012 Hmm incog i was about to mention along those lines too, because the style & philosophy has become so popular there are huge waiting lists for most stiener schools. But if you can wait that long i would seriously reccomend sending her there for her school years. Im a cleaner at a stiener school, so every week i get to see what they are learning. They are studying stuff like sacred geometry, hyroglyphics, greek mythology & philosophy, the natural wonders of the world, science, pottery, gardening, animals, maori.. Every week, im just stunned and wish i went there! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
